THE "bottom" sorority
 

Hi everyone,
I have been lurking on here for a while. Most of you seem really nice and knowledgable so I finally decided to ask for advice. My daughter recently finished going through recruitment at a very competitive SEC school. Throughout the week, she was gradually dropped by a couple of sororities each round, but did have two left for pref night. I was very proud of her attitude that week. She kept an open mind, and tried to find things she liked about each chapter. I think what really hurt her was the fact that she knew many girls in four of the chapters from high school, and played on the same high school sports team as many of them. She wasn't best friends with any of them, but they certainly were on friendly terms; and these girls knew my daughter's reputation. I know ya'll are going to say that there are thousands of girls going through recruitment with the same qualifications as my daughter, and I understand that. However, she was just hurt that when it came down to it; the girls from her high school didn't fight for her.
Anyway, after pref night she really liked one house and really disliked the other. Of course she was devastated when she got a bid from the house she didn't like. That house had been at the bottom of her list all week. I think probably because she must have talked with one of the most awkward girls in the whole sorority. This same girl picked her up two nights, and my daughter said that this girl pretty much said nothing. My daughter had to carry the whole conversation and think of things to talk about. She went ahead and accepted the bid, and has gradually started to enjoy this sorority as she has gotten to know more of the girls. The problem is that this house has only been on campus for a couple of years, and it to me it seems like it is the laughingstock of Greek life. My daughter said that during recruitment she heard other girls talking about this house and that they would drop out of recruitment before accepting a bid from them- they had too much self respect to join that house! They are called the "rejects of recruitment" etc. etc... My daughter was actually embarassed to wear her letters the first week! I know many of the other new pledges felt the same way as my daughter because it was obvious on bid day that many of the girls were trying their best to pretend to be happy even though they weren't. I could tell that some of them were holding back tears.
Do any of you have any words of wisdom that I could impart to my daughter? As I said, she is starting to enjoy these girls. It is just difficult for them all to get to know one another because they do not have a house, and there is nowhere for them all to hang out and get to know one another.
Thanks for any advice.

So… TO YOU this sorority is the laughingstock of Greek life, and your daughter heard all of the rumors, and she's now starting to like her new sisters. I'm not really seeing a problem here.

My chapter didn't have a house, but we never found it difficult to hang out with one another. Your daughter and the rest of her pledge class will have to make an effort to be friends. Everyone does, whether they're in a sorority or not. A sorority doesn't equal *poof* BFFs forever ever! It takes time.

If your daughter and her pledge class all felt/feel the same way, maybe they should all get together and find a way to turn this chapter around. My best advice for them in this situation is to work their butts off to change their reputation and be the best chapter they can be. But regardless of what anyone else thinks of them, they're sisters. They need to recognize that and just enjoy being with each other.

Many thoughts, but here are a couple that may help. First, if it is an SE C university, the chapter WILL be getting a house. (Competitive housing is a must, and often the house will be new, large with ample opportunity for events and living in.). For now, she may have more opportunities to bond with other new members due to their weekly meetings and activities. She can reach out to some of them to see if they want to go for pizza afterwards or to a movie or other activity -- something outside of the planned sorority activities and impromptu or informal. The new member classes at SE C schools are huge. They meet regularly and are full of young women looking to make these new friendships. My hunch is that she can find and quickly make good friends with some new members, which in turn can make her feel good about her chapter.

I don't know the school in question, but for many schools each sorority is only one or two pledge classes away from improving their reputation for the better (or for worse.) A sorority at my school which was not highly regarded in my day is now among the top chapters on my campus. I would tell your daughter to "be the change that she wants to see." Tell her to be highly involved on campus -- student government, Panhellenic, etc., and to get to know and be friendly with as many people as possible. Tell her to help raise her sorority's profile. More than that, tell her to work on opportunities to increase a feeling of sisterhood among the members, because that will serve the members well in a number of ways.

Another thought to share is that her sorority has a long and honorable inter/national history. Her membership will extend long beyond her collegiate years and into alumna status. She is a part of a much larger picture.

Ding ding ding! This x 10!


By the way, you should read this recruitment story. Seriously. Everyone should. This just happened this semester, and it really puts things in perspective when it comes to having the not-so-perfect recruitment.

http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/sh...d.php?t=143724

HQs work hard to have colonies comprised of women who will want to make the chapter a success, but every single one -- due to amassing a very large group in a very short time -- will have some Annie Awkwards. Look past the Annies and focus on her new member sisters with whom she may have more in common (for no other reason than class standing and the common interests that come from that.)

Also, the sorority is "new" rather than "bottom". It hasn't been established long enough to develop a specific personality or heritage, so it is conveniently (rather than accurately) tossed by some into the pile of "no". It's a lazy, but sadly typical, response. Groups that were "new" several years ago at Bama and USC (South Carolina) have found their footing and have developed more positive reps as they mature. So another good action is to refer to herself as part of the NEW sorority on its journey, not the bottom sorority.

I'd also like to point out that you don't know that the women that she knew from high school didn't fight for her. They just may not have been enough. I fought hard to the point of tears for a friend that I have had for 40 years (I don't remember not knowing her), who is seriously amazing and crazy impressive with her accomplishments. She has been a more true sister to me than anyone in my sorority over the years. My sorority chose to cut her from rush.

I am saying this because you and your daughter should not resent these girls. You just don't know what goes on in membership selection.

Yes, yes, yes!!! They might have been in tears as they went to bat for your daughter-you don't know what happened and neither does your daughter. Nor will you-membership selection is secret.

You should be supportive of your daughter and her sorority. If her chapter has a parents club, join it. Go to Parents weekend. Do what you can to show your daughter how proud you are of her and her chapter. Send her a floral arrangement of the sorority flower (or in the sorority colors if their flower is hard to find) for initiation. Send her cookies in the shape of the chapter mascot.

Any new group has a hard time overcoming the "newness", but as the members get involved in other campus activities and the people who stubbornly cling to the old, established order discover all the smart, cute, sweet girls in the new chapter, things will shift.

If this chapter allows new members to join chapter committees, maybe your daughter can join the sisterhood committee. That committee usually plans activities for the chapter to do that build sisterhood. Things like chapter movie nights (they can probably use a ballroom in the student union), craft nights, potluck suppers, zumba class, salsa dance class, yoga, etc.

On the other side of amiblue's post, it could have been that once they got to college, they realized many of their high school friendships were those of proximity rather than of true emotional connection. "Friendly terms" isn't the same as being friends, and she simply may not have been someone they cared about enough to fight for or to risk their reputation fighting for. I know that sucks to hear, but it's a good lesson to learn, especially nowadays when "friend" has such a different meaning than it used to and so much fake intimacy exists, especially at that age.

This is a copout. There's no student center? No cafeteria? No local restaurants that are popular with students? If the colonizing sisters haven't thought of it, it's up to your daughter's pledge class to take the bull by the horns and say "we're all going to Applebee's every Thursday before the mixer" or what have you.

Also, as ASTalumna06 alluded, try not to put whatever you went through as a young adult onto her. This may be a good time to step away from everyone's perfect children becoming homecoming queen on Facebook.

This is also possible, but my point is that the OP and her daughter can't and won't know what happened. There's no point in harboring resentment over what may or may not have happened.

I agree. There's also the possibility that those girls didn't fight for her because they knew she'd be miserable and not fit in. At any rate, what's done is done.

For those saying that not having a house is not an obstacle, let me assure you that it is. I can tell which chapter and which school this is. It is NOT easy to find a place to "meet up" when there are over 100 in your new member class alone. I am not saying it means her experience won't be worthwhile, but not having a house makes it very difficult to have a "home base."

To the OP, maybe it would help for her to look at websites/Facebook pages of other chapters of her sorority. That could help her realize that it is more than just the microcosm of her University. There are places where girls would kill to wear her letters. Every single NPC has strong and weak chapters. At least she is enjoying her chapter sisters and hopefully her new member class can get involved on campus and with each other and make a dent in that tough "new sorority" label. In the end, your sorority doesn't make you top tier or bottom tier. Be a top tier person. Make people say, "she's an XYZ?"

Can you really truly get to know 100 girls even if you do have a house?

I don't think anyone is suggesting that it's not an obstacle, but getting to know your sisters without a house is entirely possible if you work at it.

Perhaps a private Facebook group for the pledge class would give them all a way to communicate and plan social events, study groups, etc.

ASTAlum, it is tantamount to social suicide on that particular campus not to have a house. It's part of the culture.

I don't think anyone ever said that she should be happy with the group not having a house or that they should stay unhoused. The point is that there are many other ways to meet and bond with people other than living in a house. You have to do extra work in this situation. It sounds like the daughter is willing to do so.

This is what matters now and then every where else in life.

No, Mom only said that the daughter was starting to enjoy the girls. And regarding your point, there may be some ways to bond but when it comes down to it, they will be rejected by many, many PNMs who want the sorority house experience.

33, my point is that getting to know members well may take a bit more effort. One way is to capitalize on the weekly meetings by having a "follow-on" such as asking some of her new sisters to go to dinner with her or get a pizza.

I would like to draw attention to my signature. Your daughter can make the letters. If she is such a great person, then she is a great representative of that sorority. One great (or horrible for that matter) pledge class can make a dent on reputation.

Also screw what ever others think of you. Who cares if you are a laughing stock of greek life if you like yourself, have great friends, a good sisterhood and a fabulous history/future. There are strong and weak chapters everywhere.

That's what I said. I was quoting you in response to carnation's very dramatic post. And to carnation - nowhere did I see that the daughter is deeply unhappy they don't have a house, feels robbed of the experience etc, she just wishes the sorority was looked upon more favorably.

It kind of slays me that young people will knock each other over to get to the latest technology and such, but when it comes to Greek life, new = bad.

It wasn't dramatic in the least; it was simple and true. 33, many GCers know the SEC Greek culture and we wouldn't dream of commenting on Pennsylvania Greek life. Please don't try to tell us how it should be down here.

Again, the OP didn't address the reputation of the chapter in relation to them not having a house. She asked how the sisters were supposed to get to know each other without one. I'm simply speaking to that.

With all due respect, people who aren't familiar with SEC Greek Life, up close and personal, really need to allow those who are to drive the conversation...

The big and beautiful Greek houses aren't just vanity splurges. They are a huge tool, not only for recruiting, but for bonding and sisterhood. Large chapters DO have trouble bonding if they don't have a home base. It isn't the be all and end all of the sorority experience, but it is important to chapter operations. We all can see how it impacts recruiting if everyone else has a house and your chapter doesn't. But, it us much more than that. Chapter members need a place where they will interact in normal situations - not just mixers or planned events. It isn't realistic to go have coffee or dinner with that many members. A house is tremendously helpful.

Exactly. No one is saying a chapter that participates in regular rush at such a school will be successful long term without a house. THEY WON'T. But the mother made it sound like it was impossible for any of them to gather - even a fraction of the members - without a house.

What are the chapter's plans? What's the timeline? Is there temporary housing? Perhaps everyone saying "you don't know how it is" should be a little more forthcoming, since apparently everyone and their ferret knows what school this is.

No one is saying that this isn't the case.

The fact is, the OP's daughter's chapter doesn't have a house, so she has to make the best out of what she's been dealt. I don't see where anyone is out of line in attempting to find solutions to make things easier. Making friendships in this situation will require work. It's a struggle for a new chapter to establish itself on any campus. The people here offering up ways for the daughter to connect with her sisters and suggesting that she try to put her best foot forward and be proud of her chapter don't seem to be out of line. And these things can be carried over to any school.

In the end, the daughter needs to try to get past the reputation, connect with her sisters, wear her letters with pride, and figure out a way to be happy in her new chapter, regardless of what others think. If she doesn't, then her collegiate sorority experience will drag and be terrible.. or she'll drop and be on the outside looking in. I'm willing to bet she wants neither of those situations to come to fruition.

The daughter already sounds like she's getting used to things and seeing past the rumors and gossip. From the mom's post, she made it sound like she was struggling with this more than the daughter. If that's the case, she needs to move past that and support her daughter and her chapter.

ETA: By the way, it wasn't known until the end of page 1 that this was even an SEC/competitive campus (because carnation figured it out), so people were speaking generally, rather than specifically to a post that read, "My daughter attends an SEC school with over 100 girls in her pledge class, and her chapter doesn't have a house and the PNMs don't want to join because of that.. blah blah blah". Instead, people were responding to the OP saying that her daughter was unhappy, she's warming up to the house, and her and her sisters are trying to figure out how to bond.

Let's just say that on an SEC campus with houses, a chapter that is not only unhoused but is unlikely to ever be housed is going to struggle. And it has been noted that on such campuses, some of these chapters (not this one, I hope) try to market themselves as the un-sorority for girls who never would've thought of becoming Greek. Since these girls often decide that attending most sorority functions is beneath them too, it does not end well and I really feel for involved girls who are caught up in this.

Are you OTL? The OP states competitive SEC school in the oriiginal post!

Definitely. I think that's why people are suggesting that the OP's daughter and her sisters should try to make the best of the situation and work hard to make the chapter the best that they can with who and what they have. :)

I don't know what OTL means…

And sorry, I must have missed that. But again, I don't think what anyone was saying was out of line with what the OP asked. They were still responding to this:

OTL - out to lunch

ANY social sorority at ANY school that markets itself as "the alternative" but rushes with the rest of the social sororities is not going to end well. What sounds like pride and happiness to the members who say it sounds like arrogance and/or defensiveness to the rushees and other Greeks who hear it. You can be quirky, but you still have to dig the things that are basic parts of being in a sorority.

I want to offer my apologies for lack of clarity. My suggestion had not been for the whole chapter to go to dinner (holy moly and not enough tables, Batman) but following a meeting seeing if perhaps a few (1 -10) might want to go eat or do something together.

The chapter is not gonna have a house...like ever? That sucks.

Uh, no. No one said that.

It was implied.

Ok, we should all stop posting. I think the OP has a few people in this thread she can private message who have experience with the SEC and perhaps know more about this particular, and seemingly special situation than the rest of us. Some of us have posted enough to out the chapter, and some of us are making statements that don't need to be made. Let's move on.

Then I don't get the back and forth about not having a house. Every sorority ever that has colonized needs time to figure out housing. It's expected. If they're gonna have a house soon then they'll have the same amenities the other houses have soon enough and won't be looked down on for that anymore.

I get meeting up w the entire chapter will be tricky until they move in but it's not like that's gonna be for that long. I'm guessing it shouldn't take much more than a year or so to get the house done and then they'll either be even or maybe PNMs will even think they're more attractive than other houses bc of the new house.

Granted I'm not at a SEC school and have no idea what campus this is. I also think someone mentioned that a sorority at a campus w necessary Greek housing that won't have a house will fail. Unsure whether that is talking about this campus or just a random example.

Look, the OP made a valid observation that because her daughter's chapter is unhoused, they find it difficult to hang out together and get to know each other. The first post in response made it sound like having a house is no big deal - that at the responder's college there were no houses and they hung out just fine. Well, that is apples and oranges. Then another poster said why can't they go to Applebee's or a campus center to meet up. Yes, they could do these things with a small group of sisters. But, in a massive chapter, this will never give them the kind of bonding they need for a strong sisterhood. It actually could likely lead to a cliquish atmosphere. I have been intimately involved with the colonization of an SEC chapter, and the transition from unhoused to housed. It presents the very challenge that the OP mentioned. (And lots of other challenges!)

I understand that you are struggling to follow the train of thought, because there is an undercurrent that isn't being posted. But please don't assume that this is just a temporary set back and everything will be great once this chapter gets a house that is newer and shinier than the others on campus. While that is sometimes or even usually the case, it isn't always, and may not be the case here.

It is just frustrating to read posters downplaying factors that are quite important. I know everyone means well, but bad advice and misinformation can result from interjecting into a situation where you have no first-hand experience.