Kappa Legacy Cut After Pref....Not Given Bid
 

Hi all,

I went through recruitment this week. My grandma was a Kappa at another school, and the chapter at my school was well aware of this. I was invited to Kappa's Preference round and ranked them 1st afterwards. On bid day I received a bid from another house.

My question is that, in Kappa's bylaws it states that any legacy, including granddaughters, that is invited to pref must be placed on the bid list before the quota mark. So I believe I should have gotten a bid from Kappa. Does anyone have any idea what could have happened? Is there anything I can do?

I have many friends in the chapter and they all were shocked on Bid Day too. Everyone assumed that I'd ranked another house first and that's why I wasn't given a bid.

QFP

Your grandma needs to get on the horn with Kappa HQ and ascertain that the policy is as she remembers it.* There is also a thread on here discussing how sororities are no longer given a flat quota number, rather a quota range.







*(sorry, Kappa HQ)

From Kappa's Website:
"A Kappa legacy is defined as a sister, daughter, granddaughter or great-granddaughter of an initiated member. While step-relatives, cousins and nieces are not legacies, we recognize they may have special knowledge of and interest in Kappa Kappa Gamma and encourage our chapters to get to know these women who have a connection to the Fraternity."


So yes, I'm considered a legacy.


Also From Kappa's Website:
"If the legacy is invited to the preference round, her name must be included on the bid list, above the quota break"


So yes, I should have been on the bid list.


Am I correct on these things or am I missing something? Any Kappas out there that could help?

Quota is not determined until all PNMS have ranked and signed their MRABAs. We are now given a quota range and not a solid quota number. So rather than submitting an "A" list and "B" list, most groups are instructed to simply rank in order of preference or scores.

I have seen a recent quota range of 32-40 with a final quota of 35 noted on Bid Day.

I couldn't find the legacy quote on the public pages of the Kappa Kappa Gamma website. Is it in the members only section?

The issue that I can spot is the quota range. If you were ranked below the lower end of the range, would you ask the chapter to remove another woman who'd been issued a bid and was ranked higher than you, in order that you as a legacy receive a bid? This could get really sticky and tricky.

Did you accept a bid from the other chapter you preferenced?

I found those quotes from the membership reference form on their website. Here's a link to it if you'd like: https://www.kappakappagamma.org/kappa/reference/

I'm not sure about this quota range, but I think according to their legacy policy I still should have been placed at the top and gotten a bid. What do you/others think? And yes, I was unfortunately given a bid to another chapter.

Like others have said, I think the phrasing "above the quota break" could leave room for interpretation if a quota range is given.

If you and your grandmother want to proceed with disputing this, your grandmother needs to call Kappa Headquarters and attempt to get things straightened out. If you go down that path, can see this getting very complicated very quickly.

My 2¢: Do you really want to be that person who tried to use a technicality to push herself into a house that didn't want her as much as she wanted it? I wouldn't. I would rather be at the house that obviously wanted me than the one that obviously didn't.

FWIW, you were not "cut". You were on the bid list - the question is where.

Having seen this happen before in my group ( and very recently with a double legacy to the chapter in question), I would venture they may have failed to mark you as a legacy in the system and therefore you weren't placed on the first list. Quota Range would be irrelevant if you were flagged as a legacy. Your grandmother should contact the regional/province recruitment person over the chapter in question.

That is a good point, Titchou. Did your grandmother send in the appropriate paperwork to confirm your legacy status? Anyone can claim legacy, but all groups have ways for legacies to prove their status.

Not to add fuel to the crazy fire, but this would be my guess as well. I would imagine that the best practice in the era of quota ranges would be to place the legacies at the very top of the list in the first place.

That being said:
A) I agree with everything that everyone else said about the cost vs. benefit of contesting this.

B) We have no idea how many legacies this chapter was dealing with at Preference. Hypothetically, that is another variable.

C) Even if a mistake were made on the part of this chapter - is Panhellenic bound in any way to rectify the placement? Your placement with your current chapter bumped someone else who is now in yet another chapter, and so on. What about binding agreements and your bid with your current chapter? I don't know what the NPC protocol is for something like this, but I could easily see Panhellenic saying "too bad".

My senior year,
 

when I was a rush counselor, a double legacy to a chapter(with a sitting sister no less and mom a nat'l officer) wound up with a bid to another chapter. Work was done behind the scenes and double leg. was able to be a pledge to her legacy chapter, which put the chapter over quota by one. This was before QAs.

What was done, I don't know. I would imagine that the legacy chapter had to pay some sort of fine, or agree to take one less pledge the following year, and the bidding chapter probably was allowed to replace the legacy. So things can get messed up and later rectified, although I would imagine it is exceedingly rare.

addendum: I mistakenly omitted that whatever deal was struck was between the national officers/headquarters of the two chapters, FSU panhellenic, and the two local chapters.

Interesting- and this happened in the days or weeks after bid day?

Bid day and the day after.

Wrote a response last night but fell asleep. Others have articulated some of the contents of that post.

Bottom line: you drop your current chapter, and you go through recruitment next year. Be aware that you may well have a stigma of sorts attached to you due to the events of this recruitment. We (sorority members) aren't elephants (or eggplants), but we do have long memories, and this will probably be in some peoples' minds next year. However, it seems that membership in Kappa is your goal, so with that in mind, act accordingly.

Just be willing to accept the consequences and pay the costs. That's all. I wish you good luck. The situation as you've described it is problematic and I don't see any quick or easy resolution, especially since more than a day has passed since bid day.

As for the other chapter, given your "unfortunately" remark, I don't see the benefit of asking you to give them a chance.

OP - Is there any possible chance that your grandma didn't meet the requirements of a Kappa in good standing? Or whatever language they use? Just trying to think through technicalities.

If you have friends in the chapter you should definitely let them know that you had ranked them first. They can start the ball rolling from inside the chapter. But take note that unless one of your friends happens to be the President or VPM they are unlikely to know where you fell on the bid list.


I'm also wondering if an email is a good idea or not to explain your situation. Basically you want all parties involved getting the same info. Email "To" the President and VPM of the local Kappa chapter, the President and VPM of the campus Panhel, and your Rho Chi. "CC" your grandma, the President and VPM of the chapter from which you got a bid, the campus Greek Life / Sorority advisor.


If the Kappa chapter doesn't jump through hoops to properly claim you, then my advice is to pull an Elsa and let it go.


Lastly, time for some introspection, is there anything that you may have done that would have caused them to pull you from the bid list or at least drop you down to the bottom? It likely would have required last minute approvals but think hard about it. Is there anything they could have learned about between when Pref invites were issues and before Bid lists were delivered to Panhel that would have caused them any concern?

I sincerely hope that you did not accept your bid to the chapter that offered it to you. If you did, I hope that you will terminate your pledge immediately. I really am not being snarky. I think it will be for the best all around.

Just throwing out the possibility that the unfortunately bit is tied to her disappointment at not getting a Kappa bid and not a true reflection of her thoughts of the chapter that did bid her. I really think that without tone of voice that sentence could be read either way. I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt.

Let. it. go.

You want to go to all this trouble to join a chapter that didn't want you as much as they wanted other women on their bid list? You want to be the NM they were forced to take because you were a legacy?

Let it go.

I meant "unfortunately" as in I know that by accepting a bid to a different chapter and signing a MRABA, that I'm not legally allowed by Panhel to just switch into Kappa, whereas if I hadn't accepted a bid, then Kappa could have potentially just added me to the quota. No need for the harsh comments. But thank you to the others who offered advice!

Not exactly correct.

Actually, if you listed both chapters on your MRABA, and one chapter offered you a bid, you're bound for a year regardless of whether you accepted it or not. That's how this works. The language is clear.

If you had ISP'ed (only listed Kappa) even though you attended two parties, you wouldn't be eligible for a quota addition. However, you would have been eligible for COB after recruitment ended, IF Kappa or another chapter was below total and was participating in COB. Considering Kappa met their quota, this probably won't happen/wouldn't have happened.

If Kappa was your only invite, THEN you would have been a quota addition.

Just trying to help you see your options clearly. This is kind of complicated.

ETA: If I screwed this up, PLEASE someone tell me so I can fix this. I am trying so hard to be accurate.

AZTheta you are correct. I suspect the OP understands the gist of the policy even if she didn't phrase it accurately. She "gets" that by listing both chapters, signing the MRABA, and ending up with a bid to the other chapter blocks her from Kappa snapping her or COBing her later.

^^^ yay me! I finally got it right? Holy COW. I can't read into what people mean when they write, I get too confused.

So when she wrote "switch into Kappa" I was like "no, no, no - doesn't work that way".

Just to clarify, this IS your grandmother by blood or legal adoption, right? (I'm assuming it's your dad's mom, since you didn't mention being a legacy through your mom) Grandpa's wife #2 who is not your dad's mom would not be considered your grandma, the way KKG phrases it.

Yes sorry for the confusion--I know how MRABA/COB/snap bids work I just phrased it incorrectly! And yes, it's my dads mom.

This. I wouldn't drop to join this chapter, even if it is my legacy chapter. They messed up, either deliberately (to avoid taking a legacy that they don't want) or through carelessness. Either way, it doesn't reflect on them in a positive way.

You may have dodged a bullet. Make the best of the chapter that bid you and forget about those girls. It's their loss.

Sometimes these things have a way of working out for the best in the long run, even if it doesn't seem so at the time. While it is nice to continue the legacy tradition, it in no way should diminish the opportunity you actually do have. And depending on how recently this all happened, you may well be able to still accept the bid you were offered.

I'm sure this really sucks for you since you were so certain how this was all going to work out, but it might be time to make lemonade, so to speak.

I am guessing with her post centering so on legacy status, not to mention finding direct quotes, she would have mentioned if mom was in another group, went to college and didn't join etc etc.

Wait.. I thought we established in another recent thread that if a PNM SIPs, then she's still eligible for a snap bid, but not a quota addition..? Or maybe it was the other way around?

Women that ISP are eligible for snap bids. It's just a huge roll of the dice.

From the MOI, 18th edition (it's a sticky at the top of this page, ladies):

"If the preferential bidding system is used, women who indicate an intentional single preference and do not receive
an invitation to membership are eligible for snap bidding and COB, but they are not eligible to be a quota addition."

Ah, damn. I screwed up. So much for patting myself on the back. :o :(:mad:

I should like to retreat to a corner and lick my wounds.

ETA Should I fix my post which contains misinformation?