May I have your thoughts?
 

Hello everyone! I've been lurking around GC for a little while now, probably about a year, and have finally decided to post something and hopefully get some helpful feedback! :)

I'll be attending a new university this fall after graduating with my AA from a small state college. I had originally planned on attending the branch campus of a very large/southern/well-known university in the next town over from me but have since changed my mind. The quality of the education there would have been amazing but the fact that it was a small branch campus made the student/campus life almost non-existent. Plus, the hour long drive and no on-campus living options make it a bit of a struggle in my eyes! I started to research the other, much bigger state university that's located a couple hours from me and really liked what I saw as far as academics, student life and campus activities are concerned. I made the decision to transfer there instead and I'm really excited for this new chapter in my life.

SO here's where I could the advice of all you lovely GCers! There's Greek Life at this university! The thought makes me extremely excited but extremely hesitant at the same time. I'm not sure what to do, so I'm coming to you for help.

I am not your typical PNM in several ways. First of all, I'm quite a bit older than the average girl going through recruitment. Compared to most girls, I'm probably considered ancient. The thought of being older than the other PNMs, as well as probably most everyone in any of the chapters, does not bother me. I've always been able to connect easily with people of all ages, both younger and older than me, and make friends with a variety of people. Secondly, I'm transferring in as a junior, not a freshman. And thirdly, my overall GPA is really not that impressive. You're probably all thinking that I may as well not even bother, but I'd like to explain and have your feedback, if you wouldn't mind?

I went to college straight after graduating high school with several scholarships and countless hours of community service under my belt. I grew up dancing competitively, competing in beauty pageants, horseback riding, sports ... You name it, I did it. I was originally going to attend a university out of town and rush with my friends, but my life circumstances changed very dramatically before that could happen. My mom was struggling pretty severely with her health and I was terrified of leaving town and not being there close to her so I ended up staying in town and attending the local community college. I attended for 4 semesters total - did GREAT for two and really struggled the other two. Between my mom's failing health and the emergence of my own health issues, I was just so stressed that I couldn't focus. I wound up dropping out halfway through my 4th semester to get the help that I desperately needed but unfortunately, I racked up a few Fs and Ws before that. My GPA suffered as you can probably imagine. Fast forward a few months and I was out of treatment, healthy and glowing and ready to take on the world again! Or so I thought. Long story short, I ended up taking several YEARS off school to "get healthy" and all that. During this time, I moved several states away to live with some relatives near the beach. The family thought it would be good for me to get away and see something besides the town I grew up in and they were right! I haven't even considered going home in the years that I've been here and I absolutely think that taking time off school for myself was the best thing that I could have done. Don't worry, my mom is doing GREAT these days. :)

So ^that really worries me when I think about going through recruitment. I went back to school and completed my AA this past May and have made excellent grades and have been super focused. My GPA this last semester was a 3.7, which I am quite proud of. However, even as well as I've done lately, it can't erase the past! My overall GPA from when I first started college to now is a little disappointing. I've done my best and have worked extremely hard to pull it up. I just wonder if it's going to be enough?

I grew up always thinking that joining a sorority would be something I would do, along with my friends. Obviously, I didn't have that opportunity before and I honestly didn't think I ever would again. All of the sudden, there's an opportunity knocking and I really want to open the door! I'm so cheesy, I know, but seriously! The school I'll be attending has a very small Greek presence on campus. I believe there are just 4 chapters. If this school was a huge southern school, I wouldn't even dream of rushing. I'm sure I wouldn't have a chance and that's okay! But I really feel like giving it a shot here.

For what it's worth, I do have a couple of recs to two of the chapters and am working on the other two. I have been doing some volunteer work and community service over the last few years as well. I feel like I have a likeabe personality and like I said before, I make friends and connections relatively easily and am fairly outgoing when it's appropriate. I feel like I at least owe it to myself to TRY and go through recruitment, even though I have some things stacked against me. If I don't do it, I'll never know right?! I so badly want the "full university experience" and to make the most out of my remaining years. I know for many girls, Greek life is a huge part of that and it's the same for me! I've watched my cousins and friends experience the joys of sisterhood and everything that comes with it and I want it so bad!

Sorry, I know this is really long! Thanks for reading to the end and thanks in advance for any advice you have to give. I don't mind honesty for sure, please don't just tell me what you think I want to hear. I know that rushing at my age and with my past is out of the ordinary.

Am I completely out of my mind or do you think I ought to give it a shot?

How old do you mean when you say "quite a bit older"?

tl/dr

GPA plus class standing plus age may yield a lack of invitations after open house round. But you won't know unless you try.

Much of this depends on the school itself. Without revealing any information about the school on this thread, think through the following questions. 1.) When you have been on campus, have you seen other non-traditional students on this campus? 2.) As far as Greek life goes, do the chapters have houses? And do all of the women live in? 3.) Are the chapters diverse socially, ethnically, personality-wise?

Within two hours drive of me, there are 4 campuses with Greek life. One is very competitive and traditional, sophomores often have difficult recruitments. Another is a small private college with only one chapter with no dwelling. The third is a large campus with a small Greek system. They do bid quality upperclassmen who do transfer to campus.The fourth is a small commuter school with a handful of chapters without houses. They often bid non-traditional students. It's not uncommon to have a new member or two who are already 21.

So your situation largely depends on the campus you will be attending. Best wishes to you!

Do you know anyone at this school who's a member of a sorority or a fraternity?

What on earth state university in the South has only 4 sorority chapters? (For that matter, what on earth state university ANYWHERE has only 4 sorority chapters) If you mean "public university" then word it as such.

I can think of two off the top of my head in just Alabama alone and I don't know the south all that well.

It's just when someone says a "state university" I think flagship (i.e. Alabama, LSU etc). Tomato - tomahto.

Thanks for the replies! Yes, to clarify I suppose I mean "public" university, not STATE university. This school has a student body of about 13,000 - so not huge but not tiny either. Upon further research, I've discovered that there are actually five chapters on this campus. As for location, I'm not technically considered "Deep South," but close enough to the border of another state that we might as well be! The big schools in my state are known for having competitive recruitments.

I've been looking on the websites and social media platforms to look at photos and get a feel for the girls. Yes, I have seen a LOT of diversity, which is awesome! There are women of color in every chapter and many that don't seem to fit the typical sorority girl "look." If there truly is such a thing, I feel like I look more like your typical sorority girl than many of the girls I've seen in photos. As for my age ... I just turned 25. I'll graduate at 27 if all goes according to plan. However, I do not and have not ever "looked" my age. People will ask and seem utterly shocked when I tell them and exclaim that they were SURE I was in the 20-21 range and can't quite believe my actual age. Which is great for me in a lot of ways I guess! So as far as "looking the part" and fitting in with the sisters if I were to receive a bid, I'm honestly not worried about that. And I know many people caution older PNMs about Greek life and ask that they consider the parties and social atmosphere and whether that is an atmosphere they could see themselves in/whether they are in different stages of life, etc .... and I'm totally great with that part too. Like I said in my OP, because of my health issues and family situation, I honestly didn't get to "experience" college like most kids do right out of HS. I've never been a huge partier when it comes to drinking but I definitely love to have a good time and this part of Greek life is appealing to me. In fact, ALL parts are appealing to me.

There are no houses on campus, just dorm floors and suites I think. I would be living off campus about 2 minutes away in my own apartment. Maybe this is worth mentioning too - one of the chapters is a new colony and is participating in formal for the first time this fall. This is also one of the chapters to which I have a rec.

I too thought flagship since the OP stated she had decided against the branch campus. Without identifying the school, success will futn on the criteria SK cited above.

When I hear "state university," I think the opposite of flagship. "State university" = schools like Illinois State, Alabama State, Eastern Illinois University, Southern Missouri State.

But agreed -- if the campus Greek culture is laid back, OP could get a bid from a group. In many places, it's going to be tough, but she won't know until she tries.

From what I can see, it is pretty laid back. The university itself is an anchor of the city, so it is largely a commuter university and they have a lot of non-trad students on campus. I am pretty good friends with one girl in one of the chapters and she did say that it was "pretty competitive" but that my age didn't matter, lots of older girls rushed, and she is encouraging me to try - which I'm HOPING means that someone like me would be welcome in her chapter.

Could it be that she is just being polite and doesn't want to hurt your feelings?

Oh that's very possible! We aren't best friends by far and maybe not good enough friends that she would have said anything else. I'd like to think not, but you never know. This particular girl, I have learned, is also a counselor this year, and still encouraging me to go for it. I haven't spoken to her since finding this out of course.

I'll be honest, no matter the culture of the school, I think 25 is too old. You will be bossed around by 19 year olds, and by the time you graduate, you will be almost 10 years older than the average PNM.

Do you think my age will bother the girls? Because it doesn't bother me one bit. I don't really see it as someone who is "younger" than me "bossing" me around. I have no problem respecting authority, and that's what it is to me - a group where some members have more authority than others, and their authority is earned. I can't say with absolute certainty since I haven't been in a sorority before, but I just can't see this being a problem for me at all. I've been in other situations (school, work, extracurricular) where there have been people younger than me in places of authority over me and it has never once phased me. That's life, ya know? I can respect someone's authority no matter what their age is .

Since states have a variety of set-ups, this varies widely from state to state. Where I live, "state university" and "public university" mean the same thing—a university established and supported by the state—and there is no such thing as a "branch" university.

Skimming the thread, this part caught my eye.

If you were to get a bid, what are your feelings on possibly being told you must live in the sorority dorm the next year?

Dorm suites usually don't hold the whole chapter. Plus if it's largely a commuter school, many other rushees are probably in the same boat.

If the school really is as commuter heavy as she says, that may not be the case.

Well hopefully that doesn't happen because I have a rescue chihuahua from the animal shelter where I volunteer, so off-campus housing is a must! :D anyway, like the poster above me said, there isn't much in the way of on-campus housing for upperclassmen as it is. I believe they require freshman to live in so that limits the space available for others. I suppose if it really came down to it and in order to accept the bid I had to commit to living in, then my decision would be made for me. I honestly don't see that happening though!

IMHO
 

An older, upperclassman transfer with a not-so-great g.p.a.? I'd pursue other activities, if I were you.

Yeah thanks, I'm planning on being super involved on campus no matter what the results of recruitment are! :)

Yes, I think it will bother them. Freshmen are uncomfortable around seniors, for example. It may not bother you but that isn't the relevant or deciding factor. Honestly, it sounds like you want to be told to go through and yes, you'll get a bid. We can't tell you that. The only thing for you to do is try, and be prepared for whatever the outcome is. I wish you good luck!

Do be sure to check out GPA requirements for the chapters also. Many times PHAs will say they do not have a GPA requirement to participate in recruitment. However, individual organizations do have required GPAs, and sometimes chapters have even higher cut offs than their national/international organizations require. I don't know how low your GPA is, but if it's below 2.5, your options will be limited.

Noted, thank you :)
I'm definitely not just looking for you all to tell me what you think I want to hear. I am very serious about pursuing this opportunity because I finally have a chance to! I'm not an idiot, I know that there are more things working against me than for me. I'm okay with this. I just want to try because if I DONT try, I'll really won't have the chance ever. I'm confident that I can go in and sell myself and give it all I've got and hope for the best.

Since last night, I've made the final decision to go ahead and register and get my recs sent in and commit to recruitment. Going in with a completely open mind and prepared to not receive a bid had ALWAYS been my plan. I think receiving one would be amazing and a great start to the rest of my college career. If I don't get one, it'll be okay, I'll definitely find my place. I'm going into a creative/artistic programs and I'm positive that there will be clubs and things to do within that, as well as campus wide activities and ways to get involved. So I guess with that all being said, any advice/direction that you ladies feel like giving that relates to my situation would be welcomed and very much appreciated!

And I mean, anything that you all feel like telling me, I'll listen to with an open mind and take it all with a grain of salt. So far I feel like I've gotten some nice feedback, so I thank you all for your replies.

It's definitely not even close to below 2.5! I've worked very hard the last 4 semesters and have pulled it up an entire point from where I started. It exceeds the national minimums for every chapter on campus. I actually just double checked to make sure.

I have nothing more to contribute to this thread, except to say that I hope you either don't know what this phrase means, or that you accidentally used it in the wrong context. Please don't take what everyone here says with a grain of salt! :)

LOL, using phrases in incorrect contexts is definitely a specialty of mine! Wouldn't be the first time. I don't mean that I'm going to take every piece of advice that I'm given skeptically. Not at all. What I mean is that I'm going to hear what everyone has to say and consider it seriously, yet maintain my own thoughts and not let the odd negative comment turn me off from the idea of recruitment. Some of you have been encouraging and some of you haven't, and that's totally okay. I asked for honestly and I'm pleased that I received it! :) My decision to go forward with recruitment wasn't based on the messages that I got here by posting my story. I consider every reply helpful and I only feel better about my decision.

NOW, since I've officially decided! Is there anything that anyone can offer advice-wise about the actual process of recruitment?! I've read countless stories and have been doing research for years, but I know nothing can honestly prepare you for something like this except experiencing it for yourself. Because I'm non-traditional, are there certain things I should/should not say? A certain way I should present myself that is different from what your typical PNM would do? I want to maximize my chances, obviously, so any ideas are greatly appreciated. I've got a mentor (one of my recs actually) who is already helping with outfits and all that jazz. She's been amazing! Anything else?

You need to come up with an answer to why you are going out for recruitment - subtext is they really what to know "OMG! What is a woman your age doing here??????" because that's the way they've already asked themselves. But they'll put it to you ever so politely.

Got it, thanks :)

At my university (private school, but sounds like the greek life environment is roughly similar), I saw firsthand one case in particular of an older (at least 23?) new member. She really was a good person, but our chapter was not the right environment for her. Like Irishpipes said, it was difficult for her to be "bossed around" by people years her junior, who valued very different things than she did.

My husband joined his fraternity at 23, and by the end of his college career, he wanted his degree and wanted to start his "real life"- a lifestyle he had already lived once before he went back to school. While he has a very independent personality, I think anyone (including myself, to be honest) is tired of certain things by the time you graduate college and have reached a certain level of maturity. You may (or may not) be more mature than these girls, and putting up with the immaturity can be difficult.

But, you don't know until you try- if you have your heart set, go for recruitment and get the feel of the chapters.

^Yeah, I think at this point in my life, it may not be a reality to join at this age. And that's okay, I just want to give it a go and find out for myself! I do feel like I have a lot to offer a chapter and id like to pursue the opportunity. If it doesn't work out in my favor, I have a lot of other activities to get involved with. :) I appreciate your insight.

You had a parent with severe health issues. It forces you to grow up in certain parts of your life far earlier than you need to. You need to go back and catch up on that young adulthood you didn't get to have. I completely understand and while I understand that people are trying to prepare you for perhaps not receiving a bid, everyone just flat out saying "you're too old" needs to STFU. Because honestly, you have no idea what this is like. Parenting a parent (which you do end up doing to a degree) is something you're supposed to be doing at 50, not at 20.

Wow, thank you. You hit the nail on the head. Without giving too much about my situation away, you're right about "parenting a parent" and having to give up parts of my young adulthood too early. And as a direct result of HER issues, my own came into the picture. Had it not been for all that, I'm sure I would be a happily graduated alumnae of XYZ by now. But life wasn't all that nice to me over the last 6 or so years and I would give anything to get some of that time back. If being the oldest person in my chapter is the biggest worry, I'll take it! I promise you, to me ... it's all worth it.

So true!
Follow your heart...if you don't, you'll always wonder "what if?"

For the record....it's no easier at 50.

The OP asked for honest input. Telling people to STFU when they are offering input (whether positive or negative or in line with your own personal views) is counter-productive at best, and frankly, not respectful. There are a variety of opinions on this thread as on any other thread. I myself have not said that she is too old; I have simply responded to the best of my ability based on her own statements.

There are no do-overs in life; we all face challenges at different times. While we may regret some of our choices, they are what they are, and we have the choice to accept life on life's terms, or not. We can make the best of what's in front of us today, or not.

I will continue to wish her good luck.

You don't know what I understand and what I don't. I also don't need you telling me to STFU. I have no idea why you are so unbelievably rude. The OP wanted honest feedback. 18-21 year old young women are in charge of membership selection, and many if not most of them will NOT understand her situation. It really doesn't matter if I understand it, they won't, and they get to choose.

May I lane swerve in tiny font? Is it possible that instead of making age the central factor, and telling people they won't be wanted, you can address varying campus cultures? Some NPC 18-21 year olds will be welcoming and some (many? most?) will not.

For instance, NPHC collegiate chapters tend to accept a range of ages because of how we view membership and lifetime commitment. However, there are some chapters that would deny someone over a certain age for a number of reasons (including a large applicant pool and 25 year olds are outnumbered by accomplished 18-20 year olds). This is based on chapter culture and campus culture despite the larger NPHC culture.

/lane swerve

Well, if you would prefer, she has already stated that she is bordering the deep south, and obviously her campus utilizes recs. This means it is not entirely uncompetitive. I am also pretty sure I know what school she is talking about. But, until you have been through a formal recruitment with a 19 year-old measuring your shorts length and demanding that you wear more flair, you don't know what it is like to be beholden to minutia that a 26 year old would likely find ridiculous. I am not criticizing the OP or wishing her ill. She has already stated she is doing it anyway. I am just saying 1) she will have a rough go getting a bid, and 2) if she gets a bid, it might not go as she hopes. I have loved my collegians that I have advised, but they drive me CRAZY too. They are young and inexperienced and find different things important. I remember when I preffed my choices for pledge mom (big sister) back in the day, I didn't even rank any of the seniors I knew because I felt they were ancient compared to me (I was 17 as a freshman.) Fair or not, it is how some will feel about her. I am sure some will love and embrace her.

Very good points, well stated. Thank you. In future I will include a reference to campus culture. We all know about assumptions - right?

Carry on.