Indiana University - NPC predictions
 

Let's start the insanity!

- Do you think all 4 groups will want to colonize?

- There have been 3 new colonies/chapters added in the last 3 years. Do you think there will be a stacked expansion?

- What will happen first: All 26 NPCs have chapters at IU, or IU changes its recruitment system/format?

- Do you think having more unhoused chapters will help those chapters during recruitment, or will it separate them further from the housed chapters in PNMs' minds?

Discuss!

I don't know if the 4 groups not currently on campus will colonize, but I do know that the Greek Life director/office has stated that they would like all 26 NPC organizations on campus by 2020 (or 2024 at the latest).

I think that the more unhoused groups come on without CONCRETE housing plans with a CONCRETE date, the more 2 separate Greek systems will take shape (that includes the unhoused/not housed on campus land fraternities). As it is now, a girl with max pref options could consist of all unhoused groups and lots of rushees will not like that.

I completely agree, and I don't think the other groups will necessarily have any interest in being a part of that.

The problems at Indiana are entirely of their making. Let them solve it on their own. Don't expect other NPC groups to come on campus and fix it for you.

Why does the house make an experience? With the addition of D Phi E, Alpha Sigma Alpha, and Theta Phi Alpha colonizing with good numbers and being able to have similar sized new member classes, they seem to be doing fine owning the fact that they are unhoused. I am sure if the remaining 4 groups are OK colonizing at Indiana without a house, they too will be successful in their own right. Who is everyone to judge their experience without a house?

Even with the addition of 4 more unhoused chapters, unless Indiana makes the change to Quota / Total, too many women will still be without a house. AND I am sure many women would rather be in a SORORITY at IU than not.

Do the current unhoused groups have concrete plans for housing in the near future?

Are you familiar with the situation concerning bed rush at IU? Have you read the previous IU threads?

I'm hoping that the times have changed enough at IU that our experience will be different than it was in the 1990s. However, even if they get rid of bed quota, not having a house on a campus where most of the groups have large and beautiful houses is usually not a point in a group's favor.

All 26 will be represented before IU changes from bed rush BUT chapters will slowly start going over their totals by a few each year. "We're not changing the rules, but we ARE going to let 5 seniors (or some other ridiculously small number) live out. And inevitably when it turns out the sky doesn't fall because of 5 seniors living out, it will move to 10, to 20 to the majority of seniors living out.

I personally think there is a place for unhoused chapters as a counterpoint to the uber-exclusion of the chapter houses now and they will continue to succeed, providing they maintain high standards and keep a very visible social profile. But in the next 10 years, one could fail and people will see it as a sign that it was NEVER going to work. But then the sun will rise again and the other unhoused chapters will be just fine. I'm not pointing fingers at anyone in particular. You can't expect all this growth and have 100% success.

I thought one of the groups not at IU already turned down a chance to colonize there. Just because the school wants all 26 doesn't mean it is calling all of the shots.

Yes, at least 1 has said no recently.

And another (I assume we're talking of 2 different ones) has stated they will not even present unless they have a guarantee of a house.

Define "house". Are we talking comperable housing to the current houses groups, dorm wings, or townhouses?

I'm pretty sure they said comparable on campus house.

I hope the last 4 wait and this makes the school fix the issues they are having first. Yes it would be nice to have all 26 on one campus but I think we in to do it in a way that it is going to be successful and last.

This.

They're obviously adding more chapters in order to keep the recruitment process the way it is now. Even if they add more/all 4 additional chapters, they're going to continue running into the same problems they are now.

ETA: I'm imagining the potential disaster of getting all 26 NPCs then changing to a quota/total system. How many chapters would close.....

Actually, none of the chapters would. All 21 chapters made quota (or higher), with 317 women who didn't match. That means 1319 women attended preference and signed a bid card, meaning quota with all 26 NPCs would've been ~50. If you added in the number of women who didn't match, quota would've been ~62. Still a very average to slightly above average PC size. IU has the PNM interest to sustain all 26 unless the PNM pool drops or PNMs decide to shun a specific chapter or chapters.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are the unhoused chapters somehow less "exclusive?" I know that many PNMs may have chosen to rank unhoused groups last because they preferred to have a house, but as the recent recruitment stories have shown us, even the unhoused groups were making some brutal cuts. As far as there being a "place" for unhoused groups, I can't possibly imagine any NPC being okay with being second tier on this campus for such a concrete reason as lack of housing. If IU wants to offer students an alternate greek experience, they should look outside of the NPC. We will have to wait and see what the future brings, but it is my belief that current groups are simply waiting to ensure years of stability before they begin investing in comparable housing.

But then you get a chicken and egg situation. When rushees are saying "I really liked ABC but I want to live in a house"- how can they get stronger with that mindset? And as discussed before, if you market yourself as not having a house as being a positive, then you get the kind of members who might not want to do other things affiliated with IU Greek life either.

This is mainly what I'm thinking. You can't add more chapters in the current recruitment system, claim it's working, and then change the way recruitment operates and think that every chapter will thrive.

It seems to me that adding more chapters is just delaying the inevitable. There's clearly a problem with how things are operating now, but it seems like they're choosing to ignore it and just bringing on more groups.

And those groups have no houses, which to me, shouldn't be a problem, but it obviously is for some of these PNMs.

I feel like something's going to blow up soon. But that's just my opinion (and FYI, I'm only basing it on what I've read online here, and on a few other sites).

I don't mean exclusive, or highly selective, I mean exclusionary, or leaving people out for really no apparent reason. The unhoused chapters will more than likely continue to function with a quota and quota additions system like the rest of the Greek world outside of IU. So the girls who pref at unhoused chapters have a reasonably strong chance of finding a home through QAs as opposed to the girls who "win" through most of rush only to end up unmatched. That is where exclusive crosses the line into exclusionary in my book. If girls did everything right and were well-liked through the entire process, they should find a home. That's how it works everywhere else and has proven to be wildly successful. And I think it will be for the unhoused chapters too, while seeming more democratic and less bitchy.

I think the unfortunate reality right now is that PNMs do have that mindset and are ranking unhoused groups last for the most part, and that the unhoused groups are left to choose from the PNMs who have been funneled down after the house groups have taken their picks. The fortunate part is that there are so many PNMs that the unhoused groups are still left with a large pool of worthy women to choose from. It is my understanding that we are all maintaining healthy sized chapters of quality members, it's just the stigma of being an unhoused group that we have to deal with. As far as marketing being unhoused as a positive, I'm betting that the number of women choosing unhoused groups for the fact that they are unhoused is minuscule at best. I think it is more of a case of a PNM wanting ABC badly enough that they are willing to overlook the lack of housing, rather than wanting ABC because it is unhoused.

This. I doubt very seriously that there are very many women walking around campus saying, "Geez, I'd really like to be a part of that Greek scene but I sure hate those giant Greek houses." They likely don't want to be in Greek life for many other reasons. The house isn't the thing keeping them out. For many people, even in our campuses without Greek housing, a giant chapter house is the DREAM. I'm not really sure why since it is usually expensive, cramped and not that nice (unless you are in one of those new houses which are still expensive, cramped but maybe a little nicer.)

I agree with this statement. I believe that there is a small percentage of women who would rather not live in a large chapter house, because I was one of those women back in my day.

Today's PNMs have grown up more affluently that many of us in our day. By this I mean, when I grew up many of my girl friends in high school shared a bedroom with a sibling and shared a bathroom with either all of their siblings or the entire family. Very few of my friends had televisions in their bedrooms, I was the only one. We had no personal computers, cell phones, netflix, etc.

I teach in a high school and only a small handful of my students share a bedroom with a sibling. In one case, the girls share because they are twins and like it. There is another bedroom available, they would just rather share. My seniors have mentioned being in a sorority quite often lately because they are filling out housing forms for their respective schools. I always let them know what the living situations are at their schools. Most of the girls do not mind the inconvenience of sharing a room, having no closet space, and using a communal bathroom. They know it is for a few years at most. BUT there are always one or two who do not want to live that way. They want their own space, or like to cook. So even with all of the modern conveniences PNMs have today, most of them can handle living in a Greek house for a couple of years.

At IU, I think one issue of living in might be for girls who pledge as sophomores and have lived in an apartment for a year. They might not want to move back into that situation after living out for a year. There are also girls who are on special diets: diabetic, gluten free, paleo, food allergies. This is also hard to do in a sorority house. You might think this is a small number of women, but you would be surprised how many people are on special diets. Choosing a restaurant for a field trip can be an ordeal....but that's another topic.

From what I have observed, the live in culture at IU is changing somewhat. It's just changing at a glacial pace. A friend's daughter went through recruitment at IU this winter and when she ranked her chapters after pref, the live out policy came into play. She ranked the chapters who allowed senior live outs over the chapter who did not. She liked all three equally well, but was self aware enough to realize she wanted to live out senior year. Her next door dorm neighbor ranked an unhoused chapter over a housed chapter because she "didn't want to be stuck living in all three years" as she put it. I do think things are changing....just very, very slowly.

There are also girls who are on special diets: diabetic, gluten free, paleo, food allergies. This is also hard to do in a sorority house. You might think this is a small number of women, but you would be surprised how many people are on special diets.

This is absolutely true....I am on the corp board of my chapter and I have been surprised at how many requests we get from members with special diets that we cannot accommodate and as a result, they need to live out.

It's not just actually living in with all the vaunted bonding that is a factor. It's the social pecking order as well.

I don't understand what you're getting at. Can you elaborate?

Who chapters mix with or pair with for events. If upper tier fraternities don't want to mix with them it has a negative impact, and vice versa. We'd all like to pretend those things don't matter, but let's be real - they do, especially at schools with large Greek systems.

Right. Some of the PNMs shunning the unhoused chapters may not actually care about living in...they care about whether fellow students perceive them as cool/popular.

These chapters are still very new! Are they having trouble getting matched for events? There are soooooo many fraternities there. They may not be getting the "best" guys, but they shouldn't have any trouble having a full social schedule. Regardless of housing, if they are having trouble this needs to be OMG top priority. Especially for the younger gals, this is likely the #1 reason for joining an IU chapter.

I believe that PNMs interested in the "prestige" of a certain chapter would also be looking at how prestigious the fraternities the chapter mixes with are. For that type of PNM it is not about whether the chapter has a full social calendar, but which fraternities fill the calendar.

^^^Picking up what I'm laying down.

Well, IMO, no effort needs to be spent making those girls happy. They can be superior and in the best chapters or alone in their bitchiness. There are more than enough nice girls who want the more positive elements of sorority life. And those girls will more carefully consider their decision about whether they choose a house or no house in their future sorority. But hey, there are options across the spectrum at IU.

I hope all chapters who are not at IU choose to NOT present or accept invitations for expansion.
The "row" needs to be PANHELLENIC and get rid of "bed recruitment" for the good of all Greek Life at Indiana University.

That's unfair. It's also something that from the way I understand it, GUYS at IU have been dealing with for years (i.e. desirability of chapter dependent on location and existence of house). Like I said, it's one thing to pooh-pooh that sort of thing at a school with a system so small that a sorority can mix with every group on campus in a semester. It's quite another at a school with 40+ fraternities. Calling girls who want to make the most of all aspects of their sorority membership including their social calendar, bitches, doesn't help fix the situation.

I hope not, I'd really really really like to have my chapter back. :(

I hope that you get it back!!! :):):):):):p:p:p:p

I believe it was LaneSig who indicated that AST presented along with Delta Phi Epsilon. I won't pretend to know the inner workings of our expansion team, but I suspect that we probably wouldn't have presented if our headquarters was still in Alabama. Most of our chapters are at smaller schools with smaller Greek systems. Moving HQ to Indianapolis probably had a big influence in the decision. Just a hunch.

I'm curious to see if we'll present again.

At the alumnae panhel meeting, the reps were told that AST submitted the interest packet but was unable to find a time to present before IU students left for the summer. So I would assume, AST might still be interested.

I know next to nothing about Indiana's greek system, besides the small amount of information I've read on this site, but I'll weigh on on why some people may not want to live in. Some people just have different personalities. For me personally, I'm more introverted. I had a roommate in the dorms freshman year and currently live in the house as a sophomore. While I am so glad I had the opportunity to live in, I'm excited to have my own space next year. I'm the type of person who really values my alone time, and while I love spending time with my friends and sisters, I like to have my own room where I can unwind by myself without having a roommate or roommates. Plus, since we all have different class schedules, it'll be nice to sleep in without hearing alarms go off at different times, get ready without having to be quiet because someone is sleeping, etc. Don't get me wrong, I love my roommates, and I've been very lucky to not have any negative experiences with roommates. I just like my own space. I know a lot of girls who feel this way, especially after sharing a room freshman and sophomore year with one or more girls. I couldn't imagine having to share a room for three or four years. But then again, that's just my introverted personality coming into play.

However, I know that if I didn't get the chance to live in, I would have been upset as I really wanted to live in the house at some point. It's just that one year of living in has been a good amount of time for me and I'm ready for my own space.

In my sorority, I actually know a lot of girls who chose to move in second semester freshman year instead of the usual sophomore year, because our chef was able to more easily accommodate their special diets (gluten free, etc) better than the campus dining halls that those in the dorms eat at. I think that a lot of progress is being made in terms of accommodating people who have special dietary needs.