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Finer Woman10-A-91 05-23-2000 02:47 AM

Quality -vs- Quantity
 
I noticed on one of the boards, a post from a young lady asking what sorority was the largest. It really got me to thinking. Do people really put that much value in the size of the organization?

In my chapter, we chose not to have lines greater than 20. Typically, the frats follow a similiar philosophy. For those of you on lines smaller than that you understand the challenge and reason. For those of you on lines greater than 20...say 50-130 did you feel you had a fair opportunity to truly bond with your linesisters?

There was a line at my undergrad (Howard U) that took 128 girls one year and those poor ladies had the hardest time living that one down. As a matter of fact, one of my very dear friends was on that line. Another dear friend who did eventually go on to pledge membership in that organization in a graduate chapter confessed she would have been embarrassed to be on that line.

Do you think there should be a cap on the number of members chapters should take? Do you think it's possible to really get to know more than 20 other women or men who are on line or go through MIP with you?

I have 9 linesisters...RIP #8, and I know I have to work to keep up with them and it's been over 9 years since we crossed. How do you keep in touch with 80 linesisters?


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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Woman's Dream!

ZetaAce 05-23-2000 07:33 AM

I have 4 line sisters and I have a hard enough time keeping up with them. (Thank goodness for email! LOL)


I too would be interested to know the challenges of having more.

c&c1913 05-23-2000 09:32 AM

Sometimes the chapters don't have a choice in regards to size. A friend of a mine that attends a predominantly black told me that a certain org. had almost 200 people attend their rush, but for whatever reason the chapter only accepted 30 girls. Either their regional office or national headquarters made them accept more, but the chapter resisted and now it is suspended for a year and a half.

kammye 05-23-2000 10:05 AM

How does a chapter determine how big a line will be? Does it depend on how many applies or what?

33girl 05-23-2000 10:15 AM

I was simply curious about size, believe me I am a strong proponent of quality over quantity and bigger is NOT always better!

Regarding c&c1913’s post, good for that chapter who refused to take more. I know there are some NPC sororities who if they do not take quota at rush, they are placed on probation, and they have to keep bidding women until they get up to quota, thereby throwing all the “high standards for selecting new members” out the window. We refer to them as “98.6” sororities – have a body temp, get a bid.

I think a lot of the nationals are only seeing $$$$ when they worry about numbers and forgetting that they don’t have to live, socialize, work with these people day in & day out, the collegians do. I know when you have a 150 person house you have to fill it, but not at the expense of chapter harmony if it means taking people you detest. And at small schools, let’s face it, there are going to be years where there’s just not a lot to choose from. Better to ride it out for a semester and work on the bonds between members rather than take people just to take people.

12dn94dst 05-23-2000 11:18 AM

regarding kammye's post: some chapters have the number of pledges they'll have in a given year set in their by-laws

as far as the size of a line and bonding among the pledges is concerned, I think it has a great deal to do with 1) the length of time there is to pledge and 2) the efforts of the current chapter members to create and environment suitable for bonding. I come from a line of 50. Policies that were in place concerning the initiation of new members made it impossible for us to bond before we became members. But I have heard and know of Sorors who pledged after me who were on lines bigger than mine that have EXTREMELY close relationships with all of their line sisters.

I don't agree with regional officers/advisors deciding to add to lines and forcing chapters to comply. The chapter's vote should stand.

equeen 05-23-2000 01:17 PM

I can't imagine being 1 out of 50 in a pledge class...like it's been said, where's the chance to bond and really commit yourself as part of a network to the goals and ideals of one's GLO? And I can't imagine making a committment, then walking the road in lonliness, when so many others around you have made the same committment. A.S.K.'s Beta Chapter (my chapter) had a founding class of 17; subsequent candidate classes have had no more than 4 or 5. I'd personally like to see larger candidate classes, but not to huge sizes, where it would be impossible for the candidates to bond with themselves as well as with the initiated sisters.

BlondeChick 05-23-2000 01:23 PM

I was part of the colonization of our Alpha Xi Delta chapter at our school.

We started with under 30 sisters in our colony, and, after a year, doubled in size with new pledges.

As long as you take the time to get to know your sisters, and make a true effort to really get involved, it shouldn't matter weather your sorority has 30 or 3000 sisters.



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Http://www.geocities.com/hotformulab...o_my_world.htm – Michelle's World

PositivelyAKA 05-23-2000 01:29 PM

I don't think its a matter of trying to have more quantity i think its just plain old Demand. I know at Howard the AKA's and Delta's always have many more interested ladies than do Zeta's or Sgrho's. Therefore it is not susprising that their lines are larger and Zeta and Sgrho lines are extremely small even at a HBC. I do however agree with you on the cap issue, but that is not an easy task when so many qualified women are interested in these two prestigious organizations, particulary at HBC. Black Schools will always have larger lines then do White Schools for obivious reasons. There were over 300 girls that attended the rush for the line of 128 that came back to the yard after a 4 year suspension just "fyi". The final decision of how many are taken is at the discretion of the governing body and they take into consideration many factors (including money i hate to say). Deltas and AKA's at Howard always have huge lines because they always have over a hundred girls attending their interest meetings (not every sorority has that many interested women) and it is a predominantly black university vs a white university where blacks are not huge in attendance. It is possible however to bond as a larger line that is the responsibility of each line sister. These sororities have a greater demand for membership then do others so they must make it happen, no EXCUSES. I think all things are relative to the type of organization one is interested in. Some sororities will never have a need to limit their intake of members while others will always have a long line of interested ladies just waiting for the chance to gain membership. I'm glad so many women are interested in my organization http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif i don't see that as a problem.

Alumnus who cares 05-23-2000 02:11 PM

It looks like this topic was started with regards to sororities, but I was wondering how it applies to fraternities as well. A couple of years ago, I heard from some actives that there were a couple of large fraternities on my campus that had 35 pledges in a fall semester. I was amazed and impressed (and yes, jealous) that these houses could get this kind of rush number, but it always seemed kind of high. I wonder if the big houses pledge 35 guys with the intention of keeping them all, or if they like to “whittle down” that group to 25 or so, to make sure they get the highest quality members.

Since my house was one of the smaller ones on our campus, we didn’t have the freedom to “pick and choose” like the bigger fraternities did. Our typical fall pledge class would have 10-12 members, and not all of them ended up being quality guys anyway; always one or two bad apples out of every group. But the bigger chapters would have hundreds of rushees come by their house, so they could give bids to 30-35 guys and still be assured of quality.

I also knew of a few houses that would go out and get a large pledge class and temporarily sacrifice quality, to get their numbers up and start attracting more rushees. Then, once they were established and more comfortable with their size, they could afford to be more choosy, and the following fall they might have a smaller, more “quality” pledge class.

I’d be interested in hearing some fraternity members’ takes on the whole quality vs. quantity argument, as it seemed to be a hot topic for our rush every semester.

Ghostface-Killah 05-23-2000 07:50 PM

FINER Woman10-A-91: I hear youon that one. I was a solo and had a hard time getting to know Big Sister. I agree with you, and even 20 wouyld force you to keep them on for a long time. As far as how many ladies national's wants youto put on, how would they now the # unless you tell them? My ex-, who happens to be one of your frats, told me he met a member of XYZ sorority - HER NUMBER : 201 CAN YOU BELIEVE IT!!!!!!!
I know a few men with high number- they had a line of 30, but that was back in 1991 and they were on for over a year. He can still run 10 things about each of his line brothers.

awatters 05-23-2000 08:00 PM

Fall 99 had 10, my Winter 2000 pledge class had 7 guys, and our spring pledge class has 3. 20 new members in one year is pretty good, I think. I was surprised when my Big Sis in DG told me that her fall class was 35. There's so much more interest in sororities, it seems. For example, in Spring 99 Theta sorority had 3 open spots because they were almost at capacity of 115 members. Here there are over 100 girls in each of the 11 sororities, and they don't really want to have activities with a fraternity that has fewer members. I think Lambda Chi is the biggest fraternity here, with around 100 actives. They have the biggest pledge class this spring also, at 19. But I would rather be in a group with 50 guys I like than 100 guys I don't. On the other hand, I would really like more guys in the group so we could be stronger. Size matters.

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andrew watters
Theta Chi – ucla

[This message has been edited by awatters (edited May 23, 2000).]

AKA2D '91 05-23-2000 09:45 PM

There were 67 of us on our "line." Yet, that chapter had not had anything going on for almost two years. After we came through, we did not have another intake until two years later. That time, we brought in 72 girls. Our rushes had over 300 girls applying. After you "weed" out those who are not qualified (GPA check), normally you are left with about 150-200 women, then you are left to decide how many you will choose. Our "Graduate" sorors felt that our regional director would not find 20 or 30 girls enough (given the number of girls applying). We would have to justify as to why girls were not chosen. That was a bit disheartening, when you are "forced" to add. That's where you get many of the "bad seeds."

Siobhan 05-24-2000 12:21 AM

Our campus (U of British Columbia) has a ceiling which I think is a great idea. Our campus cap is 40, not to big, not to small. I think once you get above 50 or 60 it losses the idea of a sisterhood

prettygyrl 05-24-2000 01:39 AM

It would seem like over twenty girls are alot to get to know. I attend a small school and I am glad that whenevr I decided to try and pledge it will only be a few. I am not saying it does not work with alot on line I am just for me I would think a line of 20 or less would bridge more bonding. Although I do understand that at HBCUs the lines would of course be bigger.

SigEpYoda 05-24-2000 07:15 AM

My pledge class was quite small. We were of four guys. But then, the next semester, we got 28, then 35. Quite weird. I think size does matter. Once we were able to triple our number, our rush was a whole lot easier. We were more active on campus and intramurals. More recognizable. We also had more money. And the alumni all of the sudden came out of the forest to give us support. So I think quanity is as important as quality. Kinda like figuring out what is more important, a college degree or experience. You need both to succeed.

Alumnus who cares 05-24-2000 10:55 AM

I agree with all of this. A lot of people argue that bigger is not necessarily better. This may be true as far as internal matters are concerned: you don’t get to know all of the guys as well, the brotherhood may not be as tight or close-knit, etc. However, I think it depends on the person. If you are in a 100-member house and you really take the time to get to know everyone well, then you can do it. But externally speaking—social, campus involvement, intramurals, recognition among other houses in the Greek system—bigger is definitely better.

Another point concerning quality and quantity: You can get quality out of quantity, but not the other way around. Meaning if you pledge 20 “average” guys, your house can mold them into 20 solid, hard-working brothers. But if you pledge only 10 guys, even if they are all rock-solid, it’s still only 10 guys, and you can’t get 20 guys out of that. Do the math. Another argument for quantity.

My chapter’s goal was just to get as many pledges as possible, because we were a small house and couldn’t survive otherwise. We couldn’t plan on just getting the 20 best guys who walked through our door, because we didn’t have the same rush numbers that a lot of houses have. Basically, if someone had a good attitude, got along with our guys during rush, and seemed to be willing to work hard for the house, we would give them a bid. We would end up with a pledge class of diverse, solid future brothers, but we would lack the size to really make an impact on campus.

I guess what I’m trying to ask is how different houses of different sizes determine how many pledges they want to get in a given semester. I am interested in finding out if houses try to balance a semester of “quantity” with a semester of “quality,” or if the goal is to always get 30 pledges no matter what, etc. Do houses ever set a goal of “we want to be the biggest fraternity on campus” and then go out and get as many pledges as they can, to achieve that goal? Do they fluctuate based on how many seniors graduated last year or how many will be graduating next year? Does a house that already has 90 members really need a pledge class of 35, when a class of 20-25 is more than enough? Or do they pledge 35 guys with the knowledge that only 20-25 of them will make it to initiation?

Finer Woman10-A-91 05-24-2000 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by PositivelyAKA:
I know at Howard the AKA's and Delta's always have many more interested ladies than do Zeta's or Sgrho's. Therefore it is not susprising that their lines are larger and Zeta and Sgrho lines are extremely small even at a HBC. I do however agree with you on the cap issue, but that is not an easy task when so many qualified women are interested

Just an FYI...At Howard,where I pledged and was the Dean of a line of 19, the Zetas have purposely kept their lines small...It's never been a lack of interest. If you take a look at the early yearbooks of Howard you will see, for MANY years, the numbers issue was about the same. The bottom line is we have a personal interest in the ladies we bring in. Our tactics with respect to membership are very consistent with what we want from a International perspective.

Therefore, we do not bring in MASS quantity.
We would rather not deal with the drama plagued by aka or delta that they time and time again face in their headquarters adding on additional women and infighting. It's not a diss...but simply not an issue,we would like to deal with in the name of Sisterhood. And further, I hate to say it, but I would be embarrassed to wear the number 125 on my back. My friend(who's organization I will not mention) forgot her linesister's name. OUCH! I love her to death...but eww, YOUR LINESISTER'S NAME? No thanks. That's not cool.

And please don't get me wrong, I know she is a die-hard member (and on that line of 128) and WORKS her butt off. I am proud of her and love her to death!

I must also say this issue of numbers is VERY regional in nature. For example, in NY...Brooklyn...Long Island U anyone will tell you the Sigma Gamma Rho's CONSISTANTLY outnumber all NPHC 4 organizations. Does it matter? No. Does it mean there is less interest in the other organizations? Not necessarily. However, what it might indicate is the priority is different chapter to chapter with respect to whether bonding or numbers is important.

In closing, I know women will bond on line...while in school even. But what are the life long effects. We say this is a LIFE LONG COMMITTMENT. Does one really stay in touch with 60 linesisters?


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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Woman's Dream!

[This message has been edited by Finer Woman10-A-91 (edited May 24, 2000).]

SilverTurtle 05-24-2000 06:03 PM

I attended a tiny little private school (under 2000 students including the handful of MBA candidates and MSN candidates there).

Plegeclasses for all of the GLO's ranged anywhere from 3 to around 35 in any given semester I was there ('95-'99). From memory, the smallest GLO had around 14 members and the biggest about 60 at their respective extremes. The BGLO's were (are) actually city-wide chapters, and I can't speak for their line numbers. (I do know that the chapters consisted of members from several small private (and predominately white) colleges in the vicinity, so I don't imagine they were huge. But I could always be wrong http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif).

My pledgeclass had 18.. a pretty good number. We got active and I think everyone contributed a lot. But there were times when it felt like there were some sisters and brothers that I just didn't know like I felt I should, given that they were my pledgeclass. Also, it made pledge activites hard to schedule (most of our members had evening rehearsals and the like, all class/school commitments).

When I had the privelage of training 2 different pledgeclasses (one each semester), they had 8 members and then 7 members. While the numbers were small, the members were (and are) incredibly rad. All worked together amazingly well and I could see the bonds that they were forming. And even though scheduling was still an issue, my last pledgeclass asked to have more stuff scheduled so they could spend more time together as a class and with the actives. (Talk about an impressive class!)

"alumnus who cares" made a pretty valid point on quantity vs. quality. While I would choose quality, it's definately preferable to be able to blend the 2!

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SilverTurtle@greekchat.com
Phi Beta Fraternity
Phi chapter

PositivelyAKA 05-24-2000 06:30 PM

Finer Woman, again i agree there should be a cap, how to determine that fairly is another issue. However again knowing how it is at Howard and other Black Schools i've never seen your sorority have this problem so i don't see how you can really speak on it since it really doesn't seem to be an issue for Zeta.

Have you ever had over a hundred, two hundred, qualified women at your Rush seriously speaking and had to deal with this issue (I have). I think it is sad for line sisters to forget each other's names but 200 girls will not remember even that, all you will have is cliques within the group, but that happens on a line of 10, and even smaller lines know each others names, life history etc. but can not begin to show sisterly love twards one another, now that is sad too.

Sisterhood is something you have to work at no matter the number, if more women want to be your sister then you just have to work that much harder at bonding, I'm not saying Zeta doesn't have interested women but they do not and never have attracted as large of a following at Howard as do Delta or AKA (that's just a fact and i've seen the year books.)

Anyway after you graduate no one really cares, its all about the business, no one cares how long your line was or if you can remember all their names if you are not financial. In joining a sorority the sisterhood is not limited just to your undergraduate line sorors who many times disperse all across the nation after graduation. Older sorors told me and i have seen it to be true that our sister hood is life long and is has no boundries it only begins with undergrad.

Most of my line are all over the country and as much as i love each one of them, i would not trade my grad chapter sorors or sorors i've met in my area for anything in the world because our sisterhood has matured and goes beyond the yard at Howard, FAMU, Spellman, etc. it is world wide. So for those on larger lines then you would prefer, enjoy it and appreciate all those extra hands that help build that chapter, because in grad chapter you may find yourself wishing you had more sorors to help out.

hope this didn't offend you Finer Woman i do see your point. Its just easier to say what you will do then to do it if you've never done it.

[This message has been edited by PositivelyAKA (edited May 24, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by PositivelyAKA (edited May 24, 2000).]

crimson_bmw 05-24-2000 10:27 PM

I am a proud member of Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, Inc., and I pledged at Grambling State University where over 400 women attended the rush. 82 women were accepted into the sisterhood, but I don't feel ashamed because my line was much larger than the other GLO's on campus. Yes, it is hard to keep in touch with all of them, but we love each other and we share a special bond that will always keep us together. I agree with PositivelyAKA, more people come to the Delta and AKA rushes, for whatever reason, so naturally our lines are going to be larger.

Ghostface-Killah 05-24-2000 11:44 PM

FinerWoman: OHHH I LOVE YOUR STYLE!!!! TELL IT GIRL!!!!!
As far as the number, I think it also has to do with the difference in process- True that AKAs and DELTA lines are going to be larger if the interest is more but... the problem i find with this is that sometimes youmight not give the time and attention to each interest in order to find out if she is AKA,DELTA, ZETA, or SGRho material. I amnot talking about pre-pledging, I amtalking about someone coming to you saying " I want to become member" and youdon't get to interview her and take the time to she if that is the kind of person she wants. It sure is a matter of where you live. I know of chapter that brought lines of 5 last semester and 8 this semester. THE INTEREST IS OFF THE HOOK-, yet, sorors do not put everyone who come to the informational.
AS I KEEP SAYING, TO EACH ITS OWN, But I would not like to have a triple digit as my number.

Finer Woman10-A-91 05-25-2000 12:16 AM

No offense taken at all. However you are SADLY mistaken in stating the level of interests in Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated at Howard has never rivaled aka or delta.

I invite you to review ANY official Howard University periodical or annual from the Moorland Springarn room in the Main Library of Howard University. I worked on the yearbook staff for 3 of my 4 years as a student there and promise you will see for yourself that what I have stated is FACTUAL.

If you really do some serious research on Greek letter organizations at Howard in particular, you will see for a FACT that the Zetas did indeed rival in numbers the other Sororities from it's inception well into the 1950's. After that time period there was a major shift in the culture of membership and Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated respectively.

http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/cool.gif But don't be suprised, you will not find many projects specific to Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated in the archives as you will other organizations,simply because Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated chose not to give her archives to the research institution as did many other BGLOs. (When the interests at Howard are encouraged to research...they research). Been there...and did it. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

In stating that, the culture of Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated, on college campuses systematically changed in its focus away from the numbers and more on the bond of Sisterhood. This was further demonstrated by Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated being the first to expand and charter in Africa in 1948. The notion was... Sororal living did and should move beyond our scope of locality and particularly that of the African diaspora.

Contemporarily, sorority life in general has evolved dramatically. From the 1960's-1980's (and 90's for some http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif )the focus on pledging at Howard further cast the iron between those who were worthy and those who were not. A long tradition of pledging hard quite frankly and purposely scared many away, especially since my Fraternity brothers were notorious for participating in the pledge process.

To further expound on the idea of a rush of 200-300 girls. Will that ever happen again at Howard U or any other chapter in Zetadom? By design, probably not. We make it a point to weed them out waaaaaaaaay before it comes to that. It eliminates confusion, anxiety, cliques, law suits, dramatic A and B lines, and suspensions.

FYI, Alpha chapter Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated has NEVER been suspended.

As for the organizations that do have the practice of large rushes, more power to you. I know for my aka friend from the line of 128, she said she was happy with crossing in her weekend MIP. She said it was more in line with her virtues and idea of sorority life. She also enjoyed the rush of 300. Its a concept that works for some, but not for others. She's my girl! What ever makes her happy.

On the issue of keeping in touch with all of your linesisters/and knowing them, I must disagree with you. My bond with my linesisters are UNLIKE any. Yes, it's true, the time you spend in undergrad is short compared to the time you spend in grad. Hey, I have been out of undergrad for 8 years. I too, am currently active in a graduate chapter http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif. And yes, I love ALL of my Sorors that I have met across the world and I would not trade them for the anything, but the bond I have with my linesisters can NEVER be replaced. My introduction will always be the most special. It was the time when Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated first touched my heart. Without that moment, my membership of 9 years plus would not exist.

Interestingly enough it was YOUR Sorors that wanted to put the cap on membership numbers through the HU chapter of NPHC. My Sorors were in disagreement, primarily because they felt membership should not be regulated by NPHC but by the individual organization.

Likewise, I hope I have not offended you or any other woman on a line of 30+ , for it certainly was not my intention.

Quote:

Originally posted by PositivelyAKA:

Sisterhood is something you have to work at no matter the number, if more women want to be your sister then you just have to work that much harder at bonding, I'm not saying Zeta doesn't have interested women but they do not and never have attracted as large of a following at Howard as do Delta or AKA (that's just a fact and i've seen the year books.)

Anyway after you graduate no one really cares, its all about the business, no one cares how long your line was or if you can remember all their names if you are not financial. In joining a sorority the sisterhood is not limited just to your undergraduate line sorors who many times disperse all across the nation after graduation. Older sorors told me and i have seen it to be true that our sister hood is life long and is has no boundries it only begins with undergrad.

hands that help build that chapter, because in grad chapter you may find yourself wishing you had more sorors to help out.

hope this didn't offend you Finer Woman i do see your point. Its just easier to say what you will do then to do it if you've never done it.

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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!



[This message has been edited by Finer Woman10-A-91 (edited May 25, 2000).]

PositivelyAKA 05-25-2000 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Finer Woman10-A-91:
Likewise, I hope I have not offended you or any other woman on a line of 30+ , for it certainly was not my intention.

On the contarary there is nothing offensive about being part of one of two prestigious sororities that have the problem of having so many college educated women want to obtain membership into their organization. I see it as a compliment since we don't have to recruit, competition is fierce always has been, always will be, but again i wouldn't expect you to understand http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Ghostface-Killah 05-25-2000 07:12 PM

POSITIVELYAKA: Again, I guess it depends what area you are talking about. Maybe the fact that noone cares after one graduates reflects if it was really sisterhood or a front. I was a solo and not only did I have to learn all lines from charter members to the line before me. As if that was not enough, I also had to learn ALL lines, since 1986, of the chapter that pledged my charter members. I think it is important that that kind of histoy gets passed down. I cannot tell you about AKA, DELTA, or ZETA interest, but at this particular school, ZETAS and SGRhos have the most interest. I cannot even tell you about interest all over the country, therefore I only limit post to the chapters I do know. 100 interest or 5- How much time should one dedicate to take a close look at these ladies? Many just want to do it because: they want to stroll, family tradition, a friend or whatever. How do you separate the aboved from the ones who really have something to offer?

Ghostface-Killah 05-25-2000 07:17 PM

FINERWOMAN: Again, you have talked for the both of us, maybe without knowing.
THANK YOU>

PositivelyAKA 05-25-2000 08:11 PM

http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif Ghost Face Killa i was just saying that most greeks once they get past the neo stage, tend to care more about what you are doing now for the sorority vs how many weeks you were on line not that your process is irrelevant because it is relevant and our relationships with our line sisters well that is forever, however as we mature as greeks we tend to have more complicated lives, with our work, husbands, children, family, church and the list goes on. So we start to put things more into perspective and what seemed like the end all in college can shift a little.

Anyway i'm with you that some do join only for the glamour of greek life while in school and that is sad, their reasoning for membership should be deeper then that. You go
girl!! on doing the Solo thang, ok when you're the Ace and the Tail there is no where to hide http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Yes i'm an AKA but we're all still Sisters just wearing different colors and living our lives the best we know how http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Finer Woman10-A-91 05-25-2000 11:27 PM

Did I miss something? Are you saying that you only recognize 2 organizations as prestigious? http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gif Hmm, last time I checked, there were 4 NPHC Sororities...all of which
I was taught great respect for. In the way of Greekdom, I was taught with my 9 linesisters we give due respect to all 4, even though we are always partial to our own as being the BEST.

I don't know if you are saying recruiting is a bad thing or a good thing. From a marketing/business perspective being selective... is the OPTIMAL vantage for any organization seeking the Finest. In other words, you can either wait for the crowd and choose...or you can decide what you want and choose. Which ever tactic works for you...Wonderful. Personally, I like choosing and knowing what kind of women and who my potential Sorors are...adding the personal touch to further define true sisterhood...and nurture sisterly love.

As far as competition is concerned, Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated competes with none. We revel in our exclusive class all by ourselves. I suspect in your vast membership and fierce competion that's a concept you would not understand http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif.

Quote:

Originally posted by PositivelyAKA:
On the contarary there is nothing offensive about being part of one of two prestigious sororities that have the problem of having so many college educated women want to obtain membership into their organization. I see it as a compliment since we don't have to recruit, competition is fierce always has been, always will be, but again i wouldn't expect you to understand http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif


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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!

Ghostface-Killah 05-25-2000 11:43 PM

FINERWOMAN: You did it again. Are we on the same page or what? Damn- I like the way you're breaking it down. I am sooo very glad I feel as if you talk for the both of us ( I agree with you that is) because many in here have the tendecy to read in between my lines and miss the whole point.
Peace to you and yours- Things happen for a reason they say.

sgrho_22 05-26-2000 11:06 AM

First greetings to all...I have been reading all the posts on this topic and it is one that I have always been curious about....being that I also joined my organization solo and just crossed a 8 young ladies into our organization I can tell you that having 8 girls going through a process was not a very easy thing because we are talking about coordinating 8 different schedules togethr but not only that ....the question really is HOW DO U REALLY BOND 25 PLUS GIRLS? I am sorry I just can't see it...I understand what the lady from Zeta Phi Beta is saying what is more important quantity or quality? You might have 128 girls on line who become Sorors but come on are they really friends or line ssters...lets keep it real I think alot of BGLO's always wonder about this and people snicker when someone strolls up with a jacket marked #50. I won't debate whose organization is prestigous and whose is not because that will never be resolved but when you get 300 people at a rush yes be flattered but don't forget people are doing their research, they are going with friends to support sometimes, sometimes u have people who already made up their minds but just want to go and see what the other organizations rush is all about. Everyone joins organizations for different reasons and to each their own but come on can we sit here and say that 128 girls actually bond over a weekend, week, three weeks or even a month.

12dn94dst 05-26-2000 01:29 PM

I would HOPE that with extremely large lines the focus moves more toward making solid MEMBERS rather than "forcing" them to bond. It is difficult to be on a line with more than 30 women and bond with everyone and learn history and keep your grades up, I know from personal experience. With the current intake guidlines in place, it's darn near impossible.

I think it's our own fault though. The Greeks who were made pre-1990, please correct me if i'm wrong. I'm positive that these large lines are a direct result of no-pledge intake programs (which is different from regulating hazing). HOWEVER, non-greeks still need to know that they are not guaranteed membership...that it is not acceptable to run to the redional director when you don't get the chapter's vote...suck it up and try again next year. AND our elected officers should respect the chapter's decision and not add people when the chapter has voted otherwise. A young lady can look stellar on paper, but have the worst attitude/reputation in person...something a RD could not possibly know unless she's on that campus.



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Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

PositivelyAKA 05-26-2000 01:47 PM

12dn94dst well said, finally someone who can actually speak from experience which is always worth its weight in gold http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

The What? 05-26-2000 01:51 PM

Quality vs, Quantity? Ummm! Out west, we never have that problem. In a sense, we kinda open everything up. Chapters lock up with other chapters. Yes we even see other organizations.
For many of us, going to WHITE schools where we represented 2-3% of the population reminds me of the period of our founders. The bond that is developed from small lines can not be matched but larger lines? And YES, we still turn people away.
Quality should aways be a priority. Numbers will never matter. You are aways going to have a few people doing most of the work!

Lovey Dovey 05-26-2000 02:29 PM

Sorors and sisterfriends continue to honor the legacy of your Honorable Founders. It matters not the size of the line or the size of the organization. What matters is what your organization does with the members it has. I guess some folks are not "Our Kind of People." Hmmmmm...that may not be such a bad thing.
One Love Under the Dove

dstbrat 05-27-2000 03:51 PM

i think everyone's point is well-taken. everyone's experince is valid and important. all 4 organizations have built their tradition on service and sisterhood. the botton line is that no one can look on the outside and judge your experince or your journey to which ever sisterhodd you chose. that is very personal. i have seen many processes and am happy that i had the experince that did. it was the right choice for me. i have not regretted one day that i have been a Delta. so, really, it is pointless to bicker about which org is the most prestigious. we are obvuously biased. down south in alabama, zetas and sgrhos struggle for numbers. that is a fact. that doesn't mean that they are noty good people or hard workers. have have much respect for them and can say that they are well-liked by the other greeks. rarely do they get involved in the petty arguing that aka's and Deltas often do. that is to be commended. on the other hand, to try to discredit an org for having large numbers is wrong. we don't have to tear each other down to build ourselves up, that is destructive. anywho, yall have a good long weekend!

AKA2D '91 05-27-2000 04:53 PM

Ghostface... There are ways in which sorors can determine if someone is frontin' or for real. There is no way that that can be done in a 1 hour informational or a 2-hour rush. Generally, in most cases, regardless of the organization, one knows who is interested and who is not. It's out THERE! Discretion is the KEY! We learn how to "check people out" regardless of the time, place, or situation. With that, you can determine what is what and who is who!

Finer Woman10-A-91 05-27-2000 11:35 PM

I agree with about 90% of what you have said. However, what makes you think that the Zetas or SGRhos were struggling for anything? Believe it or not sometimes its not in the best interest of the organization to have a large membership. Unless you are a member of said organization, "the stuggle" is not known. Its all a matter of perspective. I have struggles with agencies cooperating in the community to get needed services to disadvantaged/disenfranchised people. But membership...that's not a struggle.

And granted if you are not in an organization that has a small contingent this may actually be hard to really understand the benefits. There are both pros and cons to a small membership as well as a large membership. I caution you in stating what you may THINK is "the need/struggle".

From my experience being in a chapter that grew from 18 to 31 active members and then we decided to take in 5... people were shocked. I say all of this to say, its possible and (USUALLY LIKELY) that the chapter has made a decision regarding growth and sisterhood. Again, it all comes down to what is the priority. And that priority is established by the respective organization...not a member of another organization or interests/propectives.


Quote:

Originally posted by dstbrat:
we are obviously biased. down south in alabama, Zetas and Sgrhos struggle for numbers. that is a fact. that doesn't mean that they are not good people or hard workers.


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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!

dstbrat 05-28-2000 02:39 PM

i am not making assumptions. i have worked with both organizations through nphc at my school as an advisor. the sgrho's were inactive for about 5 years and initiated 3 women last year. they are trying build their numbers so that their chapter can maintain it's charter. the zetas have brought in 3-4 women since 98. from talking to their president, the women that were interested were not qualified. i think that it is great that she didn't compromise her chapter for the sake of numbers. so, please don't think that i am speaking out of turn nor am i trying to knock either organization. i hope this clears it up.

Finer Woman10-A-91 05-28-2000 03:02 PM

Thank you for the courtesy of your reply. Unto every season comes change... evolution in it's own time.

Quote:

Originally posted by dstbrat:
i am not making assumptions. i have worked with both organizations through nphc at my school as an advisor. the sgrho's were inactive for about 5 years and initiated 3 women last year. they are trying build their numbers so that their chapter can maintain it's charter. the Zetas have brought in 3-4 women since 98. from talking to their president, the women that were interested were not qualified. i think that it is great that she didn't compromise her chapter for the sake of numbers. so, please don't think that i am speaking out of turn nor am i trying to knock either organization. i hope this clears it up.


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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!

SGRHO_98 05-28-2000 05:42 PM

I must agree with having a cap. When I was a freshman at NC Central Univ, the first organization to cross was the Delta's: all 88 of them. Although I was mesmerized by the large quantity, I thought to myself: how does #5 know #75? It didn't seem logical? But I think it all depends on where you pledge, b/c at my undergrad-SGRho's were always the smallest,(it's about quality not quantity. I think there should be a cap at 20.


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