Ann Coulter's use of the R-word
 

What an inspiration this young man is! Reading his letter almost brought tears to my eyes.
http://now.msn.com/john-franklin-ste...r-retard-tweet

As a Republican, I am disappointed and appalled at the way Ann Coulter used the word retard to describe President Obama. I do not agree with many of Obama's views, but is it that difficult to have some respect? Jeez, Ann.

Almost brought tears to your eyes?

I completely teared up reading the letter. So well said. and Ann Coulter really needs to just shut up.

It would be one thing if she appeared to mean what she says about ANYTHING, but she will say anything just to be harsh and confrontational. She hated Romney up until the day he was nominated. The least she can do is keep her trap shut now that he's their choice. She is one more example of why, IMO, the Republican party needs to take back their party. The people with the strongest voices don't represent any Republicans I know. I may not agree with those Republicans, but I don't think they're horrible despicable people. And most of the ones I hear on TV I do see as horrible despicable people.

From my friends fb:
The last comment
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...13007500_n.jpg

Your friend is so right with that post, ninja poodle!

I read the letter from the man with Trisomy 21 (I don't like the term Down Syndrome. Dr. Down was an asshole!) and was touched by his warmth and graciousness. I fear his words have fallen on a hardened heart with Ann Coulter, however. She is downright vicious. I will be more careful with my own words in the future after reading his thoughts, though.

That letter he wrote was wonderful. I'm so glad that so far the majority of people, Republican or not, are condemning her comments for being as wrong as they are.

A lot of girls in my chapter have said that they refuse to consider someone so vicious their sister. I wouldn't go that far, but I definitely won't be offering up our shared letters any time in the near or distant future....

She's a Delta Gamma? I did not know that. I'm sorry.

She definitely challenges our ability to live up to our oaths. HOWEVER, remember (as some religions teach) to separate the act and the person. Ann Coulter gets paid to do what she does -- it's her job. Few of us know how much of that is the person and how much is the persona.

Palin was too busy creating her own less-than-savory sound bytes. http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics...jive-on-libya/

People can whine about "Political Correctness" all they want, but, to be quite truthful, there's off color and there's intentionally incendiary.

Yep. Unfortunately, nothing can condone her comment. And for every informed person who understands the separation of persona/person, there's another two that think that the Ann Coulter they see is the one and only Ann Coulter. It's just frustrating that the one we do see is this vicious and offensive...

And I agree. I was just looking over our creed and such because our elections are coming up, and she is in no way demonstrating social responsibility or the finest qualities of character right now :mad:

Normally, I might go along with this, but I just don't think I can in this case. Ann Coulter's persona is a reprehensible one with no redeeming value that I can see. The only thing that could make me have less respect for her would be to know that that's only the persona she takes on for money. In my mind, that would make her a worse person, spouting such venomous and reckless nonsense not because she believes it but because it makes her rich. That would say nothing positive about her as a person.

It would make her a whore. Rush used to be a Democrat when he did talk radio in Chicago. I think there's more money in being a Republican, but I just don't get how you can get paid for being a horrible person and live with yourself. Or never give a little wink to the camera. I wish there was some way to tell GMA and the Today Show, et all to stop putting her on TV, stop repeating the horrible things she says, etc. She doesn't have anything valid to say so stop quoting her! Maybe this will have served as the wake up call to the various media to stop giving her their time or money.

And a lot of people have despicable people in their family. You can't justify or minimize. You just have to accept that some people are bad or become bad and move on. The Unabomber's brother doesn't say "well, he did have some valid things to say." He just has to be the best person he can be and hope the karma doesn't rub off on him.

Do you have a reference for this? I've never heard this before and there is nothing in his Wikipedia entry about him ever working in Chicago. I would think if this were true, it would be widely known.

Any links? Thanks!

I admit that, until 2008, I used to use the R-Word and I am ashamed to say so (For example, if I thought a situation was stupid or ridiculous, I would say, "Oh, that's so retarded".

Then two things happened:
1) My boss' 3rd child was born (a daughter) and she had Down Syndrome
2) I read this article by Maria Shriver (http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/...,7263175.story)

I've now made a conscious effort to refrain from saying that word, as I've now been enlighted as to how hurtful and what a terrible slur it is. It now quite bothers me when I hear someone say it.

As a DG, I really struggle with the Ann Coulter issue and the person vs. persona. I appreciate what some of my fellow DG's have contributed on this thread in terms of a mature discussion, so thank you for that.

Oh dear, I just saw this now after mentioning Down Syndrome up above. Why is he an asshole -- what did he do? :confused:

He was quite prolific into describing the mental characteristics/ deficiencies of the races. You might remember that Trisomy 21 patients were called "mongoloids" in the past. That was because Dr. Down thought they looked Asian and that Asians were mentally deficient! Yeah. Basically he gets credit for the syndrome because he described the features, but his life's work was spent codifying how Caucasians were the smartest and best race and all the others were inferior. Personally, I hate when they name syndromes/ diseases for people. It's much better when it's called by the proper name.

Thank you for making the effort. PARA ...I have a retarded son. Yes, he's "intellectually challenged" and "special" and "exceptional" -- because he's moderately mentally retarded (medical description, meaning slower than others). But he is not "a retard". PARA ...My feelings on the use of the word are more nuanced that are generally seen in today's discourse, but involve a recognition that the use of the pejorative, particularly in public, is hurtful. I've literally been chastised because I've said "My son is retarded." -- by people who do not understand the differentiation. And I understand there are some who are challenged/slow/special/exceptional who would even change the medical terminology if they could, because they don't like it.... PARA ... Not that any of this excuses the use of the word as a deliberate insult. Or any other word as a deliberate insult, in polite society. But freedom of speech means people can say just about anything, and our societal notion of acceptable is to be the determiner. PARA ... So one has to separate person/persona in order to live up to our oaths. I don't see any other way, though maybe others do.

thanks for this! As a kid I volunteered with my church's SPREAD group- which is basically Sunday School for people with Special Needs. One of the older volunteers always referred to those with Trisomy 21 as "mongoloids" and I never understood why.

You have to remember this is back in the day when the average person did not have as much faculty with medical terms (including "penis" or "vagina") as they do today. He sounds like an asshole, true, but we all know what the disease is when we hear the name. "Trisomy 21" will take a few more years to come to the mind as easily.

Meh.. this rates about as highly as Rob Schneider's apparent Romney endorsement. The first mistake anyone made in this thread was caring what Anne Coulter has to say on any subject whatsoever. Why is she even famous? Usually there is some combination of intellect, talent and good looks at play. Seeing as she has none of those things working for her and that her entire persona is based on writing partisan flame bait, why give what she says, hurtful or not, one thought?

Our poor sisters at Cornell then....

Oh, I agree. We have to start somewhere. At least mongoloids isn't common terminology anymore. There is a push in medicine to stop the use of eponyms.

I think this will be a harder one to get rid of. As I understand it, there are several Trisomy versions, right? So trying to remember that 21 is the one that was previously known as Down's and that 13 is Patau (sp?) etc... is going to be too hard for the general public. They're going to need a different name to define them.

I'm not sure it will. Afterall, I now hear "Lou Gerig's Disease" called "ALS" much more often (ignoring the fact that Lou Gerig might not have had ALS to begin with). I think the more people hear "Trisomy 21" the more they will use it, and eventually "Down's Syndrome" will fade away.

Trisomy 21 is by far more common than Trisomies 13 and 18 which are also not compatible with life and not in the public lexicon, so this is not a problem. There is no need for anyone but physicians and those effected to know what Edwards (18) and Patau (13) entail or what their names are.

Your post also shows the confusion with eponyms. ALS is also called Lou Gerig's Disease because he had the affliction, whereas Down Syndrome is not Down's Syndrome because Dr. Down did not have Trisomy 21. Even physicians get this wrong since my husband and I had this argument a couple months ago and he had to admit defeat. :D

But ALS is an simple acronymn, easy to remember with no unfamiliar medical-sounding words in it. Trisomy 21 sounds very clinical at best, especially since most people probably have no idea what either trisomy or 21 (in this context) mean. I, too, would be surprised if it caught on easily.

I guess my question would be what those with Down Syndrome/Trisomy 21 and their families prefer it be called. They'd get the deciding vote in my book.

Right? I don't follow her but her statement about the President actually seemed mild compared to what she's said in the past.

I also don't see any reason for Palin to speak out publicly against Couter on this since she isn't involved and there may be a good chance she's not even aware of the comment. I'm a political news junkie and this is the first I've heard of this Coulter comment.

Coulter was on Piers Morgan talking about it last night. I changed the channel. Quickly.

Over time, medical terminology sometimes trumps patient wishes. It may not change quickly but it should.

Probably, but as someone who read almost every pregnancy book she could get her hands on, 1) I'm scared to pronounce Trisomy because I have never heard it spoken, and 2) In my mind, Trisomy =/= Life. DS/T21 = life (and then some!), so I do think it should have a distinguishing name. DS is clearly the wrong one...but I don't think that automatically makes T21 the correct one.

Exactly

I agree, now that I know the background on the DS name (admittedly, I didn't know it before). I'm just not sure Trisomy 21 is the right one.

I do not like any derrogotive words, the "r" and "n" words are very offensive to me and I try my hardest to never say things like that and teach my kids not to say these things or even use the words stupid or idiot when talking about someone.....BUT, I too am a hypocrite! And I'll admit it, because whenever I am watching a movie, aka comedies, where the characters use these words I laugh...and sometimes laugh a lot depending on the situation and who the actors are.....one example is The Hangover....didn't others find it funny??

I guess sometimes its all in the context in which things are said and the situations.....human nature maybe?

BG

Perhaps it should, but a change like this shouldn't be imposed from the medical profession, especially since we're not talking about patients in the conventional sense of someone with an illness. We're talking about people born with and living their lives with an unalterable condition, and about their families. It's not just something these people have, it's part of who they are.

As the father of someone with an eponymic syndrome, I can vouch for the fact that it can, in a sense, become part of one's self-identification, without any regard at all to any knowledge of the person for whom the syndrome was named. The use by many of "Aspie" these days is an example of that. And I'll acknowledge that "Aspie" is not universally liked by those with Asperger Syndrome. But many do like it, and it shows an appropriation of and identification with "Asperger" independent from knowing anything about Hans Asperger.

I can easily see why many, especially in the medical community, consider it offensive to "honor" Down by calling the condition Down Syndrome. But to be honest, I can also see how many with Trisomy 21 and their families would find it offensive to have a "new" name imposed on them. It's the difference between "we have decided we'd rather be called ___" and "someone else has decided that we shouldn't be called ____ and should instead be called ___." In a situation like that, my inclination would be to go with the preferred medical term in medical contexts, but go with the term preferred by those with the condition in all other contexts.

:confused: There's nothing I can see in the context of this thread or in general that would prompt you to put these two terms in the same category or even mention the second at all.

Anne Coulter's opinion means very little to me but, given how large her audience is, her poor word choice is that much more unfortunate. Most of my friends who used to say the r-word regularly no longer do so because of NephewCG. Most of them know that he has a developmental disability--if they don't, they get very uncomfortable and apologize when I tell them why the word offends me. I'm never rude about it because people don't usually wake up and say "I'm going to offend lots of people today." I make it a point to say it nonchalantly (not as a sob story meant to make them feel badly) because there is nothing wrong with my nephew and flying off the handle might come across as me being ashamed in how he's different. But I will never forget the day he came home, told his mother someone on the playground had called him a "retard," and asked what it meant. That memory is enough to make anyone want to never say it again. I give most people a lot of leeway because it's easy to ignore the offensiveness when you don't have a personal story like that--it's VERY difficult to give the same slack to Anne Coulter.

Why not? He's giving an example of another derogatory term.

As for The Hangover, I found the entire movie way too long and completely unfunny.

I see it now after thinking on it for awhile but it was such a loose association, I really didn't get it at first.

I think that if Ann had a moment to think about it, she would very likely regret use of the term.

And I actually enjoyed the video of her dressing down that foppish Piers Morgan when he spoke to her the way he did.

I wonder if others who have used disparaging words to describe women regret their slip of the lip, however. Men who call women who have a different political viewpoint the "c" word, maybe?

Heck, even politicians who call their opponent a bullshitter.

What a shame that Ann cannot count on her sisters to privately send her an email expressing their disappointment with her poor choice of words, while remaining silent on a message board full of other comments that she may deserve, but without the chorus of "oh we hate her too".

Tau Delta Eta, y'all.

I don't think any of us outright said we hate her, though whether that's the undercurrent of any other members' comments is up for debate.

We are sisters through our shared rituals, but at the same time it is hard to fully respect someone who so deliberately flouts the words of our open creed, let alone our more secret and sacred bonds. Obviously the members of her chapter saw something in her, and she saw something in our organization that made her want to share in our oaths. I have many sisters in my chapter alone whose views I do not agree with, whose points I may not understand, but they are my sisters and I will still always respect them and honor them the way I should. The same way I respect and honor Ann Coulter as a person and how she has carved out a niche and place for herself in the world, regardless of whether or not I disagree with her stances on many things. Also, it was sisters who did note that Ann Coulter the person and Ann Coulter the persona may be two entirely different things, which no one else has really spoken about or taken into account. I would even say that as her sisters, we have been especially careful in our comments.

However, as pretty much everyone said, nothing can really justify her comments on a political or social level. There is a line between saying something politically charged and saying something that is so outright offensive, especially in the age when we are only just beginning to understand what being "retarded" really is and people are beginning to look at those with mental handicaps as real people, not just defined by how their chromosomes may have mutated or changed in relation to our own.

I hope others feel the same, and that the charged political culture we are currently living in as we head toward the election in just over a week can be blamed for much of the overt hatred and vitrol that is being spewed all over the internet, not even just here.

Well said, H.A.
Good post.

She seems to be a very sad hateful person, or a brilliant marketer who doesn't really believe what she said. I think she's more of a brilliant marketer who sold her soul for the almighty green back.