Shoe In??
 

What exatly does it mean to be a shoe in? Particularly, when rushing a fraternity. Is that good or bad?

Thanks guys!

It means that no matter what you do, you're getting a bid.

This has both good and bad:

Good:
1.) You don't have to try very hard
2.) They've probably already determined you to be a good fit for the group

However...
- The fraternity in question may have low or almost no standards
- The reason for the shoe-in may be bad, leading to you getting a bid when it's not in your best interest
- Fraternity is deseparate for members

The reesult: you have to see for yourself.

FYI, I believe the term is "shoo in".

shoe in could work... like getting your foot in the door

LOLLLL

LOL.

I will admit that I have probably typed "shoe in" before.

You just gotta get your foot in the door. Badumdum...chhhh.....

Shoe in, shoo in...somethin like that! LOL...

Thanks everyone for the input and help!

Let me be the Negative Nick here, but even if you are told you're a 'shoe in' (or 'shoo in'), don't approach it that way. If you act cocky some of the brothers may really dislike you. Each organization votes differently, sometimes a single 'no' vote means you don't receive a bid. Unless you are best friends with the entire chapter, you should still be on your best behavior.

It means anyone who tells you that you are this is:

1) full of crap/dumber than a box of hair
2) using dirty rush tactics to try to keep you from looking at other fraternities.

Either way, not a good thing.

If a fraternity member told you this, dump their house NOW. Don't go back. Don't pledge there. Yeah, I know people are going to say "it's only one person" but EVERY person should know better than to say such a thing.

I disagree with this.

As an active undergrad, I know damn well that EVERY organization, fraternities and sororities, top of the totem pole to bottom of the totem pole, have young members that have yet to learn how to properly recruit potential rushees. This is more common among fraternities especially.

I wouldn't be surprised if the brother who told the OP he was a "shoo in" was a newer brother that has no idea how to recruit or what to say/what not to say.

And there are always stand-out guys that would be a shoo in for whichever fraternity they choose, just as there are stand-out girls who always have a full schedule during sorority rush. Not saying this is the case with the OP, but it very well may be.

But I agree with lucgreek, don't be cocky or overly confident. There are some chapters where a single vote can blackball you and you don't want to ruin your chances by being a cocky douchebag.

I agree with this.

I don't tell people they're a shoo in, but I do let them know (if they're really worried) that their chances are looking really good.

FWIW, there was a fraternity on my campus who had what they called "99's" - Potentials that they were 99% sure they would give a bid once they were eligible. Usually these were first-semester freshmen, they knew they were 99s, the entire greek community knew they were 99s. If it was dirty rushing, no one usually cared. Once in a while a 99 would end up joining another fraternity but not often.

So, I'm not familiar with NIC recruitment rules - I'm not sure if this is dirty rushing or not. I just felt like sharing, really.

Yea, I was going to mention this. I've never heard of any regulations banning (what NPC women call) dirty rushing. I'm not sure why it was brought up in this thread in the first place.

Because the OP asked. :)

It's one thing if you know for sure that the fraternity really IS going to bid the guy. But there are times where a group just wants to keep a rushee from looking at another group...they just want to keep the rushee in question on the string in case one of their other guys doesn't sign. Too often the guy gets tossed to the side when the guys they REALLY wanted sign on.

As for dumb younguns - male and female - you need to educate them before they start opening their mouths.

When I hear 'dirty rushing,' I only think about the NPC equivalent. I don't think there are any consequences if similar situations happen in the NIC world (aside from the rushee getting screwed).

And I agree with the last paragraph.

I'm pretty sure every organization and its corresponding council or conference has regulations and consequences for "dirty" rushing/recruitment/membership intake.

There are different guidelines and perhaps more leniency for NIC as compared to NPC, but I'm sure some regulations and consequences exist. Our organizations didn't become as old and prevalent as they are without regulations against improperly interacting with aspirants and improperly bringing in new members, including but not limited to promising membership and hazing.

In fact, for some organizations, promising someone membership before they have gone through the membership process can be considered hazing or improper member conduct if something happens that prevents the person from becoming a member. Or, the person becomes a member and it is discovered that the person should not have become a member.

There are definitely rules regarding conduct during pledging/intake, but I've seen nothing for people that are rushing. I can only see that working in a structured/formal recruitment setting, anyway.

If they exist, I don't know of them.

We've told people they were shoo (or shoe?) ins...whether or not they are or not. We've dirty rushed if necessary, etc etc.

If there are rules, I'm not sure most fraternities play by them.

@ knightshadow

You're saying that the NIC doesn't have regulations and guidelines (even if considered minuscule and widely ignored) prior to an applicant being accepted for pledging/intake? I can't imagine the NIC organizations not foreseeing a reason to have formal guidelines for rush despite how informal rush is.

:) But, as an active bringing in new members, wouldn't it be your responsibility to know the guidelines and whether or not any exist? You all don't receive training for bringing in new members?

It may very well be the bolded.

Sidebar/
I noticed that my original post stated "rush/recruitment/membership intake." "Membershp intake" was intended to refer to aspirants prior to applying and prior to being accepted (or not) for membership intake.
/Sidebar

I'm saying if they exist I've never followed them nor heard of them.

That doesn't mean they don't exist.

Nope.

I mean, we don't. Procedures for others may be different.

I think the instructions would be:
"Don't be a creeper."
"Don't rush creepers."
"Bring over as many girls as possible."

Sorry, that post was for knightshadow. That's why we should use the quote function. :)

From what I've learned, NIC is more concerned with its member organizations than it is with how its member organizations are operating. There are guidelines that say what the national organizations must do, but the day-to-day is not a concern of NIC.

As far as recruitment, this is all I could find:

Statement of Position on Recruitment

The North-American Interfraternity Conference and its member fraternities believe friendship leads to membership. To effectively employ that as a strategy, NIC-member fraternities pursue a recruitment model based on an unrestricted, year-round commitment to actively seek prospective members who share a commitment to the fraternal values of scholarship, leadership and service.

The NIC and member fraternities have long advocated a year-round model of unrestricted recruitment - discouraging campuses and fraternity chapters from recruiting new members during limited times throughout the year and from using the term "rush" to label a time-specific effort to attract new members to a fraternity chapter.

Recruitment is the life blood of every chapter, and in addition to year-round opportunities to seek new members the Standards of the NIC state that host institutions and campus IFCs will not prohibit NIC member fraternities from recruiting. To prohibit a group from recruiting is communicating to the organization that there is no support for the group to improve, grow, or even continue to survive. The NIC is opposed to this prohibition in ANY and ALL situations.

To encourage effective implementation of, and active engagement in, a year-round recruitment strategy, the NIC and member fraternities provide resources and educational forums for undergraduates and alumni. The NIC also offers Strategic Consultations on campus, as well as the annual IFC Academy. Open to any council officer or advisor who wishes to attend, the Academy exists to advance NIC Standards implementation and support both fledgling and veteran councils.

OK, I thought you meant after an aspirant/rushee has been accepted.

To the best of my knowledge, because of how different the members are, NIC doesn't have any rules regarding membership. Local IFCs might of course.

Pardon me as I just learned the difference between NIC and IFC a year or so ago. I always called it IFC and didn't know that was the local entity until some GCer cyber smacked me one day. LOL.

Okay, so IFCs may have regulations and consequences. That's interesting and I'd be interested to see whether that is or isn't the case.

ETA: When I talk about regulations and consequences, I'm not saying they have to come from the council or conference. I was simply saying that the regulations and consequences should exist for the NIC fraternities regardless of whether they come from NIC, IFC, or the fraternities themselves.

;)

TBH, I haven't heard of local IFCs having consequences, either. The IFCs I'm familiar with usually host a "Meet The Greeks"-type event, but after that, it's (for lack of a better term) a free for all.

It was still a valid question as the NPC does have rather strict national rules about recruitment.

I'm thinking any "consequences" would be more for things like bidding people who aren't eligible (grades, class standing if it's deferred rush, people who aren't enrolled at the school etc) knowingly.

Bidding =/= rushing, though :)

But yeah, in those situations, the consequences would come from school or the individual fraternities, not NIC or IFC.

My ETA above clarified that I was saying that these regulations and consequences (hopefully) exist regardless of whether they come from the fraternities, NIC, or IFC. The notion that the regulations do not exist (regardless of where they come from) or that they MIGHT exist "but who knows" is baffling to me.

Bidding =/= rushing but there's inappropriate stuff that tends to happen before you get to improper bidding.

Yea, I saw the ETA, but I was responding to 33girl's post.

And in NIC world, you're told to check out each organization to see where you'll best fit. It's up to the rushee to make sure he gets to know as many people as possible so he can make an informed decision. It's not really "dirty" rushing because everyone is encouraged to use "365 recruitment" -- therefore, there aren't silent periods or times when it's inappropriate to talk to a rushee.

Bidding someone who isn't eligible, though, is a different story.

The NIC isn't really concerned with being Big Brother like the NPC is (I'm using the term 'Big Brother' kind of loosely). From what I know, the NIC is just concerned with ensuring good relations between all of its member orgs, not making sure that they're all functioning exactly the same.

Usually, IFCs have rules on "dirty rushing." I know that my school's IFC doesn't allow bids to be given out between the start of summer and the beginning of Rush. Otherwise, the rules are pretty loosely laid out.

First, it might honestly be just an expression and not a guarantee...somebody could have just thrown "oh don't worry, you have a ton in common with us, you're a shoo in" out there to show that he thinks the rushee will get a bid. He might not have meant that he's actually been discussed as a shoo in. I'm sure the context would make it all clear.

Second, I really have no problem with somebody saying this if they truly are a shoo-in. Our chapter never made a final decision until the night before bid day, but I know that some chapters make decisions on certain pledges before school even starts.

Third, I don't think it's dirty rushing. Unlike NPC recruitment, fraternity recruitment is not about seeing every chapter and giving everybody a fair shot. In fact, quite the opposite...we were usually skeptical of a guy if he was not rushing us solely. So saying things like that to keep somebody looking at one chapter only is OK in my book.

On the topic of dirty rushing, I don't think there are national rules for us like there are for NPC. Campuses almost always have dirty rushing rules though. Mine certainly did. The thing about fraternities though is that not one chapter on campus followed the rules. Nobody turned each other in either because of how hypocritical it would be. The most common infractions were hosting secret parties during rush week and taking star rushees out to lunches or sports games before school starts.

Now that I think about it, we have a few rules from our local IFC (but they're not national rules because I don't they could manage in a non-formal setting)

No hotboxing (that's what she said)
No getting rushees drunk during formal rush.

I mean, I was a Rho Chi and I'm pretty sure those were the only "infractions" we were suppose to be looking for.

Telling someone they are going to get a bid is not dirty rushing. In fact, it's a great tactic if the person loves the chapter. They won't bother looking elsewhere if they know they're getting a bid. IFC-unfriendly? Perhaps.

But, again, nothing is set in stone until the chapter votes and bids are handed out.

Dirty rushing would be telling someone, "Hey, all the other groups gave out their bids, so if you didn't receive one we're the only group you're getting a bid from, so you better accept otherwise you won't be in greek life. This bid is only good for right now."

Now, people from bigger schools might laugh and say there is no way that could happen. If IFC doesn't make its authority known and you have a useless greek advisor, this can happen. A group on my campus was notorious for doing this and ended up having people accept, only to get offered bids to other groups a day or two later. The rushees who signed the bid were then forced to stay with that group or drop out, since the other groups didn't want to deal with any baggage. Thankfully, our IFC improved greatly and now have a more active greek advisor.

It's hard to prove dirty rushing since you don't want to be 'that guy.' The person it happens to has to report it, otherwise it becomes hearsay between groups.

You can't smoke pot with the rushees???

Haha no pot is def okay with IFC, just no more than two people talking to them at the same time.