Informing Alums their legacy was released
 

Good morning :)

Is it now standard practice to notify the Alum that their legacy going through Recruitment has been released? And if so, who at the chapter level is normally responsible for this? A collegiate? An alumna?

When I got that call I was caught off guard. And it was very difficult knowing before my child knew.

That would be a policy that would probably differ based on each sorority and sometimes each chapter.

agreed. I can only speak for my sorority, and it is our national policy that we do not contact alums to notify them when a legacy is released

I sure would not want to be the advisor making those calls for a chapter!

AoPiMommy, we try to notify to AOII in question as a courtesy anytime a legacy is released. Ideally this would be before the PNM is notified so that the AOII sister isn't the "last to know" and can be prepared to offer support to her PNM when she calls upset. Usually an alum calls with the news, but that is not always possible.

I'm sorry that your daughters were released, but Im glad you got the courtesy call. As hard as it is to know before they did, many sisters complain when they didn't receive the call that they were blindsided.

Speaking only for Phi Mu, it used to be standard practice to notify the member when a PNM legacy was released. Within the last few years, however, that policy has changed--I believe it was because of privacy concerns.

I may have mentioned this before. I went through NPC recruitment as an undergrad, because I was curious. When I was released by the chapter of which I was a legacy, my mother was contacted. That part was ok. It was the fact that the alumna (who coincidentally was in my mother's pledge class) said something to the effect of "You know she isn't XYZ material." That set my mother off.

I think these calls/letters can go south VERY easily and have to be handled with the utmost sensitivity.

Whooooaaaaa. Who gets off on saying something like that to a PNM's MOTHER?

I suppose if it was handled sensitively it might be ok. I dunno, I could live without this practice.

I think it would be a terrible call to make or receive, no matter who did it or how it was done. I can totally relate to your first gut reaction - would have probably been mine too!
Maybe this is why more groups are doing away with the practice? I have had lots of phone calls after the pnm was cut and reported back to legacy relation, and I have talked those alums through it. It is kind of nice to be able to say, "Who knows what those actives were thinking? This is rush and it is a crazy animal. Anything can happen." Not a great answer but better than saying something negative.

in my 2nd post I was trying to describe - albeit insensitively - what I was feeling. My apologies for venting on the boards.

I encourage any member who has a bad experience with these conversations to call their headquarters to discuss the issue. I don't think this needs to be an accusatory conversation but rather a discussion to improve the process. If the program needs to be abolished, so be it, but it may just be that the people making these calls need to be better educated on how to make a proper call to a sister to relay this kind of news. I'm sure that once you give the news, many people feel pressured to give a "Why." (Not even by the sister, but a personal feeling of pressure because they feel bad about having to deliver such news.) This is not appropriate, since any reason will just end up being hurtful no matter how reasonable it sounds to the person giving the reason. The point of the call is ONLY to give the sister a heads up so she is prepared to council her PNM, not to explain reasoning behind the release.

AoPiMommy...don't worry about it! Alpha Love!

My first position in my chapter was Recs Chair. We had specially printed cards to send out to alumnae whose legacy was released. It was something like "AB Chapter regretfully informs (alumna name) that your legacy (PNM name) was released from rush. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact (Province Director) at 555-555-5555."

Of course, the times which those cards were used were few and far between - there just weren't as many legacies at our school that other schools would have.

I'm afraid that Legacy/Phone Calls is not something that is touchy everywhere, it doesn't matter the chapter. One of my BFs is a Kappa and she's shared stories of phone calls about their legacies. (anonymous of course!)

Yes, there are sometimes chapters who have collegians call who still need some maturity when it comes to handling delicate news and phone calls.

But I think the biggest problem is setting expectations with the alum who think that either a) the adviser calling was personally responsible in voting or b) place WAY too much pressure on their legacy.

I was a rush/recruitment adviser for several years at a JWH chapter and thankfully only on two occasions did a phone call take a turn for the worse. and I consider myself tactful and professional.

On both occasions the mom/alumna just could not wait for their legacies to rush and they contacted us in the months leading up to it, etc. etc..

I couldn't get these particular alumnae to understand that it wasn't MY choice, it's just how the cards fell. I wasn't a horrible person that schemed to release their daughters and be unceremonious or undignified about it. All of you should know how little say alumnae have in how collegians vote. You're just there to manage the process.

The first mother was absolutely insisting to know why. I should have said that it was just how the processed worked and let it be.

The daughter was miserable at our functions and actually told the girls she didn't want to be there, and so I made the mistake of saying "She says she is more comfortable with some of the other sororities. She will probably be happier with another group of girls, it will work out for the best."

Terrible mistake. That created such a firestorm, I should not have said that. The mom called the poor daughter to dress her down for having told the girls how she felt. Then GA's are getting phone calls. We're trying to get our lists in to the office on time. It was such a disruption that consumed more time than it should have.

This mom continued to call me personally, months later to continue to rant and say that the sorority her daughter pledged is far superior and wonderful and that she's glad she didn't pledge us, etc. etc. and for YEARS she would talk about me badly to anybody who would listen.

And the second occasion was a recent alumna and was so upset about her legacy being released and I just dreaded making that phone call because I knew it was going to end up being trouble no matter what I said.

Sure enough recent alumna blew her top and even went so far as to threaten to "go find me" which thankfully did not happen.

At the end of the day, I think that this tradition of calling shows that we care about our sisters and their feelings enough to reach out to them.

Ok, you could have said it differently, but to be fair you had no idea the mother would be batshit crazy.

I believe we had a case of that at our chapter, but we get few legacies, so at least incidents are rare.

Gamma Phi Beta's policy is to leave the informing up to the PNMs, to protect their privacy. It is their recruitment, not the relation's.

Sister stalkers are never fun. :D

You know, that is a really good way to look at it. The courtesy that is extended to the alum is that of considering her daughter as a unique pnm due to her background with XYZ group, nothing more.

The chapter where I advise has a procedure put in place when legacies get released. We've had our share of angry phone calls to the house that have been answered by poor random sisters who've gotten really griped at. The easiest part of the procedure is that only particular people are allowed to answer the house phone during and right after formal recruitment. :)

AOPilicious, I think you must be a very strong sister to have volunteered to deliver those painful phone calls. I'm sorry two of them took such a horrible and unexpected turn.

Although it's easier not to call the alumna sister at all and cite privacy concerns of the PNM, the reality is that the alumna is your sister and the PNM is not. You have a stronger obligation to your sister than to the PNM.

I have two little girls, whose college experiences are many years in the future. When I read the recruitment threads on GC, I sometimes fast-forward to when my daughter might be that tearful PNM who was cut from her favorite house. I can't change the outcome and I can't take her pain away, but if I have a little advance warning I can be prepared to help her cope like only a mother can.

Occasionally, you may encounter a psycho mom like the two AOPilicious had to deal with. But overall, your sister will appreciate you helping her help her daughter through a painful experience.

In my chapter, legacies got an auto pass to Round 2. If we released a legacy, we had to do it after 2nd round. If she made it through our doors for 3rd round, she had a bid. Period.

If we released a legacy, one of our Alumni Advisors would call the mom, etc. In my four years, we released only one legacy...

Sad story. We once had a legacy whose grandmother was a sister. She wrote a three page letter, sent a half dozen photos. This was the youngest granddaughter and the only one who had ever gone to a school with our house on campus.

So, we had this girl on lockdown, and when she came in the door, one of the sweetest South Georgia girls started telling her that we'd heard so much about her from her grandmother. And the girl said, "My grandmother is crazy, and I have no intention of pledging this house".

That was the only time we ever released a legacy before second round, and as it turns out, she cut us too.

Go fig.

poor grandma!

I wonder if, while more impersonal than a phone call, an well-written (form) email might be the way to go on this nowadays. Something along the lines of:



Dear Sister,

This message is to inform you that we are releasing Patty PNM from our next round of Formal Recruitment Parties. Please know that we did not come to this decision lightly, and that details of this decision cannot be discussed. We are informing you out of respect to you as our sister. We wish you and Patty PNM luck in the future, and hope you will continue to support Alpha Beta Gamma.

You may contact us at 555-555-5555, but once again, details regarding why your legacy was released cannot be discussed.

Respectfully,
Sarah Sister
Formal Recruitment Chair (Advisor, VP, whatever)



Like I said, it's not as personal as a phone call, but I think it would be a solution that is respectful on all ends. If the mom/sister/grandmom ends up crying/raging, she can do so in private, without saying something she doesn't mean, and active sisters/advisors are spared from that (and accidentally revealing TMI). The letter might also state when Patty PNM will be receiving her invite list, so the relative can make the decision whether to call the legacy before or after getting the list.

awww. i feel like that would break her poor grandmother's heart!

I have to say I appreciate the fact that my GLO no longer requires us to make those unpleasant phone calls.

As a mom, I can understand another mom's desire to get a heads up that her daughter has been released. But the typical response is always "Why?" No mom I've ever encountered accepts that membership selection is confidential and we can't tell you. That's when things almost always get ugly. So my best advice is to prepare your daughter (or granddaughter, or sister) for this potential possibility before Recruitment even starts.

From a logistical point, it would be nearly impossible at many chapters to even consider making those calls during Recruitment. It's not uncommon in the South for chapters that have 75, 100, or more legacies go through Recruitment. Membership selection meetings can run until the wee hours of the morning. Then invitation lists must be turned into Panhellenic by say 5am. PNMs received their invitations at maybe around 9am and parties for the next round could start as early as 10am.

Advisors need sleep too. Hate to admit it, but we're not as young as these collegians. Having a few minutes to say "Good Morning" to your family when you've barely seen them all week is also a good thing. Time for a shower is nice too. :) I doubt those things would be possible if numerous phone calls needed to be made to moms -- and those calls are never short.

Poor grandma. And what a rude thing for the PNM to say! If she didn't want to pledge her legacy sorority, she could at least have sucked it up for one party and then cut your chapter.

I've had to make those calls before and it's not fun. But what's even less fun is having the younger sis going thru recriuitment at one school and having her sister at a different school in the chapter you are advising and no one calling the older sis when she requested that she be called (place on rec for this). Ouch! And right in the middle of me trying to get the chapter for an already contentious recruitment! I think you owe your sister the courtesy of a phone call...esp if she's asked for it.

Gamma Phi Beta's official rec. form specifically states that the sorority relative/recommending member will not be notified if a legacy is released, in order to protect the privacy of the PNM.

I spoke with a sister in my alumnae chapter last night about this. She had sent in a rec for her niece who had been released and she wasn't notified and felt she should have been. Just food for thought.

As a recruitment advisor, I wouldn't want to make that call but having been a rho gamma as an undergrad, I'd be prepared to do so if need be.

I just took the chapter adviser position for my sorority and was informed that I will be making these phone calls if we release a legacy. I am really hoping that I don't have to make these calls....it would definitely be a difficult conversation to make....

Better get prepared, I imagine you will be making one of these calls - depending on the chapter you are advising.

right now we have two influences and 3 legacies.. (last time i checked)
i dont think i have to call for influences though...

i think these phone calls will definitely have to have a written script so i dont get flustered mid phone call!

As an example of how one NPC sorority deals with this:

Delta Zeta recently published its national legacy and rec policies in its magazine, The Lamp, Issue #1 for 2011. The policies, which address the "notification" issue, appear on pages 10 -11 of:

http://www.deltazeta.org/aspnet_clie...-2011-LAMP.pdf

Disclaimer: I'm not a Delta Zeta. I'm not claiming to be one. Questions about the info in The Lamp probably should be answered by actual knowledgeable DZs.

Are nieces considered legacies in your organization? If not, then the niece was probably not extended legacy courtesies and thus your sister was not entitled to a call regardless of her personal feelings on the matter. We had a similar situation when the cousin of an alumna was released last year.

Ours does not. It says alumnae will be notified IF their contact information is update and correct.

For every sorority relative who doesn't want to know, there is probably one or more who would be upset not to get the phone call. Obviously, each GLO handles this according to their own rules, but I will never forget how upset one of my APH friends was when her sorority released her daughter right before pref but did not notify her. She had written recs for hundreds of other girls, for years, to that very chapter, so her name should have been familiar to them. She felt incredibly hurt that the chapter did not have the courtesy of letting her know in advance that her daughter was not being invited back for pref. So. when her sobbing daughter called to say she was released, the mother was not prepared emotionally and had to regroup very fast to encourage her daughter to stay the course and finish out recruitment.

In that situation, the mom was an alum who had been active in an APH and was able to support the daughter by reminding her of the other groups that still wanted her very, very much. She was disappointed and upset with her own sorority's chapter, nonetheless, as it is their national's policy to inform the legacy's relative. The silver lining in that story is that her daughter ended up in my GLO and has been incredibly happy there.

Not everyone is well-versed in how this works, and what relatives need to understand is that, while you may be given an update from the chapter, you are not owed an explanation, heartbreaking as the result may be. I have to imagine that is absolutely the worst part of it for the moms, sisters or grandmothers. If it happens to my daughter someday, I will be mad as hell, but I'll have to find a way to remember that you must prepare for the worst, and not let that disappointment take away from the potential for the legacy to find a happy home in another GLO.

I think a better thing to have would be a section on the website or in the magazine that says "Alpha Beta chapter has a shit ton of girls going through rush. If the chapter has to call every single person who wrote a rec they will have coronaries and also, won't have time to prepare for the next day's rush activities. Please take this into consideration."

Some people just don't understand the AMOUNT of girls going through. I know if you told most of my chapter sisters that there are schools where 1000-2000 women go through rush, they would be absolutely flabbergasted.

nieces are not considered legacies, nor are cousins, and the chapter does not have to call the alumna.

I had the dreaded experience this year. My daughter knew how much I loved my sorority and how I am active in the local alum group. I was so excited to have her go through rush! Unfortunately, my daughter was released before the first round of invites. She went to the 20 party open house and then was dropped. I was shocked as the chapter did not follow legacy policy. I know it is very competitive at her school so I was happy when she pledged another house.