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Bad Stuff in CU Boulder
A sorority at CU-Boulder has gotten in trouble for a hazing incident. There are two sides to the story. I don't want to mix any facts up please visit www.denverpost.com or rockymountainnews.com
There was alchohol poisoning involved, but luckily no deaths! |
direct link to the story
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I read the newspaper account.
Seems like CU's attitude is to keep hands off and give chapters all the rope they need to hang themselves. We closed our chapter there three times for alcohol and drug problems. The third time followed local alums coming up with well over $1 million to refurbish the house. It was a showplace. They trashed it in a very few months. It was sold to the University. I get ill when I think of it. I don't know that we'll ever recolonize in Boulder unless the University takes a more proactive position in Greek affairs. It's a real shame since it is a great campus, and we had an outstanding chapter there for many years, and many great and influential alums in the area. |
FRGC
Today I attended the Front Range Greek Conference. There I was told that there is a chapter-unmentioned so could be either a sorority or fraternity- closing by thanksgiving at Cu-Boulder. I was talking to some cu sorority sisters and they said many houses on campuses are either going on probation, getting off probation, or on probation. I thought that was pretty sad.
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Once they would start monitoring alcohol consumption with us, they would have to do the same with all off-campus student housing. Obviously I am not condoning what this chapter did, but I can't imagine what a huge chunk CU would be biting off if they took on the responsibility of "watching over" off campus buildings (Greek or not Greek). |
just my 2 cents...
While the houses at my univeristy are really on campus the parcels of land are considered off campus housing. However, the Univeristy does have jurisdiction over what goes on there. If the greek organizations are going to represent the University then naturally there are rules that are going to be imposed. I personally don't have a problem with this because I think it helps bring a more positive image to greek life by regulating the "stereotypical" greek activities.
I thought it was pretty sad that in that article the director of greek life made hazing sound like it was no big deal and just commonplace. How will greek life ever successfully survive under that kind of leadership?:confused: To me, it's pretty disheartening.... |
33,
The story above is a only a very small part of the situation at Colorado. And this is only the latest installment. Many universities want the Greek System to go away. The past three administrations at CU (at least) have been diabolical about it. They seem to feel (perhaps rightly so) that if they keep a more "hands off" attitude that the chapters will dig their own holes and be closed by their Nationals or by breaking laws so there will be legal reasons -- as opposed to university codes -- to close the chapters. At least to some extent, it seems to work |
You mean, it's one of those deals where get to the point of saying "just kill the whole system and get it over with!"
Yeah, our school would probably be happy if Greeks just went away, but on the other hand, they're not actually going to exert any effort to do it. Plus, we don't have million dollar houses either. Sounds like somebody wants some real estate. :p |
Yup.
Real Estate could be part of it for sure. The former Delt House is now the CU Department of Continuing Education. |
The University, with their "hands-off" approach is not only hurting the organization, but could end up shooting themselves in the foot if someone decides to sue. I mean, yes, they'll sue the organization, but from my experiences with this, they'll go after the University as well. And while CU may want to give the groups enough rope to hang themselves, if they are recognizing these groups as affiliated with campus, they could hang themselves too. I think CU needs to take a more proactive, hands on approach with their greeks.
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Just wanted to state for the record that CU is supposed to be a 'dry campus' as well. The fraternity will probably get probation for this. |
how sad
in this day and age...it's a pity that people don't get it.
i think you are totally there when you think in terms of real estate. mmcat :confused: |
Here is a most interesting story from the Rocky Mountain News where the CU Greek Liason actually takes the side of the fraternities. His comments sound a tad on the sexist side, but that's another story. I have read in Risk Management mailings that much of the damage to fraternity houses (which raise insurance rates to almost unworkable levels) is attributed to visiting sorority women and other non chapter members. I don't have much experience in that, so I don't know.
Frats on hot seat after hazings CU Greek liaison says guys should beware of women who want to come over and party By Owen S. Good, News Staff Writer BOULDER - The University of Colorado's Greek liaison on Monday defended the school's fraternities, downplaying their role in hazing incidents such as the binge-drinking initiation rite that left two sorority pledges hospitalized last week. "The poor guys. I mean, the girls go over there and use their powers over men, so to speak, to let them use their location, because (sororities) absolutely cannot have (alcohol) at their location," Thomas Lorz of CU's Greek Activities Office said. The Oct. 29 incident remains under investigation by school officials. Lorz did not identify the specific fraternity house where the Kappa Alpha Theta pledges were required to consume 14 drinks to satisfy a pledge assignment. But he said the investigation is "looking at all destinations" involved in the incident. Lorz said sororities unofficially ask to use fraternity houses because alcohol is strictly forbidden at all sorority events. CU Panhellenic Association President CJ Orr disputed that fraternity men are somehow charmed into lending their chapter houses, but acknowledged that sororities do ask to come over to conduct pledge activities. "They want sorority girls over there to interact," Orr said, but "in most cases the men invite the women over. It's not as popular for sorority women to ask, 'Can we come over to your house?' " Her association "drills into" its members that fraternities are not de facto bars for their social functions, Orr said. "They still do that, they go over where they don't think they have any rules, and that causes problems - especially with hazing, because they feel it's 'no holds barred' at the fraternity," she said. Lorz said the alcohol ban is almost nationwide for sororities and accounts for insurance rates almost half of what fraternities pay. Some sororities' insurance policies specify that, for example, no benefits would be paid for a fire at which liquor bottles are discovered, Orr said. "The fraternity houses bear the brunt of the social needs for fraternities and sororities," Lorz said. "It's not widespread, but it's not unheard of for the sororities to use the fraternities in this way. "We will also make a general announcement to the fraternities: 'Don't let the women use your property for these things,' " Lorz said. Copyright 2001, Rocky Mountain News. (Article also distributed via Scripps Howard News Service) |
Yeah, that's some major BS!!!:mad: Those poor fraternity men being forced to host a party involving getting freshmen girls wasted. I bet those Theta girls practically had to put guns to their heads. Or as Mr. Lorz so nicely pointed out, they must have manipulated the weak willed men with their evil female trickery! Have they no shame?? Why, they must be witches. Yes, that must be it - have them burned at the stake.
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Guess I missed when it became 1901 instead of 2001. I really feel for the "poor fraternity men", as a woman, I know I use my wiles all the time. Give me a break. All that "liasion" does is perpetuate the myths and stereotypes.
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I sent the stupid, sexist bastard an email. OH MY GOD, I'm so pissed right now. Are you kidding me?? Use our powers?!? What are, wizards or sorcerers? This guy obviously has his head so far up his ass, until he is fired, he will lead this Greek System into the ground. |
OK all, here's my response back from the Greek Life guy at CU. I was pretty harsh, but his reply was too lame!
Heather, Please do not believe everything that you see in the media. I was misquoted. I am a 10 year veteran of the Greek Advising world and want to reassure you that I would never say something as ludicrous as was attributed to me in that media report. I am a Greek Life professional and spend the bulk of my time trying to keep both fraternity men and sorority women from participating in destructive behavior such as this most recent incident. I have been a staunch supporter of the greek community for my entire tenure as Greek Liaison. I have testifyed before the state of Colorado for the Hazing Law that was passed a few years ago. I have hosted numerous national conferences related to underage drinking and the liability that both fraternities and sororities expose themselves to. I want to assure you that no one in this incident is being excused for their behavior because their are male or female. Laws and rules were broken and all involved parties are being held accountable. Please use this as a lesson in life. The media is not always accurate, and before you lash out with a personal attack at someone, you should always check first before you break out your harmful words. Interfraternally Thomas A Lorz (303)492-0769 Greek Liaison fax(303)492-8922 The University of Colorado UMC 420 CB 207 Boulder CO 80309-0207 |
GGEEEEEZZZZZZ what kind of baby food is this clown inhaling?
He sounds as good as Gene Kelly Dances:rolleyes: If he is Greek Affairs advisor woe be the Greeks there!:p :p |
OK all :) I sent an email to NPC in hopes that they would respond to this guy's ridiculous comments, and lo and behold, we have the response. Here is what the NPC Chairwoman had to say!
____ November 11, 2001 Mr. Thomas A. Lorz, Greek Liaison UMC 420, Campus Box 207 University of Colorado Boulder, CO 80309-0207 Dear Mr. Lorz: I read your comments in the Rocky Mountain News with disappointment. As distressed as all of the National Panhellenic Conference groups are about the October 29 incident, it never occurred to us that a university representative would suggest that the women “used their powers over men” to obtain the use of the Fraternity house for this activity. I know that you have been in the Student Affairs field and at the University of Colorado for several years so this is not a comment that can be excused due to inexperience or naiveté. It is true as you stated that alcohol cannot be consumed or stored on the property of women’s Fraternity houses. It is also true that the NPC groups represented on your campus each have a policy which prohibits them from having a co-sponsored social event at a Fraternity house unless that event is alcohol-free. This policy was put in place for many reasons but one of them was to prevent our women from using the men’s Fraternity houses as a means to obtain alcohol for underage members. Your comments don’t indicate any knowledge of this policy which, although new, is vigorously pursued. Successful implementation has been aided on some campuses where the Fraternity Sorority Advisor works closely with the women’s groups to assure compliance. The women of the National Panhellenic Conference will continue to work with each other, with the North American Interfraternity Conference members, and with the members of the NASPA Fraternity Sorority (Network) Knowledge Community to change the alcohol-based culture on our campuses in North America. It would be heartening to think that all university representatives would support this effort. Suggesting that the Fraternity men are not able to think for themselves is an insult to the intelligence and strength of character of the men who attend the University of Colorado. I would think your undergraduates would find this attitude offensive. I hope that you will be available to meet with the representatives of the women’s groups in Washington D.C. later this month. We are sincerely interested in changing the alcohol culture at the University of Colorado and will continue to work with the women and with you to minimize this kind of behavior in the future. Sincerely, Sally Grant, Chairman ___ |
YEah Sally-now here's a classy sorority woman!
I can't believe the reply he gave you Shadokat!:mad: |
what a freaking tool. He needs to be fired, and then strung up by his toenails and whacked like a pinata by the very women he demeaned. What a loser. But you know, us EVIL women-yeah they will get him.
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HOT DAMN
Please keep us updated on this situation!
If most people think, the School Greek Advisor is paid by the school! They will do the bidding of and where fore and where bys of the school! Who do the most for Homecoming? Who do the most contribuiting back to the money wise College? Who serve on College Committees? Who have the overall highest grade average? Everytime my ALMA MATER calls for a donation, I tell them I donate to my Fraternitys Educational Foundation! I paid my money to go there, I pay my taxes to support it! i just founf out today, Tulane cost 10,000 a sem. not including living! Hell If I made that kind of money in a small business ? Well i could be king for a year!:rolleyes: |
what century, sir
mr. lorz...where have you been?
the world has moved on and apparently passed you by. this whole scene is terribly depressing considering how far women have come. it's said to think some are mentally back in the 50's mentally regarding the how and hte why of women. mmcat :eek: :eek: |
Agreed.
And as was pointed out above, his comments don't make the fraternity men involved sound like rocket scientists either. Not that either of the Greek organizations (women or men) were all that bright in this situation. |
In case anyone hasn't already heard, Kappa Alpha Theta has been suspended now. Don't know the whole story, but I heard this today.
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Here are the details with no comment from our friend Mr. Lorz:
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 23:11:53 -0800 From: Fraternity/Sorority Newsclips <doug.case@sdsu.edu> Subject: CU sorority suspended after alleged hazing The Associated Press November 20, 2001 CU sorority suspended after alleged hazing BOULDER, Colo. -- The Kappa Alpha Theta sorority has suspended its University of Colorado chapter because of an alleged hazing incident last month that left two pledges hospitalized with alcohol poisoning. The length of the suspension was not set but the sorority's national leaders have ordered the Boulder chapter to cancel all social events for the remainder of the school year and host hazing-awareness seminars. The chapter may be reinstated after it meets several requirements, said Liz Rinck, Kappa Alpha Theta's communications director. One of those conditions is that all sorority officers involved in the Oct. 30 initiation resign their positions. Rinck said the national office is still trying to determine who participated. Boulder police Sgt. Kurt Weiler said detectives also are investigating. Under Colorado law, hazing is a misdemeanor punishable by up to six months in jail. A 17-year-old Kappa Alpha Theta pledge told police she was blindfolded and taken to a fraternity house where she downed 11 alcoholic beverages off a list of 14 she was expected to drink. CU police found the girl on campus with injuries to her face, either the result of an assault or a fall. Officers took her to Boulder Community Hospital, where tests revealed she had a blood-alcohol level of .202, more than four times Colorado's legal limit for driving. Neither university officials nor police have released details of the second pledge, who was also hospitalized that night for alcohol poisoning. University officials said they would wait for a police report before deciding what to do about students who participated in the initiation. (c) 2001 The Associated Press. |
Colorado has a legal limit of .05!!!!! That would be 3 drinks for a two hundred pound man in 2 hours . . . wow the state must be M.A.D.D.
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I'm not sure, but I think the .05 limit is for "impaired," and the DUI limit is .1. Again, I'm not 100% sure of that.
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According to FraternalNews there will be no criminal hazing charges filed against the Thetas. Also, it looks like Phi Gams were the fraternity involved.
I'm almost glad the Delt Chapter at CU was closed since the former Delt Shelter is right across the street from the Theta House. |
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Yeah, the thought occurred to me. You know how weak we Delts are when it comes to those special feminine powers.
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Here's the latest update: Good news and bad...
Associated Press December 7, 2001 Sorority sisters ticketed after students suffer alcohol poisoning BOULDER, Colo. -- Two sorority sisters have been ticketed for providing alcohol to a minor the night of a sorority function that left two University of Colorado students hospitalized with alcohol poisoning. Katherine E. Koban and Cameron K. Reed, both 19, were issued summonses for the municipal charge, said Boulder police Sgt. Paul Reichenbach. The women are members of the Kappa Alpha Theta sorority. Police said there is not enough evidence to pursue hazing charges in connection with the sorority event. However, the function has spawned a hazing inquiry by CU officials and the indefinite suspension of the Kappa Alpha Theta sorority's CU chapter. Reichenbach said about 25 newly-initiated Kappa Alpha Theta members gathered Oct. 29 at a field on campus for a party organized by sophomores in the sorority. The group drove to three locations, eventually ending up at the Phi Gamma Delta fraternity. Sorority members consumed alcohol at each location. After the party, two women were taken to the emergency room at Boulder Community Hospital with alcohol poisoning. One victim, a 17-year-old, may have been assaulted after arriving blindfolded at the fraternity's house and drinking 11 alcoholic beverages. Reichenbach said the incident does not meet the criteria in Colorado's statute on hazing because the women were already members of the sorority. He said the university was conducting its own investigation and may take disciplinary action. The Phi Gamma Delta fraternity has also launched an investigation into its CU chapter. (c) 2001 The Associated Press. |
eeek eeek
so now what???
mmcat :rolleyes: |
Thats messed up. A list of drinks?? The girl may or may not have been assulted??
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OP,
There's some question whether the injured woman was assaulted or suffered facial injuries in a fall. Falls due to too much alcohol consumed by people at fraternity parties are very common. They make up significant part of fraternity insurance claims. That, of course, is one reason why so many nationals are pushing third party vendors and off site parties -- to limit liability. |
OP--
There is no question that these women were WAY over the legal level of intoxication. The news stories indicate that. Whether this girl fell down on her face or was assaulted, we'll probably never know, but allowing a 17 year old to drink that much and then walk home is reprehensible in itself. |
I'm not saying that it was a good thing. I hope I didn't come off like that. No, I just meant that why would they assume an assualt, and make it seem that way in the article??
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OP,
Because her face was a mess when she got to the hospital, and she couldn't or wouldn't explain what happened. Emergency Rooms generally assume the worst since that's what they see the most of. |
DA,
Oh...thanx man. |
This is interesting.
I would rather see the groups cooperate for a number of reasons, especially if there was, in fact, an assault. That's pretty serious stuff. On the other hand, the ongoing university investigation creates a kind of "double jeopardy" (not in the legal sense of the word) which is troubling in a town like "The Peoples Republic of Boulder" as it is sometimes called in these parts. Others call it, "thirty-five square miles, surrounded by reality." The university/Greek/town relationship there is strained at best. Although the police department there has taken its' lumps for the sterling handling of the Jon Benet Ramsey case, I would feel more comfortable for them to find one way or another so there can't be some kind of university "kangaroo court." The university administration seems to have a purposful "hands off and let them hang themselves, then we'll close them," attitude. All of which sounds like constructing a circular argument. But, that's Boulder. Due to that, I think I'd rather see this handled by the cops and courts where there is at least due process. Colorado Daily University of Colorado December 11, 2001 Police stonewalled at U. Colorado By Jessika Fruchter, Colorado Daily Boulder, Colo., police have stopped investigating the alcohol overdoses of two underage women after the Kappa Alpha Theta sorority and the Phi Gamma Delta fraternity, who are both believed to be involved, refused to cooperate with police. According to authorities, the Oct. 29 incident was initially believed to be a hazing ritual, but was later determined to be a post-initiation sorority event, involving 20 to 25 newly initiated Kappa Alpha sorority sisters. The women met at Farrand Field on the University of Colorado campus and were eventually brought to a party at the Phi Gamma Delta fraternity's house. After the party, the women were dropped off at their respective dormitories. The two women in question, who are 17 and 18 years old, were transported to Boulder Community Hospital shortly thereafter and treated for alcohol poisoning. The incident has been investigated by Boulder police and the sorority's national office and is still being investigated by University officials. While the sorority's national office has imposed sanctions on Kappa Alpha Theta, Boulder police say their investigation of underage drinking has come to an end because the sorority and the Phi Gamma Delta fraternity have remained tight-lipped about the specifics. "Initially the sorority was pretty cooperative," said Boulder police Detective Jeff Kessler. "But then they decided they didn't want to give names out." Kessler said he thought the chapter's decision came after receiving direction from the sorority's national office. "I guess they thought they had taken care of the problem internally," he said. "I can kind of understand that Š but, I know that there are more people (involved)." Kessler added that he had repeatedly contacted the Phi Gamma Delta fraternity and that officials would not return his calls. "I finally contacted their advisers and they had no idea what was going on," he said. "I definitely got the impression they (the fraternity members) were keeping them in the dark." Despite Kessler's frustration, at least one CU administrator seems satisfied with the sorority's cooperation. Bob Maust, principal investigator for CU's Matter of Degree program, an alcohol-education program, said he thought the sorority had done their part in addressing the issue. He noted that as part of their punishment, Kappa Alpha Theta has been required by its national office to sponsor an alcohol education program for the entire greek community. Maust added that sororities and fraternities are independent from the University, as many of the other student organizations are. "(For that reason) the sorority handled this matter internally," he said. To date Boulder police have identified sorority members Katherine Elizabeth Koban, 19 years old, and Cameron King Reed, 19 years old, as being involved. Kessler said he felt certain more people were involved with the Oct. 29 incident, but said no one could be identified. Koban and Reed were issued summons for unlawfully procuring alcohol for minors. Kessler said the charge carries a fine of only $ 100 dollars, but noted that the women may also be subject to sanctions from CU's office of judicial affairs. "The university can not take action against an organization," he said. "But, they can take action against individual people." (C) 2001 Colorado Daily |
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