Rushing again
 

Hey! I joined Greek Chat because I know that this is where I will get the straight up truth! I have searched online and on these forms and have gathered a lot of info but I wanted to ask you all specifically for my situation.

My school does formal rush in the spring. I rushed as a freshman but dropped on Preference night because I knew that the two sororities that asked me back were not at all for me. I am a Sophomore now and I would love to be a part of Greek life at my school. (My school is very small and competitive because of how many girls rush and how many are accepted into the Sororities). I would fall rush but I am studying abroad this semester (yes, as a sophomore).

I have a high GPA and my freshman year I was involved but not as much and I probably should have been. I am hoping to get letters of recommendations.

I am worried about these things:
1)I already rushed, does that look bad rushing again?
2)I am a sophomore rushing with the freshman
3)I cannot become involved at school the beginning of sophomore year because I am abroad so I may not stand out as much

Should I even rush? Do I have a chance?

Hopefully you all can lead me to make a good decision for myself.

I'm from a fraternity, but I'll give my perspective.

1. I'd say yes. I would look worse if you pledged and dropped. Then rerushed.. We've turned people down that have dropped other fraternities and rushed again, expectially after we gave them a bid the first time and they chose another. Maybe explain that you didn't pledge anyone.

2. Not a big deal at my campus. Freshman can be kind of risky. Young & dumb. Never pay dues, lower GPAs... so on.

3. I would see that being a problem. You'll do a lot after pledging and if you're not there for new member ed., you're not going to be initiated. Is there a smaller Spring rush? so that maybe you can do it in the Spring when you're back, rather than Fall and miss everything.

If you don't know anything about something (i.e. sorority recruitment), please don't offer advice.

Your response to No. 2 is totally off the mark for sorority recruitment at the majority of schools.

Would you drop out this time as well if you don't get the invites you want?

Just to clear it up, I would be rushing in the Spring not the Fall since i wont be at school.

There are only five sororities at my school and there are only three that I am interested in. If i get dropped by all three then yes, I would drop rush and then not do it again.

Those 3 didn't want you the first time around, why would they want you now? What has changed?

What is so wrong with the 2 sororities who were willing to give you a chance?

The other two have very nice girls but I was not as comfortable with them as the others-it like saying how did you know that the sorority you are in was perfect for you...how do you know that sorority was not perfect for you. You just know.

But yes, I understand the why would they want me now. What has changed is now my GPA is higher, I've done community service at my college and Ive met so many new girls and are friends with them who are now in the sororities that I would like to be a part of. Im just not sure if that is enough.

we don't know either. the best we can say is that if you really think you want to be in one of the 3 sororities that you liked your freshman year, sign up for formal recruitment and see what happens.

Is Spring informal, or formal? If it's informal, the number of sororities participating may vary.

sounds like formal is in the spring, with informal in the fall. she cant do informal because she'll be out of the country.

Did you actually go through pref round, and then not sign a bid card? Or did you drop out before going through pref?

If these girls you've met in the sororities are as close of friends as you believe, and they have spaces open, and your membership is something they want, THEY will come to YOU and ask if you're interested in membership...or they will bring you around to meet their other sisters. Have either of those things occurred?

If not, they're not your friends. They're acquaintances. And you probably won't have any better of a chance to get a bid, because there are going to be freshmen that have all the same things you do. And you're going to end up back at the same 2 sororities you didn't like the first time around. If you're lucky.

You seem like youre really interested in being in a sorority. If it's something of a big interest to you, I would suggest going ahead and doing it and see what happens. Since you have friends in the chapters you are interested in it MAY help you, or it may not. I have some good friends in chapters other than mine, but I would never fit into their chapter. So, it goes both ways.

But you certainly won't be getting a bid if you don't try. Really, all you have to lose is the money you have to pay to sign up for recruitment (if thats required) and not being in a sorority at all.

Good luck!

If you are on a competitive campus where the chapters usually take mostly freshmen, chances are you already had your best chance of getting a bid to a sorority that's "good enough" for you. Now you'll be away for an entire semester so you have no more opportunities to make a good impression and unless some of those sorority girls are now your besties, they won't care about you come formal. You will never know unless you actually go through recruitment, but my Magic Eight Ball predicts:

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/y...rush/8ball.jpg

I love that eight ball!!

It sounds like you've done what you can. Maybe your overseas campus will have activities available to you.

Keep in mind that chapters change. Also, you change as well, and you might feel differently about a chapter now than you did in the past. Membership is for a lifetime, and you won't lose your other friends by joining a GLO. Give all the chapters a fair chance.

Thank you all so much! I have gotten a lot of really good feedback to think about. I do plan on getting involved while overseas so maybe this will be a plus if i decide to go through with rush.

I couldn't have said it any better, myself. If you have already determined that you are "too good" to take a bid from one of the other two sororities on campus (on a very competitive campus), please safe yourself the time and just don't rush. If you are looking at recruitment with your nose in the air, you don't deserve sisterhood. You've already determined who is good enough and who isn't. Don't waste the time of incredible women who could potentially be your support systems for the rest of your life if you are just going to turn them down. Don't bother.

Thank you for your feedback and I do understand where you are coming from. I really don't want to waste my time or the sisterhood's times but I definitely do not think I am "too good" for any of the sororities on my campus! Gosh no!! I just do not think I am a good fit for those. Plus, the two sororities who "wanted me" are not competitive and they give bids to about anyone really. It is the other three that are competitive which unfortunately are the ones that I feel are more similar to me and my values. (And it is not because they are competitive and more selective that I like them if that crossed anyone's mind).

I understand i did it once, I probably should not go through it again to receive the same results (or no results because I have already dropped) but I just don't want to see like the girl who thought she was "too good".

What, do the other two groups slaughter puppies or something?

And your parenthetical doesn't mean much, because that's what it still comes across as.

Wow that did sound really pretentious of me!! The girls in the two sororities are really nice people but I personally cannot see myself hanging out with them, doing the kinds of activities they do etc...isn't each sorority different so that you can find where you feel most comfortable?

I do admit that sounded AWEFUL of me to say values because they have great values! I think I meant that we have differing personalities etc...

Anyway, I can't try and defend myself anymore, it isn't that important, I was just looking for advice and I received a lot of great feedback.

Man, lighten up on the girl. Yes, she got invited back to pref for two other sororities, and she said she didn't see herself as a fit. Let it go!

To I_Wish, I do agree with the advice that if you went through once and didn't receive a bid the first time to the orgs you were interested in, you are likely to have the same outcome, barring some miraculous change. So prepare yourself for that.

Best of luck, whatever you decide to do.

To the OP:

You have been given good feedback regarding the uphill battle that you may be facing.

My concern is that on a campus with only five sororities that you can't see your self in almost half of them. Really? No matter how you spin it that just comes off as elitist.

Consider this- a pledge class was added when you went through the first time, and now a second pledge class will be added this coming year. That is half the chapter turning over since you saw them during recruitment. Much can change.

You won't be greek if you don't go through recruitment. However, you likely won't be greek if you maintain this mentality. The two groups that you won't even consider may be your best shot at being in a sorority.

Go through with a very open mind. If one of your three works out then great. But think long and hard this semester about how much you want to be in a sorority and if you will honestly give either of the other 2 a chance.

Thank you shadokat :)

And yes! That is very true, for all I know I could go through rush and absolutely love one of the two that I think I don't now. I guess the key is an open mind which I will be sure to keep if I go through rush again.

It's always amazing to me when a pnm says there's "nothing wrong" with the only chapters who continue to see her as a membership fit. It usually says there's a disconnect between the way the pnm sees those chapters and their members and the way she sees herself. Multiple chapters usually aren't wrong about this kind of stuff.

i agree with shadokat---please don't poke the pnms.

pnms have every right to decide which sororities to go back to and which invitations and bids to accept , just as we, as sorority members, get to decide who to invite back.

Sure they do, however what people are expressing is that having that attitude going into rush again only hurts her chances. And her comments - as a non-member - went beyond the "I don't fit" into "They'll take anyone."

She doesn't seem particularly offended by the feedback.

Sorry, but this is pokeworthy. She has NO idea of the membership selection procedures of the two groups she is spurning. I also really wonder what the "kinds of activities they do" are.

At 18 years old, not a lot of college women are mature enough to understand sisterhood for a lifetime, and the fact that joining a struggling chapter may actually present itself as a leadership opportunity and the chance to mold a new reputation for a sorority. They are looking to find a group to fit in, and if it's the best group on campus, all the better.

We need to give the PNMs the benefit of the doubt in their choices and not second guess why they made them. When they say they had their reasons for cutting ABC, why should we run them down? I cut one good sorority because they were heavily, heavily into athletics and I figured they'd hate me when I didn't want to sign up for a sport. I cut one of those considered "top tier" because they were so condescending and rude to me and all those around me. I would've been ticked if someone on an anonymous board had said, "Yeah, we know you cut them because they were small, snob." I discussed this recently with a woman who was a PH officer when I helped advise at one SEC school--she said that she cut ABC when she rushed because they were so into winning the Greek musical shows and she figured they'd hate her when she began to sing. That chapter is fantastic.

Truth is, we have no idea why they cut who they cut. Actually, many of us hardly remember the reasons our teenage selves cut groups.

Yeah, in an ideal world, all the girls who were cut would band together and strengthen a smaller group. Why won't they? Because especially at a huge school , they will know at most a couple other girls who dropped out and especially in the South, no one (including PanHellenic) is going to hang out a banner that says "Meeting at 6 tonight for girls who dropped out of rush". Other teenagers would be too embarrassed to show up. Also, they would have to arrange something with a group that wanted to take them all on. How would they? And what would happen if the group didn't care for some of the girls?

Have you ever seen this in a small town? There's an older unmarried woman and some of the locals keep saying, "She didn't have to be single, Billy Bob and Bobby Bill wanted to marry her." She has to hear this crap the rest of her life even though both men might have been worthless crackers...why should she have to listen to people second-guessing what she felt to be the right decision for her? Why should we be playing Lofty Greeks With Insight who say, "You had the choice to be Greek, you cut the only groups who wanted you." That's horribly rude. You don't know why they cut them, you don't know why they were cut. Some people on here have been rude enough to say "your dream sororities didn't want you." How do you know? Actually at many big schools, the sororities would love to have dozens of the girls they cut but they had to cut huge numbers. Have you ever been in a room where the sorority is required to cut hundreds of girls in one night?:(

What gives anyone the right to decide why a teenager cuts a group? If you weren't there, you don't know.

Did you not read the part where she said she didn't want those groups because they'd give a bid to anyone?

And yes, actually I've been in a room where a sorority had to cut almost 500 in a night.

I did read it. And there have been several who've tried to say that they didn't cut based on tiers but we've had several posters who refuse to believe that PNMs drop out for reasons unrelated to tiers.

Because everyone comes to greekchat when they've been cut by the "fat ugly girl" chapter.

No, "everyone" does not. Some do. Others have other reasons for coming to GC. The last thing I want to do when someone is down is stomp on them and ridicule them for their choices in recruitment, bad or good. I wasn't there and why jump on someone who's upset?

IMHO, recruitment is really a fickle business. The elephant in the room is that on most college campuses all sororities are not created equal. They are all different and all have different levels of success on a campus and that is ok because there are all different types of women who go through recruitment. There are wonderful girls on every campus that get dropped every fall from Chapters and girls Chapters don't think are qualified and released from every Chapter. I would tell my own daughter that if she got to the end of recruitment and went entirely through the whole process and still didn't feel any connection with what she had left to NOT sign a bid card. Most of us this board are old and wise and I think we sometimes forget what it is like to be an 18 year old "girl" who may not have a Mom or a Sister who is Greek to help guide them through the process.

Here's another example of "not fitting in" with a certain chapter that's not necessarily "tier" based - During rush, this PNM was at a "top tier" sorority during the second round of parties. This was a good sorority with strong sisterhood, good fraternity socials, campus involvement, cheerleaders, etc. Her rusher showed her the trophy that the sorority had won for having the highest overall GPA in Panhellenic for that year. PNM actually said out loud, "Well, I know I can't help you with that!" and cut the sorority for the next round. It wasn't that she thought it was a nerdy sorority; she just wasn't one of the smartest girls and was scared she would bring them down.

Of course, PNM pledged my chapter and was held over for initiation due to grades. Great sister, though.

She cut the only groups that still wanted her on pref night. We don't know why she was cut from the other groups, and no one has claimed to. But as has been pointed out, those groups that cut her wanted other girls more for some reason. She stated her reasons for cutting the groups and we pointed out that they were, in fact, coming across as very shallow reasons. She didn't disagree.

There's not harassing a PNM and there's being frank with her. If she goes into recruitment again, not considering these 2 chapters, she's cut her odds immediately. If the other chapters have to cut heavily as a rule, and these 2 don't, then she's cut her odds even MORE. Point this out doesn't mean we're ruining her life, her happiness or her recruitment.

This PNM wasn't stomped on she was given the reality check she asked for.

This one, no. Others, yes to the point that I am embarrassed for the NPC. A lot. Also, we have no idea if these were good, strong, smaller groups that truly wanted her or if they were the kind that I believe on GC has been described as the kind of chapter who would take anyone with ovaries. Big difference.

That's fine, i just think this was the wrong thread to make that stand in, particularly since you have actually made a thread on this topic.

And this OP was of the opinion (or expressed her opinion in such a way) that these groups were the latter. No matter what the truth is, such an opinion will limit her options. And particularly as a non-member she has no idea whether those groups just struggle for numbers and cut less, or whether they do take any and all comers.

If she (or any PNM) isn't happy with her options, that's ok. But I see little reason to encourage her to eliminate options in advance no matter what the reason. She wouldn't be the first PNM to have pre-conceived notions utterly shattered and find a home with a chapter she would never have thought would fit her.

Also, there has to be a balance between treating 18 year olds like kids and like adults. They're not always great at making decisions and can be more emotional, but they also can handle honesty and think critically.

I like it when PNMs find a new home where they never would've expected one, although I believe it's often obvious when a group is taking anyone (when I rushed, there were 2 groups who invited all rushees back to every party; bad move on that campus).

I like it when teens can accept constructive criticism (do I sound like a teacher?) In the case of this particular girl, those 2 groups may well be her only options, although I have seen PNMs have a much more successful rush the second time than the first for various and sometimes unexplainable reasons.

I don't like it when adults jump on a hurting PNM, snarling at her because she cut some groups. As I said, we aren't looking over their shoulders.

Since we have no way to know what her chances are with any group our best bet is to encourage her to keep her options open. It's the best and most positive advice even if it come at the expense of questioning her reasoning for excluding groups. During/post rush, we frequently encourage the openminded-ness but don't tend to second guess or be mean to a PNM who ends up withdrawing or cutting groups she's not feeling comfortable with. It's before rush when we try to correct that.

Even groups that are recommended to make no cuts under RFM still make cuts. Ones that don't, don't last. I don't think you actually know the health of the chapter unless you're a member and you probably don't have a good idea unless you're a member of another chapter on the same campus.

Honestly the only time I see GC turn into an unchecked pack of lions is when there are obvious inconsistencies in the story that leads us to believe we're being lied to and/or trolled. Taking the GatorKate example, people first questioned the inconsistencies, THEN after it turned out the story was nothing like what was claimed the tides turned. Then we got meangirl trolled and it turned out the whole thing was bait.

So really the best way to "make us nicer" would be for the trolls to stop their "sobstory PNM" baiting. And the "pile-ons" happen just as often due to taking a while to write a post and getting beaten to the bunch as they do because the OP responds to initial well meant criticism or concern with ignorance and sarcasm.

And I don't think being the "tone" police works well, nor the "embarrassed on behalf of ____ for your behavior" argument.