American University date rape column angers students
 

American University students are demanding that the campus newspaper fire one of its columnists and issue an apology after publishing a column Monday that called date rape "an incoherent concept."

The column in The Eagle newspaper was written by Alex Knepper, 20, a sophomore political science major. Knepper wrote that a woman who attends a fraternity party, drinks more than five glasses of alcohol and follows a guy to his room is indicating that she is willing to have sex and should not "cry date rape" the next morning.


Knepper, who is openly gay, often writes on topics that infuriate students and hopes to someday be a political commentator. In an interview Monday he said that "real rape," which occurs when a stranger "thrusts sex into a non-sexual situation," is a heinous crime and rapists should be severely punished.



http://voices.washingtonpost.com/cam..._rape_ang.html

Another underinformed and undereducated attention whore who confuses TRYING to offend people with being a worthy, "in your face" commentator on life.

He will go away once people stop giving a shit about his existence.

Part of me says freedom of the press. The other part says even if you have freedom of the press that doesn't make it ethically right to print it. We just had this argument in my editing class about the differences between what you can legally print and what you should print.

Either way, I completely disagree with what he said and I would be really pissed if our campus newspaper printed like that. Does he really believe if you're drunk and you go to a room with a guy that means you're instantly going to have sex with him? :confused:

What makes him under-informed? That he disagrees with you? :)

Guys only go to parties to look for girls to have sex with. If you go back to his room willingly, people will assume that you want to have sex with him. Do you usually get drunk and go back with guys to their room just to hang out or talk about your classes? :confused:

He is doing what he has seen work for countless others. Why let fact, informed opinions, and sound analysis get in the way, when inflammatory rhetoric gets you national airtime. He will probably be a great success; I mean he's already got the Washington Post quoting him.

Men are not animals.

Has every man on this board gone all the way with every woman and/or man that they THOUGHT they would go all the way with? If she and/or he suddenly said NO, did any of you just TAKE IT because you needed to bust a nut? Have any men on this board ever had someone TAKE sex from them despite the fact that you said NO (yes, men can also be sexually assaulted and raped)?

I have always been 100% against underaged drinking (except for when cultures incorporate mild drinking in familial activities) and especially underaged binge drinking. If college students are so uncontrollable and basically walking around with their penises and vaginas hanging out waiting for a mindless fuck, THAT is the issue that should be addressed. Don't hide that issue under "date rape."

@ the bolded...that is all.

that is a crock of shit. wait...i take that back. its a crock of shit for decent men who aren't pigs.

as for the second sentence....i think it's an unfortunate reality that many people fail to realize at first in college...it does seem that many men expect that if you go back to their room, that you DO want to have sex with them, when this may not be the case. but even if that was the woman's intention- once she no longer gives you consent, everything should end there.

E-mail him saying "MMITY?" :p


Screw him. Make him watch Descent if that's how he really feels. If he can see an uncensored date rape from start to finish and still say a woman "deserves" or "asks for it.......

I agree that many young women put themselves in positions they don't need to be in and that a handful of them falsely report a rape because of embarrassment, hurt feelings, etc. That does NOT give anyone the right to make a blanket insinuation about all young women's intentions who walk into that situation. "It’s not clear enough to merely speak of consent, because the lines of consent in sex — especially anonymous sex — can become very blurry."--->Yeah, okay, but being drunk and walking into a bedroom =/= giving sexual consent. Even if she gave consent, I don't if you and little Jimmy are half-way undressed--if she revokes said consent at ANY point, then game over. Period. The same for the reverse since we're being gender equal.

Honestly, if the news staff fires him, he'll just cry foul per Amendment 1. Then he'll probably start a blog and become even more famous. The fool won't shut up either way.

how ignorant.

He's a jack@ss

I've never gone back to someone's room at a party other than my boyfriend's room. However, even when going to bf's room at a party they're hosting doesn't mean we're going to have sex. It means I don't want to be in the party any longer.

I do know girls who go into a male friend's room to lay down or who spend the night there without having sex. I have a very good friend who usually spends the night with one of our close male friends when his house hosts a party. They've never had sex, she just lives about 20 minutes away from him so doesn't go home when drinking.

Also, all guys don't just go to parties to find girls to have sex with. Sorry not buying that for a minute. Maybe some guys do, maybe most guys do, but not all of them.

You do girls scenic??

LOL

The things I learn on GC!!!

LOL! I guess I should be more careful when I type!

Sidenote-funny story: My boss was e-mailing a bunch of people above her rank in the library and I don't remember what she was trying to type but she typed penis instead and sent it out. She was embarrassed at first but now she tells the story to anyone who needs a good laugh lol.

hehehehehe

NO, oh my god. I wouldn't rape someone who suddenly said no. I know, because it's happened. And I was surprised. It was her time of the month. I didn't really care if her un-used eggs and uterine lining got on my penis, but she didn't like the idea. We ended up hooking up later and actually dating for awhile.

But that doesn't change the fact that entire reason I was at the party was to get laid.

If a drunken girl follows a guy back to their room, they are not insinuating that they want to have sex. They may just want to make-out, or they may consider the guy "a friend" and just want to hang out away from a busy party. So I think his statements were out of line.

I do, however, feel that a lot of rape laws are unfair towards men. At least in California, if a girl is inebriated and she consents to sex drunk, the next morning she can technically say she's been raped if she thinks she would not have done it sober. Obviously I think any guy who would have sex with a woman who is drunk beyond coherency (ie, throwing up, having trouble standing, clearly not aware of surroundings, etc) is disgusting. But if she is not in that state, and is just party drunk, and she consents to sex and then later cries rape I think it is incredibly unfair on her part. She chose to get drunk and should take the consequences.

If she is in a state of total incoherency like I stated above, or the guy forced himself on her when she is drunk, then that is a whole different ballgame. But I think as the law stands it gives women too much wiggle room for an action they should take the consequences for...it is unfair to the guys if she originally consented, and it is unfair to all the women who are actually raped because her claims tend to invalidate REAL date rape in many people's minds.

I do however think that the ridiculous claims (if she dressed slutty she is asking for it, "no" means yes) are absurd and disgusting.

My other pet peeve is when women claim they were rufied when it was clear to everybody at the party it was not the case...a girl I knew once claimed she was rufied when everybody at the party saw this tiiiny girl take upwards of 7-8 shots over the course of an hour...it is just as likely she blacked out. Once again, a man accused of rape/rufies is essentially guilty in the public's eyes, and it is not fair to him. It is also not fair to women that actually were rufied because when the situation is obviously "not" the case, it invalidates future claims.

I would say when and where, but then you'd just cry date rape.

And yeah, I was just messing with you. I think this guy is a giant douche.

No.

Those are your FRIENDS though, right? Not random guys you meet.

I'm not saying every random guy is going to try force himself on you, or that you owe him any sex just because you want to leave the party at the same time, but if you are talking for any length of time with him, and you leave together, and then you go to his room, he is thinking "alright! I'm gonna get some!" He is not thinking "Alright! This girl is going to like my collection of jazz records so we can compare our thoughts on the diz and getz collaborations."

Seriously. The vast majority of people go out to parties, and bars, etc. in order to meet someone and hook up. That's why their called "parties."
Otherwise, they'd be called "meetings."

TWICE in the last month have I heard a man say this. :mad: RI-FREAKING-DICULOUS. I can't believe there are people who actually believe that.

Still the bottom line is the author of the op ed is just trying to rile people up.

More than 5 glasses of liquor?

Really? Based on what scientific study?

Yes, clearly he wants to be the next Rush:

Let’s get this straight: any woman who heads to an EI party as an anonymous onlooker, drinks five cups of the jungle juice, and walks back to a boy’s room with him is indicating that she wants sex, OK? To cry “date rape” after you sober up the next morning and regret the incident is the equivalent of pulling a gun to someone’s head and then later claiming that you didn’t ever actually intend to pull the trigger.

“Date rape” is an incoherent concept. There’s rape and there’s not-rape, and we need a line of demarcation. It’s not clear enough to merely speak of consent, because the lines of consent in sex — especially anonymous sex — can become very blurry. If that bothers you, then stick with Pat Robertson and his brigade of anti-sex cavemen! Don’t jump into the sexual arena if you can’t handle the volatility of its practice!

Feminists don’t understand history, psychology, biology or sexuality. To repair this desperate situation, I have altruistically prepared a list of five favored books about sex and gender: “The Myth of Male Power” by Warren Farrell, “The Sexual Spectrum” by Olive Skene Johnson, “Vamps and Tramps” by Camille Paglia, “Philosophy In the Bedroom” by the divine Marquis de Sade, and “Who Stole Feminism?” by Christina Hoff Sommers. Put down the Andrea Dworkin and embrace the fires of sexuality!

:(

Those are your FRIENDS though, right? Not random guys you meet.

I'm not saying every random guy is going to try force himself on you, or that you owe him any sex just because you want to leave the party at the same time, but if you are talking for any length of time with him, and you leave together, and then you go to his room, he is thinking "alright! I'm gonna get some!" He is not thinking "Alright! This girl is going to like my collection of jazz records so we can compare our thoughts on the diz and getz collaborations."

Seriously. The vast majority of people go out to parties, and bars, etc. in order to meet someone and hook up. That's why their called "parties."
Otherwise, they'd be called "meetings."

So at the next frat party, if he downs 6 beers then heads into the back room with a guy claiming he wants to show him his new "laptop," he doesn't get to cry foul in the morning when he's hungover and his butt hurts.

:D

LOL.

True, they are friends. I would never go back to a stranger's room for many reasons. If it's a stranger then you're probably right, he's thinking you're ready to have sex with him.

And idk about going to parties and bars in order to meet someone and hook up. I know a lot of my sisters go to the bars on Thursdays to just go out. They don't go out to hook up with someone.

The way he said it was stupid and intended to infuriate, not to encourage intelligent discussion.

BUT.

This is a grey area a lot of the time and both men and women HAVE to understand that you can't always prove rape in that situation and you can't always prove it wasn't. I've been in a situation, before you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

We had a guy come to our campus one time to start a discussion about that type of situation and he had people throw out situations and then he'd explain how it could be argued in court either for rape or against it. And it was really enlightening, because by the end of the discussion, we were all undecided. A girl will have her entire sexual history brought up and dissected and it's hard in most cases to prove she wouldn't sleep with a guy unless she had drinks. A guy will face judgment for not being able to tell a girl is too drunk to consent, even if he was drunk himself. What it comes down to is NEITHER should have sex drunk. It's too dangerous for both and waking up and not being able to remember what happened can be scary...and make it very hard to prove rape. It's a unique situation from rapes involving physical force or drugs. If a woman thinks she was date raped she shouldn't feel like she can't/should not report it, but she needs to understand what an uphill battle it will be if she chooses to and needs to understand the alleged rapist may not be convicted. It's a horrible choice to make, so the best advice is to use the buddy system and not go home with someone when trashed.

Again, those are your SISTERS. I'm not yelling, I just don't feel like dealing with the italics thing.

And sometimes I go out for other reasons to, but not so much when I was in college. And even now, in the back of of mind, is always, "you might find something."

This is stupid. But I guess since you personally KNOW the vast majority of people, you're speaking with first-hand knowledge.

Wait. LOL! What? What's wrong with you? LMBO!

I hope you get regular STD tests. Eww.

Again, those are your SISTERS. I'm not yelling, I just don't feel like dealing with the italics thing.

And sometimes I go out for other reasons to, but not so much when I was in college. And even now, in the back of of mind, is always, "you get find something."

LOL!!

I'm not sure what the fact that they're my sisters has to do with anything? I'm just saying that they are people who go out for the fun of dressing up and going out, not looking to hook up with someone. Most of the people I work with go out for fun, not to hook up with someone and they're not my sisters. Sure a few of them go out looking for someone to hook up with but most of them go out because they know someone having a party and want to go hang out.

Just going by the constant self importance. :D

Your own?

For future reference, don't assume what others are thinking or are about to type. It colors the tone of your post and can distract people from what you are about to say. I didn't read the rest of that post but I would have if you didn't include the silly "listen to meeeeeeeee" qualifier.

The kid is clearly one of those token campus conservatives who says stuff just to get people riled up. Not only did it work at AU, it worked on GC!

My undergrad was Ground Zero for a date-rape case gone terribly wrong. Basically, he said they had consensual sex; she couldn't remember anything because she was too drunk. John Stossel came to campus and everything! The University had to settle with the student for millions of dollars and now entering freshmen have to go through this boring role-playing seminar about how men shouldn't have sex with drunk women since they can't reasonably give consent.

I guess my "riled up"-o-meter requires more. ;)

Nope. I can't wade through a thread without scrolling through snobby, snarky, self important insults aimed at others. You can't act expect others to give you the benefit of the doubt over and over again with the same result. I'm not going to, anyway.

If you didn't read the rest of the post, why respond? What a waste of time.