UT (Texas) minority in "white" sorority
 

Coming from a predominantly white high school, I have always been a minority (Indian- from India) among my friends.

I am considering rushing this upcoming fall at UT & I wanted to know if I have a realistic chance for a bid at what are considered "white" sororities? This has really nothing to do with racism; I just would like a realistic opinion.

I know that there are culturally oriented sororities at UT as well, however, I am not sure if that is something I am interested in.

Just rush! If someone wants you to be their sister you'll get a bid, if you don't you won't know whether it's because your ethnicity anyways. I'm a "minority" in my org to (both chapter and nationwide) and I don't really care 99.9999% of the time.

That's not very comforting. So she'll always wonder...:(

It's' the truth. Unless a sister who has no better sense than to talk about that certain gathering says something directly to her about her "Indian-ness" being the reason, she will never know.

She'll need recs, regardless of the color of her skin.

I agree. LatinaAlumna, while I also agree that may not be very comforting, I have to say that if someone doesn't want to be your "sister" or "brother" because of your ethnicity, why would you want to join, anyway?

In one of our newer chapters, we have a woman who is disabled. I think that shows such character that so many women were able to embrace the wonderful person she is and offer her a bid. I am so proud of that.

I think that to the OP, if someone looks down on your race/ background, there are tons of other great organizations you can join!

I agree with violetpretty - no matter what, you must approach Texas Recruitment like a pro. Read up on here about it, attend all panhellenic informational stuff, and get busy lining up your recs NOW. If you are in Texas, you probably already know some about what it takes, but don't go into this recruitment without covering all the bases.

I don't know about the minority question - a Texas sorority member could be of more help, but do everything else you need to insure your success whether you are "white" or not.

It's going to be a loooooooong spring and summer...........

I know that she will *literally* never find out. I get that. But don't you think it would be unsettling (not to mention, unfair) for this woman to have to *wonder* if that was the reason she was not invited to join?

PM'ed you. I'm not an expert on UT sororities so I'm not going to talk about your chances, but I'm from the same state and ethnicity.

ETA: and just in case your parents are anything like mine.... the classic "Parents Against Sororities"
Oh the lessons I've learned since then.

Oh yeah, but I just meant it as not to really worry in the event that it did since she'd not really know so it shouldn't be the focus of her life if she didn', just keep it moving.

SECOND! It definitely hurts but moving on is the best thing to do!

In addition to this....

I wonder if the young women (and at least once on GC, a young man) in this situation ever contemplate their blackness or brownness prior to pursuing membership in a GLO.

I was not raised as a minority, but was aware of my blackness because, well, I'm American, I watched the news, and I took history -- I knew DC was a majority black city and not to expect anyplace else in the world like it. One of the reasons I did not choose to attend an HBCU was because after 18 years, I felt it was time to be among the majority and expand my world view.

I also was aware that groups existed to ease the transition and to feel at home, even though I would be in the minority. Black Student Alliance, NAACP, the multicultural center, etc.

I guess I always wonder what's going on in the lives of people who grew up in a different class and/or different racial dynamic than I did, and whether this fear of not being accepted is the first time they've had to deal with race.

^^^I am going to assume that since she is contemplating NPC recruitment, the OP has actually NOT been overly concerned with race up to this point, but in taking a hard look at the system (and with fresh, this isn't my own backyard, eyes) realizes her "minority" status may affect her chances.

I think you hit the nail on the head. I think our generation is the first one where there's a shared experience of growing up in integrated middle or upper-middle class neighborhoods where there may have only been a handful of kids of color in their schools. Their class and postwar political correctness may have insulated them from the harsh realities of race relations so, yes, they've never really HAD to contemplate their blackness. If you're a black girl who grows up as an "Only" in your school and social world (and you didn't have an alternate black social outlet in terms of church, social organizations, or family), and your extended family is pretty much the same way, there aren't a lot of opportunities to contemplate your Otherness unless you're self-aware in ways that a lot of 18 year-olds just aren't.

When they go to college, they assume that their high school life will be identical to their college life. Their friends are planning on joining sororities, and they know that it's pretty much all-white on a lot of campuses. Can they fit in? Will they be able to continue to coast on the political correctness and well-meaning liberalness of upper-middle class suburban neighborhoods? Are they considered sell-outs if they join ADPi instead of AKA? These are pretty big questions to deal with for the first time when you're 18; I think that's why we get so many of these posts.

I'm also sure that someone else can say this far better than I can.

Not everyone is conscious and cool like we are in both majority and minority settings. :)

Also, remember that being the minority often leads some to be treated as royalty. "You're not like the rest" and "teach me about...." is the same as "some of my bestfriends are...."

Being the only (insert race and ethnicity) among people who are your friends relieves some anxiety. However, going into a new environment where your (insert trendy cool thing that you do that the white folks think is awesome--it is often dancing and "Black speak" for Blacks in white settings) isn't met with celebration, you will now have to be "just one of the others" and wonder whether you will be accepted. I have heard minorities say "it wasn't like this back home" when they are met with whites who are neither amused nor impressed by the "token."

True.

I think you did a fine job!

Very interesting posts. Thanks for your insightful responses.

In response to the OP, I will say that I know of some NPC houses at UT who have minority members, others that don't. While it may seem as if race is the reason for this, it could be more that others had better connections to the house or people pulling for them inside.

UT is competitive, Period. It can be hard to get a bid if you are "pretty, perfect, little darling, cheerleader, top of the class, always had everything go their way, etc." as we have seen in other threads on GC (especially by shell shocked rushees and moms).

Best thing to do is prepare yourself, get great RIF's, and go out with your best foot forward, but be prepared to face tough recruitment. Be open minded, meet a ton of people, and hope for the best.

Good luck to you!!

First, let me say that I am not overly familiar with UT recruitment. But I do believe that a minority rushing may have a harder time at schools like UT or SEC schools vs. schools in California, East Coast, etc. I'm not condoning it, but I think it's an honest answer.

Now, I think the main problem is that there are very entrenched social circles in those societies that can be difficult, or near impossible, to break into. There are girls going to these schools whose families have known each other for generations. Their mother, aunt, grandmother and older sister may all have been bid by ABC at their same school, not to mention the fact that they have already been flagged because of their hometown, the ball where they were a debutante, high school, the fact that they went to Sunday School with Sister Susie, her dad golfs with Sister Sally and Sister Stacey's debutante escort was her older brother. In short: this girl was born and bred to be an ABC at University X.

Due to historical reasons, minorities have usually not managed to crack this inner-circle (and, like some have pointed out, those that do may be the "token" friends and not necessarily treated equally) and therefore are not going to be one of the PNMs the chapter is competing for the most. The same goes for white girls that just didn't come from that ABC background.

Is there ever some more overt racism from particular members? Probably. But I think the chapter stance probably leans more towards tried-and-true Southern elitism, which unfortunately also rules out many minorities. I doubt it ever even gets to discussion about race...more likely, "these 150 PNMs fit our social standards, we have a legitimate chance at getting 80 of them, and we only need 50 for quota, so let's move on."

Now, are there chapters that don't follow this way of thinking? Absolutely. But there will always be some that do, so I think it is something to be aware of if you are rushing at the most competitive schools in Texas/the South...and is why keeping an open mind on every chapter is the best policy (not that it isn't ALWAYS the best policy for every school, because it is, but it may be even more important for these schools).

Someone more familiar with UT recruitment can feel free to correct me, but I don't think I'm too far off.

Exactly

Nope, you are right on the money. And your post should be required reading for anyone rushing at Texas or any other traditionaly competitive recruitment.

I agree. I think what's going to happen within the next 5-10 years is that we're going to see more young women of color whose families have cracked that "inner circle"--even in Texas and some parts of the South. What's going to happen to them? It'll be interesting to find out.

At the risk of sounding like I am saying "some of my best friends are..."

I do want to point out that at Arkansas about 8 years ago, the Kappas pledged a minority woman. It was a big deal, and at the same time, not one. The news that the color line had been "crossed" spread like wildfire among the alumnae. I believe on campus, the young woman was deemed a top rushee and was heavily rushed everywhere based on her merits, not her color...

The more things change the more they stay the same. There won't be a substantial increase in nonwhite members just as there won't be a substantial increase in nonBlack members for NPHC orgs.

As for the first real generation of nonwhite NPC legacies, they are so few in number that they will probably be more focused on a support mechanism based on their dominant identity (gender, social class and/or race and ethnicity) instead of being so quick to capitalize on NPC legacy status. Some may be steered in the right direction by their families in terms of what schools to go to as a nonwhite NPC legacy. I think it won't pan out that way for the majority of them unless they were groomed for that all of their lives. But, such grooming is annoying regardless of whether it is NPC or NPHC.

...explain, please?

And thank you all for the discussion, however few of you actually answered my original question.

Our discussion was more interesting than the original question.

:D
I actually had forgotten the original question. But I'm glad she posted b/c this discussion was generated as a result.

In all honesty, I think we have given all of the info and advice possible. Simply put: there are no guarantees in recruitment, so we cannot really tell you what your odds are - black, white, or whatever.

Your question brought some interesting thoughts on the issue of race in predominately white groups/Greek systems and spurred an interesting conversation.

I think you should go for it, if it is something you would like to pursue. If you don't, you will always wonder. Best of luck and keep us posted this fall.

What kind of answer are you expecting? A precise statistical probability?

There are non-white members in several, but not all, NPC sororities at the University of Texas. You may fit in with a chapter. You may not. We don't know you nor the membership selection criteria of all chapters so how can you possibly think we can give you any kind of evaluation of your chances?

Go through recruitment. You either get a bid or you don't. You won't know the answer to your question until bid day. The end.

the simplest answer:

the average minority will always have a harder time getting a bid at a southern school versus the average caucasian. that's just how it is

i don't know your stats/ecs/connections though, so you may have a much better chance that the "average minority"

My daughter's school has a VERY competitive recruitment. I have read here that it is like the SEC. But we aren't in the south and I suspect, a bit more used to integration. I will say upfront that I don't know how many African American, Asian and Hispanic women started recruitment. I do know that, in my daughter's pledge class there is diversity. (Oh wait, my daughter is Jewish, which when I went through being Jewish was an automatic drop.) I really didn't check out the girls based on that fact, I just know that I have seen lots of girls on the Row (not just my daughter's house) who are minorities.

So, things change, hopefully now for the better. You never know until you try.

yea, I was dealing with this issue, esp what Munchkin03 was saying to some extent back in 1991, but in Arizona, don't think I would've gone through NPC rush at a Texas, SEC or southern school....um no.

The majority of my high school community was Caucasian/Hispanic/Asian and of course my familial community was majority Af. Am.

I just felt more comfortable doing NPC rush and I will also say that while I was very aware of NHPC, but clueless about their process and I wanted an immediate community of "friends" via the sorority. I was young, kinda dumb (as most 19 yo) and away from home for the first time.

"If you're that hypersensitive about color and don't have a sense of humor, don't pledge out of your race." - Dr Laura Schlessinger



.....wait, wrong thread?

You were present for membership selection of EVERY sorority at UT?

Oh, come on. Don't go all NPHC on me.

"black people do it all the time. Go to an HBCU, listen to a black student, and all you hear and see is...."

that's what she said ^^^^

If you're as hot as Dilshad Vadsaria (see: Rebecca Logan from Greek), than yes.

edit: Just realized she's Paki. Maybe you are SOL.