Older Perp
 

A relative, D, told me many years ago that she wasn't Greek at her university, that she hadn't been interested. Both her daughters pledged ABC years later.

A couple of years ago, a neighbor told me that she'd heard that D was a member of DEF. I said no, she was never Greek, and this woman looked at me weirdly and said that several people had been told this. This weekend, another woman came up and said that her daughter had pledged DEF just like D had! I told her that D was never Greek and she told me that D had plainly told her a few months before that she was a DEF. She said, "Okay, no harm meant!" and took off.

This is getting really strange. I don't know why D is reinventing her college years and it's difficult when people say something about her sorority membership. Of course, I'd like to say, "Okay, you've been telling people that you went DEF and we both know you didn't and if you start trying to write recs, I'm calling the national group." (I can see her getting into a situation where she might be asked to write recs, as that group is popular around here.)

How would you guys handle it? I need to be diplomatic.

Lane swerving a bit, but I had a question. I remember looking at one of the rec forms a while back. Don't they have a space for a membership ID or some type of membership verification? Wouldn't the chapter(s) that receive the recs be able to verify whether or not D is a member?

What I think that she would do is to say that she would write a rec and not do it, thereby leaving a girl thinking that she had her DEF rec nailed down but she wouldn't.

^^Yeah, I could see someone in that situation making excuses so they don't have to write the rec and expose themselves as a perp.

I think the best way to go about it would be to confront her in a positive way like "Oh, D, Mrs. Smith told me you became a DEF, did you initiate after Snookie joined?" Of course she could lie about that too, but its a better way to approach it than "Listen ho, stop playin'!"

My oldest son votes for "Listen ho, stop playin," but my fear is that she'll offer to write recs for unsuspecting PNMs and then , of course, not do it because she can't. Actually, my kids have come up with a ton of hilarious things we could say to her, none of which we could really say. LOL, they're awful.

I do believe this will be my next siggy lol

To carnation: Another question (forgive my NPC ignorance) - I also remember reading on here that city Panhellenic associations help coordinate recs for interested women. If Susie PNM knows D and asks her for a rec, can she submit one, or is there some sort of protocol that requires her to go through the city's Panhellenic?

That's a tough one, Carnation. I would approach it indirectly, and say something like, "You know, I've been hearing the funniest thing! -- a number of people are under the impression that you're a DEF" (at which point, she'll probably deny it.) Then you could add, "I would hate for a PNM to approach you thinking that she can count on you for a rec. That might ruin her rush." At least it would give her something to think about.

Ultimately, you're not responsible for her behavior. But you can be honest with others if they ask: "As far as I know, she never joined DEF at State U."

It's truly an unfortunate situation.

Individual alums can almost always submit recs, although in some cities they're vetted by the City PH. Around here--and in most places--there's not a city PH, we just send them directly to the chapters. I don't think there's any way that she can fake one and send it in but she can sure lie about sending one. Since that sorority is so common around here, she could possibly screw up someone's rush experience if they thought they were covered for that group but weren't.

Blue Skies, that sounds diplomatic, maybe I could try that.

I think I'd try the reverse with her - Auntie D, I could swear that you told me a long time ago that you weren't Greek in college but Susie says you are a DEF! And then see what she says...

Is DEF a sorority that any of your daughters has joined? If so, maybe have her ask D if she went through AI since she had heard that she was a member of her sorority. If she says no, she can then ask why people are mistakenly thinking D is a member of DEF. If not, you could ask her the same way. Maybe she did AI DEF, and she just didn't tell you ( unless, of course, it's not a group that does that sort of thing, but she may not know that ;) )

I vote for a mixture of "listen ho, stop playin" and conversing with her about the seriousness of what she's doing.

I vote for the former because I think lying about memberships, accomplishments, and credentials makes a person lame as hell. I vote for the latter because she needs to know that she's not only making herself look like a loser, she's potentially impacting other young ladies' outcomes.

or, ask your network (a member of DEF) to look up her name in their directory. I know that isn't 100% gospel, but ma;ybe it might answer a question.

Wow, talking about a rock and a hard place! I like Titchou and BlueSkies' advice, but with a nasty twist: Gift wrap a small mascot or symbol of DEF and hand it to her for Christmas, with a "I thought you'd like this!"

I like Titchou's advice, too. However, I would also follow Benzgirl's advice and do a little investigating on my own. I wouldn't be able to resist. I'm sure someone from that sorority would be glad to make a call to HQ and check it out for you.

I'd seriously talk with her about the seriousness of her actions and tell her, "hey, fool, sooner or later, you'll expose yourself and when the members of DEF come knocking at your door to give you a beat down, don't come calling me."
Or I'd seriously tell her, if you don't stop this, I will call the nat'l headquarters and let them know of your behavior and claim to their sorority.

I know that I'm lane hopping and swerving, but if someone called the nat'l headquarters for a NPC sorority, and let them know that someone was perping as a member, would the sorority not send them a cease and decist(?) letter or face further consequences?

OK, perhaps there is a logical explanation for this and I'd like to give her the benefit of the doubt. What if she did join but resigned for some reason? So, she says she wasn't Greek so that she doesn't have to explain it - I know people like that. But maybe this neighbor knows someone that was in school with the woman and doesn't know she resigned. Could be...so I wouldn't jump on her case without details but I would mention the discrepancy and see what she says.

Well, for sure she wasn't Greek, even AI, but I think I'll pm someone from that group to check their website so we can say that we reallyreally know for sure. This is so stupid! Her mom and her kids know she wasn't Greek and if someone mentions it to them, they're bound to blurt out the truth too. I figure since I've heard it several times, they probably will as well.

Seems like if someone decided to perp, they'd do it far from home and not in the town they grew up in.

That's what I was thinking too. If she self terminated or was terminated she might not have wanted to bring it up.

A member checked and D is definitely not a DEF. I doubt she ever was; she's too status-conscious to terminate and she wouldn't have done anything to get kicked out--you'd have to know her.

Here's something ironic that popped up this week. She has a chance to be AIed into another group that she has ties to. Haha! I'm sure she's dying to but then she'd have to figure a way to gloss over her earlier story to the women around here. ("Did I say I was a DEF? Oh, what was I thinking, I'm an ABC!")

This is the definition of POETIC JUSTICE.

Our's do!

I just looked, and ours don't, but that's a damn good idea I'll be suggesting.

I know for Kappa, we have to write our initiation date and undergrad chapter along with a the rec form. Our ID #s don't get used very often, and I only know mine because I use it to log in to the website.

However, how easy would it be for a membership chair to check that? Hmm...I guess it would be on the website, too. My chapter hardly ever got recs for PNMs because Greek life is so low-key there. I think we already knew the people (in person) who wrote the ones we've gotten. Weird.

carnation, is it possible that she pledged DEF, but did not actually initiate? Maybe that's why she partly thinks of herself as a DEF.

I don't know the situation nor all of the details, but looking at the posts that everyone has made so far & the information provided, there's been a lot of assumptions being made about how things appear. I also wonder if these other women who claim that D said that she was a DEF got the details confused? It's entirely possible - sometimes the recall of others is not 100% accurate.

If you want this woman to come clean, she will likely need to feel safe before she will speak her truth.

Just my $0.02. :)

PS You could also play dumb and ask her, "Do you think that you will AI into ABC? To do so, you cannot have initiated into any other NPC group. Did you initiate into any other NPC group during college?" and then see what she says. If she says no, ask her if she ever had any ties to DEF? And then see what she says. My point is, if you ask her anything where she might get defensive, you might not get the straight up answer.

good luck and let us know what happens, as I'm curious now - LOL.

Maybe she terminated her membership? I know two people (a friend's mother and a former sister of mine) who still say they are XYZs although they resigned their membership during college. They do not seem to understand that technically they are not in their sororities anymore. They seem to equate initiation with full membership.

But it sounds like you know her well enough to know she is making it up. I would definitely go the passive aggressive route...I like the suggestion of telling her that she has been hearing the funniest thing...that people have been saying she is an XYZ. That will probably send the message strongly but without being rude.

Our reference (rec) forms ask for the collegiate chapter and initiation date of the alumna submitting it. So you really can't submit a rec without having those things.

Wow.

DEF rec forms can only be gotten off their website's sister side, like ours, so she doesn't have a snowball's chance in H of writing a fake rec. I mean, who's going to print one off for her? I still think she could do quite a bit of damage, unintentionally, by offering to write a rec and then not following through; people do get desperate for recs during the summer. She probably doesn't know how damaging it could be for a PNM to take off for Auburn or Georgia thinking they have their DEF rec taken care of and it's not.

:( I'd love to take honeychile's suggestion about giving her a DEF gift but I'll probably have to go the passive aggressive route, as suggested by APhiAnna, or the one suggested by CutiePie2000 so as to save face for her and keep family peace. Ironically, she would make a great AI and probably throw herself into it 100%. But dang! Why is she embarrassing us all like this?

Hi Carnation,
Who knows why people do the things that they do(??), but as she is a family member or an extended family-relative (etc.), it's probably best to deal with it delicately.

In some ways, if she AI'd and would be an active alumna who would support the collegiate chapter, then encourage her to do so and go that route. As for what happened in the past, give her an opportunity to explain herself, but if the explanation doesn't happen, maybe just let it go and encourage her to AI into ABC.

Let us know how it all turns out.

Is it possible she pledged and didn't make her grades?? In the olden days, you pledged in August but didn't initiate until March or April. I also have friends who pledged and then transfered to another school without a chapter of ABC before they were initiated. Is that a possibility? I do agree with Cutie Pie 2000, keep the peace, it is family and if she would make at great AI, they are few and far between so it would be an honor, encourage her to go for it. It will be up to her to explain herself.

I have a friend who did this and insists on saying she's an "AA". The next question is always "where" and then she fesses up that she pledged at XYZ University but tranferred to ABC College before she was initiated. Burns me up!

this sounds like the best solution by far. how ironic and sad that she may miss an opportunity to enjoy sisterhood in a wonderful sorority, all because she is posing as a DEF.

I'm curious to know how this all turned out. Any updates, carnation?

Much later update. Screaming into my pillow here--

because my high school daughter said, "I know where I can get a DEF recommendation! D says she was a DEF!"

Aaaaaaaaacckkk! Aaaaaack!

Sounds like it's time for a throwdown!
Good luck!

*snicker*

THE CONFRONTATION APPROACHES!! I can't wait to hear this play out!

I'm all for saving face, but it's three years later. Time for "Listen ho, stop playin'!" She is messing with your daughter now!

Though I'm curious to know how she would respond to your daughter asking for a rec.