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Univ of Texas at Austin Rush Story fall 2009
Rush 2009
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UT is a tough recruitment though and I'm sorry you didn't get a bid. Hopefully you can get involved elsewhere at UT. Good luck. |
To the OP, I'm sorry things did not work out for you and you are hurt. I hope you don't mind, but I'd like to use your post to make a general point and I hope this does not pour salt in your wounds. To be crystal clear I am not directing my comments specifically at you, rather at so many PNMs who come here heartbroken when they were dirty rushed all spring/summer long.
I am tired of all the claims of dirty rushing. "I was dirty rushed all summer, my friend was, a girl on my dorm floor, etc., then they dropped me! It's not fair!" Does dirty rushing happen? Yeah, I'm sure it does. Does it happen with every Chapter? I doubt it. But the numerous accusations about dirty rushing can make everyone think it is the norm and perhaps even acceptable. It is not. Dirty rushing can be stopped and the best people to do that are those PNMs who were hurt by it. Turn those Chapters in to Panhellenic. Tell them what they did, what they said, when they contacted you/your friends, etc. J-Board and Rho Chi's (or whatever they are called on a campus) cannot be everywhere. They can only look into issues they know about or see right in front of them. Chapters are hesitant to turn in others because maybe: they are doing something wrong too; they fear retaliation; they fear being labeled a "snitch"; they don't know infractions occurred; or they don't have any/enough concrete info only rumors. Sometimes a Chapter doesn't even know what their own individual members did. I would like to see more people stop complaining about a problem and instead be willing to be part of the solution. Often it just takes seeing one Chapter being held accountable for the others to fall in line because they do not want similar sanctions. While it will not change your Recruitment outcome, it might prevent similar heartbreak for PNMs who go through in the future. |
Hugs to you Hookem2013. You sound like you have really handled this disappointment well, and I commend you for picking yourself up and moving forward. At the time, being dropped from recruitment does seem like the end of the world, and you do feel terribly hurt. But, as you are beginning to understand, this does pass.
Regarding the dirty summer rush, I think, (and defer to LadyLonghorn et al) that the summer activities are allowed at UT. Being invited places by various sorority women is the norm, not the exception and if it is illegal, then someone very high up in the Greek Life organization is pointedly turning a blind eye to it. I also am wondering about the posters you are mentioning that say, "Legacy, Top Girl, etc." I do not think you meant to imply that those are posters that are put up in the dorms after Bid Day. I think that needs to be clarified. Best of luck with your college career at UT. What a great school and what a great opportunity for an education! |
Wow, there's both alot of truth and alot of misconceptions in that post, I hardly know where to begin...
I went to Memorial, my kids went to Stratford, so I am extremely familiar with both - Just because you went to those highschools (or Highland Park), does NOT mean you automatically get a bid. I personally know about 5 girls who were dropped, including one whose mother attended UT in a top 6 sorority so was a direct legacy, and went bidless. I also know girls who went to Cy-schools (there are about a million of them ;)), or Katy schools who got bids - shockingly :eek: there are even out of state girls who got bids!! Yes, there is no denying that knowing people beforehand will give you a leg up - but, it doesn't mean you are guaranteed anything! NOR, does not knowing people guarantee that you WON'T get a bid. As for knowing who they are going to bid before school starts - yes, they have an idea of who they'd like, but often houses are competing for the same girls! So, just because they'd like "Susie Q" from Camp Mystic, Susie Q may want another house!! There is flexibility during recruitment, there has to be - because the houses do not get together and have some master plan in place (collusion) before rush week! Regarding the "dirty rushing" - UT has a history of summer events during the orientation weeks, and they aren't considered "dirty rushing" - ALL the houses do it, I'm not just talking "top 6" houses - ALL of them do it. How can I attest to this? I know people who are the rush captains of smaller houses - guess what they did all summer... It is the custom there, and while it may be considered "dirty rushing" by panhellenic rules, it goes on and I guess is overlooked because it's just the way it is. Regarding the posters she's talking about - Yes, girls make posters for their "Rush Crushes", but just because they have a poster doesn't mean that girl is going to pledge that house! Maybe SHE wants to be in another house - the posters are just wishful thinking!! I know recruitment was tough this year (as it always is). I have friends whose daughters were cut hard, but got bids, and I have friends whose daughters went bidless. But, there are also many success stories - they just haven't been on here posting their happy results! I have pictures of moms handing flowers to their daughters at bid day, both crying with happiness - so it does happen, we just haven't had a recruitment story from any of them! I probably shouldn't get my nose out of joint, but all the negativity surrounding UT rush is starting to kind of p*ss me off... |
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In the words of my teenagers, "I'm feelin' ya, sr mom." I think that since UT is the mother of all mothers regarding tough nonSEC state school recruitments, it does get a little roughed up in the discussion boards! But, I think the same applies for Bama, etc. It is just UT's turn on the wheel this week. Sometimes it just gets overwhelming to try, once again, to defend sorority recruitment, sorority life, fight sorority stereotypes, etc that it is easy to feel defensive. |
Thanks for posting your experience! I am sorry it didnt work out for you. I dont know if they do any COB or winter recruitment, but sometimes PNMs find that those enviornments are a lot easier to deal with....but, considering that school is so big I am assuming maybe they dont do that. (I come from a lot different greek life environment)
If you genuinely feel there was dirty rushing going on, go talk to the Panhel president or the director over in Student Life/Affairs. But, you have to remember too, recruitment is hard, cuts get made, sometimes really really great girls slip through the cracks because of one silly reason or another. Getting a bid is so magical because the stars have to practically align for both you and the sorority (sororities dont get their first choices often too!) I am glad youre being so positive about staying involved in campus, good luck with everything! |
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We've had like 5 posters come on here saying the same stuff about UT and I feel like it's getting a bit of a "bad rap" for being a place where everyone dirty rushes and no one gets a bids. That's likely not the case. I would imagine that most PNMs do though (as long as they are well prepared). |
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Where are all the SEC horror stories this year? Is it on a rotating basis, and UT is up this time? ;) |
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Oh well, if it's UT's time in the line of fire, then we'll take the heat. But, next year, somebody else needs to take a turn! :cool: LOL
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As for people not getting bids - at least 46 girls per house (quota) got bids, plus numerous quota additions, depending on the house, so there are a lot of happy girls wearing newly acquired Greek stuff around the UT campus these days. :) |
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Question: Do you think the dirty rush accusations come more from PNMs who are not familiar with UT and summer events thinking "Oh I went to dinner with XYZ! That means they must really like me and I'm getting a bid!" whereas girls who are familiar with UT know better than to think that a summer invite = a bid (because they know how common it is?) Also, I assumed that most girls get bids. I mean, if most of them weren't, then every chapter wouldn't have matched quota. I said this before, but I find that unfortunately, here on GC, we hear a disproportionate number of unhappy endings from bigger schools for a number of reasons. |
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Or am I missing something? |
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But still, I think their placement rate (of the girls who stay in recruitment) is in the 90% though. Hardly a "no one gets bids" placement rate. |
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I would imagine that most girls rushing don't really have a clue as to what is kosher nationally and what isn't, they just know that at UT, you and your friends might get a call before your orientation from different houses asking you to do something with them. I doubt very seriously that they are reading the fine print on the website as they sign up for recruitment (although their moms may be ;)). Gone are the days where you would get a formally printed invitation to attend a luncheon at some well heeled alum's house in your city (that's what it was like back in my day). Now, it's just, "Hey, I hear your orientation is June XX. A bunch of us are going to go eat at XYZ, then hit up the party at ABC, wanna come?" It is totally about getting to know girls before they show up for the first round party 15 minute meet and greet. Many girls wouldn't have a CHANCE if they didn't have the opportunity to get on the radar before formal recruitment - because of the "highschool, camp, hometown" connection/networks that are complained about - if they didn't get some face time during the summer. (awkward sentence - but do you know what I mean?) And yes, a large percentage of girls end up with a bid, maybe not where they were hoping for or expecting, but most get a bid. Some unfortunately get released from all the houses, and it is really sad. I wish I knew the answer - if I did, I'd be sure to tell my friend whose legacy daughter got released. Noone knows but the girls in the chapters. |
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The last time I suggested this, someone pointed out that sneaky pnms might collude with their #1 house and deliberately be rude at every house in order to be cut, with the understanding that #1 would invite them back as an "extra." I can see that as a risk in small systems, but would it really happen at a place like UT? Wouldn't actives in the other sororities talk, realize what was going on, and report it? |
From my understanding. Every group at UT pledged quota or quota +. I think that is awesome and proves to me that early release really works.
Every group at UT summer rushes. How can that be "dirty" if everybody does it? It is a throw back to the days when parties were invite only ( no open houses ) and there were town parties during the summer to meet the girls. I doubt that more than 50 girls (and that is stretching it) were released from every chapter by pref and most of those were grade issues. Most girls who remained bidless, dropped out with chapters remaining in the mix and did not maximize their options. Our UT chapters would LOVE to have larger pledge classes, if for no other reason $$$$. But they are told by Panhellenic how many they half to cut after every party. It's not personal. |
Why are new member classes smaller at UT than at other similar sized schools/greek systems? Or to clarify my question.. wy is quota set so low?
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UT doesn't set quota until the last minute. How many go to preference, I think. If girls would maximize their options, quota would have been somewhere around 55+ because they don't and many drop out it is much lower. There are 13 sororities that go through formal recruitment at UT. 800 + signed up but not that many show up.
UT has a small greek system comparative to it's size. |
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You know, the thing about UT is that in reality, the campus is REALLY liberal - the city theme is "Keep Austin Weird", so while Greek life is a big deal for those who want to be a part of it, it is a pretty small deal for the rest of the students on campus.
Then, you factor in the effect that the top 10% rule has had on the make up of the student body - back in my day, there were "feeder schools" that sent hundreds of kids to UT every year, and they were the type of kids that were likely to be part of the Greek system. Now, many of those types of kids just aren't going to UT. The opening post mentioned Memorial and Stratford - where 15 years ago, 25% of the graduating classes of those schools might be headed to UT, now it's closer to 10%, and some of those kids just aren't interested in Greek life at all! At Stratford (which jokingly in the past has been called Fratford), most kids who are interested in Greek life are going to A&M, either because they couldn't get into UT or because most of their friends are going to be aggies. My son, who was a rush captain this year, couldn't believe how few guys were coming to UT - when he graduated, around 8 guys pledged fraternities out of probably 25 guys who went to UT. This year, he knows of 2 guys who pledged - that's it! Compare that to over 20 guys who are pledging at A&M from the highschool. UT is just changing, and Greek life will have to change with it. |
I also asked s sorority sister from UT why greek life was so small compared to the size of the school. She explained to me that UT is accepting more and more overseas students as well. These students are not typically interested in greek life. Some of them are not the traditional college student age either.
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I went to Texas and I understand where you're coming from, and the disappointment that happens when you don't get into the sorority you want. When I was there, they had just started automatic placement, and I believe that they were to have now, so that all girls can find a home with one of their choices. With cross cutting, sometimes, it does happen where a girl does not make it all the way through, and I apologize if that happens to you. It does get quite competitive, and it is hard, because a lot of chapters are required to take so many legacies a year, and are faced at that time with who to take and how to pick and choose. Also, with quota and ceiling, there are only so many girls chapters are allowed to take. A lot of sorority rushing is about who you know, and who you meet, and I'm sad at Texas that you had a rough go of it. It is an extremely difficult place to rush. Sometimes it's about where you live, sometimes it's about what you're wearing, sometimes it's about who you know and sometimes, it's about nothing at all.
Might I suggest, if you're interested in getting involved socially, look at joining Texas Spirits, Texas Lassos, Wrangler Sweethearts or Disch Falk Diamonds. Each of these are ladies only groups that are involved with sporting/social events around UT. While some of these spots are occupied by girls in sororities, these groups reach out to girls who are Independent as well. Take a look. Quote:
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"Dirty Rushing" does happen all the time, but I have seen too, the heartbreak of girls being told all summer and even going through rush that they were definitely going to be a member of XYZ sorority, only to be cut at the end. For me, being here at UT, I understood "dirty rush" as one of two things: 1) a secret meeting between PNM's and 2) them (other chapters) rushing a girl that you want. According to Panhellenic at Texas (and this was 8 years ago, so if I'm off, let me know), "dirty rushing" was talking to any PNM after the first of the calendar year in which the PNM would be going through rush. They felt this didn't give anyone a fair advantage and wanted all the girls to start off on the right footing. The Greek system here, (usually in the spring) has an "unofficial" recruiting process entitled "Round-Up Weekend." Here, this is where seniors who are interested in the process come and stay with friends, and go to fraternity parties, and learn a little about Greek life. Technically, it's off the record, and so a lot of people turn their heads with the younger crowd here. As for legacies, here is one thing I have learned at UT: Everyone seems to have a legacy from somewhere. The streamline for Texas, especially in the bigger sororities are a duel/triple legacy, and many of those sister-mother combination; not your cousin, or stepmom, but true lineage, and also, if that legacy was part of that chapter at UT. I will tell you being out of state, and your lineage being from a different school...well, from what I've seen means very little. Because the chapters do not have to fill (and don't) with legacies, usually only about 10-20 girls (depending on quota size) are taken from legacies. The remainder is filled by new women to continue chapter growth by creating new lines. Make sense? I really thought though with automatic placement, that every girl was to find a home, but I know that's only if they go all the way through Pref. Greek life has shrunk incredibly since I was there. In '97, 1000+ girls were signed up, now it's steadying around the 700-800 mark. I think, taking provisional away during the summer, has indeed changed the rushing process as well. As far as I know, houses are still getting a "drop off" list from Panhellenic once rush is over and from there are able to snap bid off of it, but again, if they are already at ceiling (which used to be around 200 or so members when I was there), it's irrelevant. They can go up and over quota, but aren't able to pick up any one else if they're maxed out. Unfortunately, we're not able to take everyone we want to. |
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As far as fraternities, I think it's so different because, unlike the ladies who go through a one time formal recruitment process, guys can pledge each semester. Where being a sophomore can hurt you in a sorority, fraternities don't care. I'd be interested to see at Texas, what percentage of guys come back around a semester later, or even the next year, when they get to meet the guys in these chapters. |
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This isn't a panhellenic thing, done through Texas, but is done from house to house. Now, it might just be THEIR house, I don't know. I'd be interested in talking with some girls from other chapters to see if this is the case. Maybe that is not the case for others; maybe others take all legs. I'd like to know this too, as it helps the recruiting process for everyone. Sorry for the confusion. |
Really? I'm surprised they would use up that many spots for legacies. I would have thought it would be a 40/60 split or something like that. I know it's more along those lines in our chapters that are heavy with legacies.
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I am actually surprised that they are mentally tallying legacies in the final numbers...Sure many might think, "Wow, we have a ton of legacies. We can't take all of them." But I am wondering if actually assigning a numerical breakdown to legacies actually happens.
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I think some groups do have to make a decision early. With so many legacies going through, they have to decided which legacies they are keeping and which they are not to allow the legacy the opportunity to look at other groups and not to think they are going to be XYZ because they are a legacy. (This was discussed in another thread) I feel sure it is an individual chapters prerogative to determine how many legacies they are keeping until the end and I imagine it varies from year to year. But again, that's only speculation on my part.
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I totally agree, Just Interested. I do believe that is a likely occurrence. I have just never heard of chapters deciding on an actual number. I am not saying it doesn't happen, just that I have heard of such a specific and limiting policy.
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AXORushAdvisor, you've raised an interesting question and perhaps this is a hijack of this entire thread but I'm going to ask it anyway. I'd like to hear from campuses who have instituted and upper class quota separate from freshman quota. Has it hurt or helped the smaller chapters.I know it was brought up at a campus I'm familiar with but voted down. I can see it only helping chapters by encouraging more sophomores to go through recruitment and thus over all increasing the number of new members. It seems like a win win to me. I know Georgia and Alabama are the two that come to mind that have upper class quota. It would be still up to larger chapters to fill that quota and wouldn't go against them if they chose not to and would allow smaller chapters to encrease their numbers significantly.
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If you get out the bid list for Alabama this year and count NMs, Old Row groups will be obvious.....
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Sounds like UT needs more sororities. I don't know how many are on campus but I am sure there are several national sororities that would love to be there. There is no excuse for a university not to provide enough chapters to give a large number of girls an opportunity to be in a sorority.
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Interesting. |
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Legacies have nothing to do with quota additions. In my experience, quota additions are usually matched with their first choice, so the numbers will be higher for houses who had more girls picking that house #1.
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