Mutual selection?
 

My GLO doesn't offer an AI path to full membership, so I've been fascinated by the divergent and very vocal opinions on AI offered here at GC. I believe the unwavering support and mature leadership of a sorority's alumnae are its strength, so the idea of attracting new members at the alumnae level seems like a good idea to me. Granted, it's critical that the new members who join in that way understand the difference between membership as an alumna and membership as a collegiate -- that they're not trying to revive a missed collegiate experience -- but if they are ready to embrace the alumnae experience, that sounds like it would strengthen the sorority.

But there's one thing I'm still confused about. I'm completely addicted to the collegiate recruitment stories and can't count the number of times the PNMs were advised to keep an open mind and consider every chapter in their search for their new home. But when a PNAM comes along and mentions that she is researching three different sororities, she is lambasted for sorority shopping.

It seems like if you support the concept of mutual selection, it should apply at the AI level as well as the collegiate level.

It just makes me sad to think of strong, smart professionals being turned away from an organization that they want to devote time, energy, and money to....

Comparing collegiate recruitment and alumnae initiation is like comparing apples and oranges. Sure, mutual selection is important for AI, but it is nothing at all like collegiate recruitment.

I've always felt that Alumnae Initiation should be reserved for the women who've helped out the organization in some way, women who are approached by the organization for this privilege known as membership. When a PNAM shops around for sororities she wants to AI, it's saying to me "I've got more than one I want to join, and I want to keep the others around just in case yours doesn't work out."

There's nothing to be confused about. You just DON'T compare recruitment and Alumnae Initiation.

This is exactly the approach GC encourages for PNMs. So why do the most vocal posters on GC advise just the opposite for PNAMs?

And I think you missed my point about mutual selection. Denying PNAMs the right to make the first overture is essentially denying their part of the mutual selection process.

AOEForMe, thanks for your response. I agree that selecting someone who may live in your house for several years requires a different process than selecting someone to serve on committees and monthly alumnae chapter meetings. Good point.

Because AI is NOTHING like collegiate recruitment. Just because there are two methods of entry into membership into an organization does not mean the attitudes and approach for one has to be applied to the other.

No, I don't think I missed your point at all. If Abigail Alumna wants to petition Patty PNAM for membership, Patty PNAM would have to be willing to go through AI. There you go, AI mutual selection.

Collegiate chapters don't have to take in every PNM that wants to be a member very badly. Why should Alum Chapters have to take in every strong, smart professional that wants to devote time, energy, and money?

It's simple: collegiate chapters are designed to recruite new members. Alumnae chapters are designed to enable alumnae to continue in the group they joined after they leave college. They are NOT meant to recruit - they are meant to be a continuation from college. AI programs exist to honour women who the GLO believes have contributed to the GLO already, or who have a tie to the group (i.e. mothers, volunteers). Some NPC groups do not have an AI program at all.

I'm not suggesting that sororities must accept everyone who expresses an interest. Of course not!

But I feel bad for Patty PNAM, waiting around for Abigail Alumna to recognize what a fantastic sister she would be. This is analogous to the way well-bred young ladies in my mother's generation had to wait for men to ask them out. It was scandalous for the girls to ask a boy out back in the day. Why is it so wrong for Patty to express her interest? How will Abi know Patty is even interested otherwise? Maybe it's time for this social norm to catch up with other social norms, and encourage women to take more direct ownership of their own happiness rather than just waiting around for something to fall into their lap.

Unpopular opinion: Are NPC orgs really doing that much for humanity that women would rather join a sorority as an alum over the Junior League, the Order of the Eastern Star, or as volunteers and board members of their favorite nonprofits?

In the District of Columbia I don't see it.

That said, I do agree with OPhiAGinger in that there is inconsistency in the NPC messages about the paths to membership that goes beyond each NPC having their own alumnae or honorary membership process.

It wouldn't kill an NPC or two to have an AI process which was structured more like an NPHC sorority -- and it wouldn't kill an NPC to have no AI process at all.

Take it to the convention floor, ladies! Some of the gates are wide open.

That's just how the policy in some sororities works. My thoughts:


Originally, AI was created to honor non-members who have served the sorority in some capacity (faculty advisor, housemom, etc). So I think that's why AI works the way it does now. Because it wasn't meant for everybody and their mom who was interested. Just certain "special cases." It wasn't meant to be an option for people to regularly pursue membership (like collegiate recruitment). Hence why the mutual selection thing does not apply in this case.

Amazingly enough, the members of each NPC group get to decide whether they want to have an AI program at all, and if so, how it will operate. I can't imagine trying to dictate to another group what they should or should not do. NPHC groups have their way of doing things, and more power to them. Some NPC groups don't have AI at all - if it works for them, good. I am a big fan of Gamma Phi's AI program. I like it the way it is, and see no reason to change.

I know of no NPC group that has an AI program with the stated aim of providing philanthropic opportunities for women. While our charitable works are important, they are not the only reason for membership, and the various AI programs are, as has been noted, considered an honour to be bestowed, not something to be pursued.

I'd also like to add that NPC members don't question the membership intake processes of NPHC or Multi-cultural sororities, or professional groups, or fraternities.

And those groups shouldn't question the membership intake processes of others. What works for one will not always work for all.

NPC sororities get the vast majority of it's members through it's collegiate chapters. So if you didn't feel you had time for it then, well, you missed the boat.

There are so many groups out there - like the Junior League for example - that are doing great things for philanthropic causes.

No. We question each other daily. It's conversation and there's nothing wrong with it.

Not necessarily. People tend to forget that not all NPHC people in real life or on this board have the same opinions.

I just want to add before the shit storm starts that just as I complain about people painting NPHCs with the same brush, there are many people who speak "on behalf" of the entire NPC about the AI process and what it "should" be for when the orgs really and truly speak for themselves. Some of the orgs really do welcome AIs and have no problem with being approached. Why is it that those orgs (still part of the NPC) are never mentioned in these conversations?

I actually really don't care about the answer to that question, lol

For the OP, there are two issues here.... the greekchat "sentiment" and the reality of the individual NPC orgs.

And I will continue to weigh in on this no matter where one thinks my lane is. :)

Cosign with my Triad Sister on this.


If Patty PNAM would truly be a fantastic sister, Abigail Alumna would see it without Patty calling her attention to it and, if Abigail's GLO initiates alumnae, she could bring up the subject. Abigail would know whether or not Patty was sister material for one or more of the following reasons:

A) Patty was already one of Abigail's good friends and demonstrated the traits and values that Abigail's GLO holds dear (and I add that traits and values part because just because someone is a rockin' friend doesn't necessarily mean she'd be a good sister),

B) Patty had been helping Abigail's GLO in some way and had a proven track record, or

C) Patty's daughter/stepdaughter/niece/etc was a sister of Abigail's GLO and had supported the sisterhood for some time.

Let me also add that Abigail Alumna may be best friends with Nancy Non-Greek, and Nancy might be an exceptional woman with multiple Nobel Peace Prizes, a load of Olympic Gold Medals, and a patent on the cure for cancer, but she may not be interested in alumnae initiation, even if Abigail wants to sponsor her and brings up the topic.

Neither of you are members of an NPC sorority (If I am wrong I apologize) so I don't think you completely understand how we do things, and why. You may have been on campus with or rushed NPC groups, but each chapter, of each group, varies and since we only agree to certain unanimous agreements, we decide on membership for collegiate and alumnae members on our own terms. This also varies from chapter to chapter, and year to year. An AI or PNM may not have a snowball's chance in hell when certain people are involved, or depending on the dynamic at that time, but that can change completely for whatever reason. I respect (but not necessarily agree) with the membership choices made with my own chapter and sorority, let alone with all my NPC sisters, but unless there is something that violates our values or is outright wrong, I need to respect those decisions.

Also your generalization about how we pick groups is wrong. I know women in every sorority and wouldn't have joined based on personality of the group. I made a choice that had to do with Alpha Gam, and in fact there are sisters who are my bffs, my two bffs in the world are not Alpha Gams. There are people who have touched my life and other reasons I became an Alpha Gam, and I know other women (not just on GC) chose a group for personal reasons that have nothing to do with the personality of the women at rush. A lot of women see the "big picture" and that's how we operate.

I can see AI happening in an area without those organizations, but with a college, for example where I live there are two land grant universities, and the nearest Junior League and Eastern Star are about 90 miles away. Some places are hard to find advisors and involvement, and I've even advised a group that isn't mine due to there not being a lot of people who have the want or understanding to do it.

I think what you are perceiving as inconsistencies has to do with all 26 groups doing their own thing, but since we're all NPC members who agree to certain standards, we fall into a strange space. I really like that each group can do what they want as long as they follow the unanimous agreements. I know NPHC groups have some similarities in structure, and they are all NPHC members, but I'd never assume they had anything similar in membership intake, standards, or anything else.

Just curious - which are the NPC groups that welcome interest in AI from anyone? I was under the impression that none of the 26 did, but perhaps I am mistaken. I am confident that at least 12 that I know of do NOT.

One of the beauties of the NPC is that while we all are bound by the Unanimous Agreements, individual groups are free to handle everything else as they see fit.

I know that if my bff had the time (and there was a need where she lived) and Alpha Gam needed help, I would send my sisters her information, but I wouldn't say OMG! I know she'd be the best potential Alpha Gam ever initiate her! If they were open to AI they'd probably suggest it on their own, but I know it wouldn't cross her mind to ask for membership. She'd do it because a) she works with students and likes to mentor b) Alpha Gam is important to me and she sees the value in it, even without membership and c) she has Type I diabetes and knows that's our international philanthropy.

I plan to be in higher ed. and I can easily see myself PMing you (KSUViolet) to send my information on to whoever the chapter advisor is in Fairbanks and offering to help them while I work on my PhD and being panhellenic because we don't have a chapter there, yet I value and support other groups. I really see AI being more frequent in rural and isolated areas due to lack of advisors than I see it in urban areas (que mad dash of women who want AI to fulfill their dreams to land grant colleges in the boonies).

To further clarify - are those groups with AI information on their website directing that information to their members (who would then be able to make use of the information) or to random non-members? That would indicate whether or not the group welcomed inquiries from those interested.

I think AI is so special and unique to each group that you can't really make any blanket statements about it. I really see AI approached as a case by case basis, depending on the merit of each case, the needs of the geographic area and the ties the person to has to the organization already. And, I like it that way, personally. Each AI that I know personally ended being an AI in a different way but each was determined appropriate based on the individual situation.

I would love it if my NPC group (since if I attempt to say ALL I'd have my arm bitten off) had something similar to NPHC alumni intake process. I do feel that there are people of value who may find an organization interesting. I don't think it's right to hold it against some people that they did not go through recruitment. To me that is a lame excuse.

Not everyone is cut out for that, no everyone has the opportunity. Some people couldn't afford it, some people didn't make the cut for pathetic reasons based on an 19 year old's opinion, some people had other activities that demanded far too much of their time, some people didn't have the grades, some people didn't see the value in it at the time but have seen the light and regret it, etc. Who am I to hold the past against them (with the exception of those "special" situations [ie. crazy people]).

Also, I think it would encourage alumna associations to play an even more active role in their groups.

NPHC manages to do it and does it very successfully. While I don't think every org. should be required to, I think it has the potential to really change the scope of an organization for the better. There are so many people who aren't Greek - and while they don't all have to be Greek I must admit they would make very good candidates and eventually members.

Why should they be denied simply because in the past it has "been that way"? Things/people/companies/organizations/policies, can and do change all the time. Why should teenagers and young adults be the only ones building membership in our organizations?

And this is the difference. We recruit and have an elaborate mutual selection process for the undergraduate experience because believe in what the all the groups offer undergraduate women.

AI is about serving a particular group and the interest of the group. There's no general experience that we think women should select among.

(I mean any of the NPCs that offer AI, not that I'm speaking for Sigma.)

I wonder if the information is now in the "members only" section.

That's not my intention at all, and I apologize if I gave that impression.

I am raising this question because my GLO has recently started considering an AI program and I want to get a better understanding of what has worked (and not) for the groups that have a program like this. It seems like old GC threads may have provided an overly supportive viewpoint that didn't reflect reality, and more recent threads reflect an overly pessimistic attitude.

So, again, the answer is to sit and wait for what you want to drop into your lap...? The people I most admire in life are the ones who make things happen. IF my GLO does develop an AI route to membership, those are the kind of people I hope are interested because those are the kind who can add the most to our organization.

But don't you think that NPHCs offer an much richer and involved alumnae membership in general? I don't intend to slight NPC groups, but we didn't generally communicate to women their obligation to join and pay dues to a alumnae/grad chapter upon graduation when I was an undergraduate.

I think my own group does a better job with this now, but I think the idea that the sorority involved a lifelong commitment to involvement and service is something that maybe 10% of NPCers took to heart but that 90% of NPHCers did.

I think most NPC members think alumnae status is about rec. writing and legacies.

Ditto. We don't do recs up here and there are hardly any legacies either.

True. I'm not a member of an NPC and, therefore, not privy to many of the inner workings of your organizations. That's why I'm asking questions --- to build my understanding. Thanks for your response!:)

I was thinking more along the lines of if I was working for the University, advising that way, holding time management and research skills workshops, help write cover letters, dress for and do mock interviews, etiquette dinners not internal Sigma operations but more general stuff. Events that could also be open to campus women, so it serves a greater good for women, and Sigma could be the sponsoring group. Raise awareness of Sigma, women's groups, women's issues, and promote a positive sorority image and experience. Volunteering with an organization other than my own has been real eye opening, and if I'm somewhere Alpha Gam isn't, why not offer my time and talents inter-fraternally to my NPC sisters?

Of course that will be right after I get the Alpha Gam Arctic Junior Circle going, and buy a house.

If what a woman wants is more along the lines of what NPHC groups offer, wouldn't it make more sense to,oh, I don't know, pursue membership in a NPHC group?

eta - maybe the op would be interested in the "If you could design an AI program" thread.

I think rec writing is more of an APH thing - at least, in my experience. The APH members get the information from APH, and then follow their GLO's procedure to procure recs. While of course individual alumnae write recs for girls they know, the vast majority of recs (which are so important down here) probably come through APHs.

What percentage of graduates are active in alumnae groups 10 years out of college? I think my 10% may have been low, but I don't really know. When I look at the size of the group at alumnae events vs. the number of undergraduates at chapters in the area, it looks like a tiny number of involved alumnae.

I didn't mean that alumnae are all concerned with those two issues, but I think they pretty much only think about their memberships as alumnae when they know a PNM or when they have kids. I think that most graduates think about their own memberships in a backwards kind of memories-of-college kind of way.

I'm not saying this is the way they should think, but I don't think NPC alumnae membership is typically comparable to NPHC alumnae membership.

You could work with an NPC alumna for years and suddenly find out she was greek. You're probably going to know of NPHC membership pretty early on, even if the signs are subtle. What's up with the African Violets or all the Ivy?

Oh, I think NPCs are doing a better job of informing new members about the concept of lifetime membership, but we still have a fair amount of work to do. I don't know that a more open AI program is the answer.