Dog behavioral problem - can anyone help?
 

For about 8.5 years I've owned a black shelter dog named Marley. She was about 2 years old when I got her from the animal shelter. The shelter staff told me she had been abused before they got her and she spent some time wandering around as a stray before they got her.

She's the perfect dog, if not a little overly protective; she follows me everywhere, is quick to learn tricks, etc. She's pretty aggressive with strangers, but once she knows you she's submissive and docile.

My problem is in the car. I take her with me everywhere, but we keep running into one issue: Marley HATES anything that runs on diesel.

I don't know if it's the sound of the diesel engine that bothers her or the fact that most of the time a diesel engine belongs to a huge truck, but she HATES anything and everything that runs on diesel. She goes nuts; barking, growling, throwing herself against the side of the car. It's bizarre. Her rage is so focused and intense I can't believe she's the same sweet, sedentary dog I live with.

I've tried keeping her leash on in the car so I can pop her collar when she does this. I've tried yelling at her. Nothing seems to work, and there's only so much I can do since when this happens I'm inevitably driving the car.

Does anyone have a dog that does this? Or know of something I can do to fix Marley's problem? Any advice would be very appreciated!

What would Cesar Milan say?

Not helpful.

cesar milan was the first thing that popped into my mind too, ree-Xi. i think he is a miracle worker.

hdiapm, your dog's reaction makes me wonder if her abuser drove a truck and that is why she reacts in such a way when she hears a diesel engine. poor puppy!

do you use a pinch collar on her when she rides in the car with you? is she restrained in the car?

have you spoken to her vet about this?

Same here.

First of all, you're going to have to train the dog not to fear the trucks (obviously), but you're not going to do that by sitting in the front seat yelling back at her while she flips out.

Question.. how aggressive does she get? Do you think she could potentially hurt someone while in this state? If so, I would suggest asking your vet or a trained professional for advice as to how to handle the situation.

The first thing you should do, though, is figure out what the real problem is. If there is any way to get a diesel engine sound on a CD, or to maybe play a video of trucks off of the computer, I would probably play it, and see if she has the same reaction. This way, you'll know if it's just the sound that bothers her. If so, it might be even easier to train her, as you won't have to do it while riding in the car.

But even if this is the case, I would bring the information to someone who knows how to train dogs, and ask them how exactly to go about the situation. Especially if you have no idea as to where to even start to fix the problem.

I thought of the Dog Whisperer as well. My thought is that she is having a reaction to the sound of the engine, the smell of the diesel fuel, or a combination of both.

(As an aside--We used to have a cat that would freak out when someone rang the doorbell. She loved people, but our guess was that there was a frequency in the door chimes that really upset her. She would run and hide, then come out after a little while and be perfectly happy.)

Good luck!

It's helpful if you watch the show or read his book - acclimating a dog to things to reduce anxiety, fear and anger towards a particluar object/person/entitiy.

It's a learning process for both the owner (pack leader) and dog (pack member).

Way to be snitty. I was trying to be helpful.

Well, then thank you, ree-Xi.

I have one of Caesar Millan's books, but it's hard to apply to your own dog (especially in a situation where the problem isn't entirely clear.)

I talked to her vet about it (the vet is great) and the vet just laughed and said I can probably train her out of it.

A dog trainer would be awesome, but it's not in the financial cards for me right now or anytime in the near future. They're expensive! I used one right when I first got the dog. Effective, but expensive.

You could try bringing treats with you in the car and rewarding her whenever she's good. It might take a while but eventually she'll probably link the two.

Or, stop taking her with you everywhere. No need to do that probably, especially if car rides are upsetting her.

I work long hours and my parents live the next town over, so I drop my dog off at their house every day. My dad's retired, so he's home during the day. Hey, it beats cooping the dog up in one room all day and forcing her to hold her bladder for 10 or 11 hours.

What I'm trying to say is she's still going to be in the car 10 times a week (5 days a week x 2 trips each day) no matter what I do. Although I could definitely cut down on the extraneous trips - the quick runs to the grocery store, the post office, etc.

If it only happens in the car and no one is being hurt by it, just accept that it's eccentricity at its best. Popping her collar when she's excited and agitated is only going to make things much worse. It won't help you...

If it's really that big of a deal, and Cesar Millan doesn't float your boat, just have your vet prescribe some Acepromazine or Valium and dose her up 30-45 minutes before getting in the car. Seriously. The meds are not expensive. Cut out the unnecessary trips and just dose her lightly each way.

This actually seems like great advice I'd be comfortable with.

I think I will check with the vet about the drugs. While the daily trips are too short to really warrant sedating her, I could REALLY use some chemical assistance for the next long car trip I have to take her on. That's a great idea, thank you.

This is obviously a psychological issue.

Drugging him is not the answer.

If he is afraid of the sound, put music on in the car and if you can, pipe it to his area.

If he is afraid of the sight of the vehicles, get those baby shades so he can't see out the window he is sitting at.

While you're at it, get a doggy seatbelt to keep him in one corner.

Keep his favorite toy or blanket with him to keep him feeling "safe".

I strongly suggest trying to figure out how you can keep him at home instead of taking on these terrifying trips for him. He is obviously scared to death. Fearful dogs can act out in odd ways - ocd chewing, biting or nipping, agitation, etc.

Can you get a pet walker once a day? Maybe a teenager who can take him on a 10 minute walk for $5? Why do you have your parents watch him anyway? Do they enjoy it or did you plop it on their laps? Just wondering if you are leaving him over there just bc you haven't worked on a solution to keep from having to cart him everywhere. It can turn into a serious issue for the dog, and if it means you might have to spend less on something "extra" and do something that will help your dog, then you might have to make that sacrifice.

Quick story about fear and dogs. My friend's dog was petrified of thunder storms. After a bad summer, this dog had chewed his leg down to bone, destroyed furniture, went on anxiety and depression pills, and had a heart attack. There wasn't anything they could do to prevent storms (he hid in the bathtub during them), but you have a situation that might have an alternate solution.

No, shit Sherlock. You think it's a psychological issue... Really? :rolleyes:

She has stated she really isn't interested in behavior modification solutions. The next best thing would be to reduce the anxiety of the dog before it reaches the crazy level in the car.

I answered this in my initial post. I have my parents watch the dog because I work long hours and it wouldn't be fair to the dog to coop her up in a room and expect her to hold her bladder for 10 or 11 hours.

My parents do enjoy it; they have two dogs of their own, so the addition of mine is really not a big deal. Plus, they like Marley.

The issue seems to be hearing the diesel engine, since it doesn't seem to matter what kind of vehicle is making the noise. And the noise is what perks her ears up in the first place. I'm not sure playing music at a volume loud enough to drown out street noise would be good for the dog. I know it'd be too loud for me.

Giving the dogs drugs for long car rides sounds like a good option to me. The dog isn't hurting herself or anyone else with her little tantrums; it's just annoying me. So accepting this as an eccentricity of hers means I tolerate the antics for short trips and I sedate the dog for longer trips where the dog could really get herself worked up.

I have to agree that drugging your dog is not the answer. There is obviously something wrong with your dog... if you're just going to mask the symptoms by drugging the dog, what's the point?

A lot of people here have given great advice --- trying to acclimate the dog, talking to a vet, talking to a dog trainer, finding alternate ways to care for your dog without having to take the poor dog on these terrifying rides.

If money is an issue, go to your local Petsmart and talk to the trainer there. Most of them I have spoke to are willing to give you some tips without making you sign up for a class.

Also, if money is an issue, I'm not sure why buying prescription drugs to sedate your dog is even an option...those cost money :)

Yelling at your dog or choking it with it's collar when it's obviously terrified is not going to help the situation.

Like someone else mentioned - maybe you can get someone to walk the dog... if you're worried he will have to hold his bladder for 10-11 hrs, take the time to train him on doggie pads to use while you are gone.

Alternatively, you can try Google to come up with some solutions... I'm not a dog trainingy professional, but it might be worth a try --
http://en.allexperts.com/q/German-Sh...truck-fear.htm

Note that is says punishing your dog while it's in a state of fear only makes the fear worse... so you might want to stop yelling at the dog or whatever else... not only does that make your dog's fear worse, but it is a distraction from your driving.

Additionally, Ceasar Milan came to my mind first too... dogs can sense your state of being. If you are freaking out while you're driving and yelling at him, you aren't making the situation any better. Dogs respond best when you're in a calm state.

Let's leave the dog at home alone all day instead of giving it a 1/2 a valium to reduce its anxiety for a car ride?

There is nothing cruel about providing relief to a dog. I would think someone a better dog owner who is trying to give the dog human interaction during the day than someone who prefers to leave a dog at home with puppy pads even though they could take it to their parents.

Generic valium or ace pills? Cheap. Hours of training? Not so cheap.
Pills? Will provide some definite relief to the dog. Training? Might work, might not.

I don't know about you, but the dog walkers here charge $10-15 per day...

I am not sure why people think it is cruel to medicate dogs who are averse to certain objects.

Behavior modification IS a great thing. But, not everything can be cured. And, medication is a valuable source of relief for many dogs.

FWIW, while our dog has NO problems with any sort of ride, he does have separation anxiety at times. We bought that pheremone spray (can't think of the name) and that calms him down somewhat. The rest, we're trying to work out with him.

Does it get anyone else that the topic at hand is a crazy acting dog named Marley? :p

My dog used to be the exact same way whenever she heard fireworks. Every last behavior you described and then some--it was AWFUL! The noise terrified her (and with good reason). I'm all for the med option (not for everyday, but for long trips like you said). Medication was the only thing that worked for my dog, so I completely understand. Sometimes, you just have to go there. However, until you and the vet figure out what dosage is right for your dog (and even after), I second tying her leash to something or getting a doggie seatbelt. If anything's worse than a freaked out dog, it's a freaked out dog who's half sedated. If she's belted down, she'll be less likely to hurt herself or accidentally slam into you while you're driving.

Thank you. I was starting to feel crazy.

I'm dealing with a ~10 year old dog with a history of abuse. So, much as I love her, behavioral modification has been dicey at best. She's my bff, but she's not the sharpest crayon in the box. Or, to be more fair, she has a lot of psychological issues that stand in the way of her learning to act like your typical dog.

I've had to find a lot of alternative methods to train her. We get creative with the problem solving, but this one had stumped me.

Unrelated: I got seven copies of Marley and Me when the book came out. Notably, my dog is NOT named after Bob Marley. She's named after Scrooge's business partner in A Christmas Carol. Because I'm awesome like that.

You can't run your errands with your cat in the car, though.

I missed the doggie seatbelt thing (duh - my mind was on other things!!). We have a doggie car seat for our bichon. It's a nice one - there's a "suitcase" at the bottom for his things, then the raised, padded seat with a halter for him.

The last long distance trip he went on (to Tennessee - this pup travels!), I got stopped for speeding. The trooper laughed at the little sign on his car window (Warning - this car protected by a killer bichon!), and asked if he was restrained. When I showed him the halter, he lowered my speed forty miles mph so I only had to pay the minimum fine, and it wouldn't show up on my insurance. He also said that he did it because our dog was properly restrained! So, even if you think it looks silly, the doggie seat belt can save your dog's life AND help you with a ticket! ;)

Honey... I don't think he lowered your speed 40 mph because your dog was strapped in. :)

I would be willing to bet you don't get a whole lot of tickets, period, regardless of how often you get pulled over!

not an expert, but this worked for me
 

have you tried walking your dog or playing some you-want-the-ball-you-wannit-huh-do-ya-yeah-go-git-it-go-git-the-ball (sit-stay-fetch) before you get in the car? the fetching part is the treat, and a little "gooood girl." it's positive reinforcement for following commands. it'll subdue the prey drive, defensive aggression, or other inappropriate behavior she exhibits towards anything, including vehicles. i like using the ball/toy, or a stroke/pet and a verbal praise as the reward rather than food. fat dogs are ridiculous. i think that's just as bad as people who have cats that way 30 lbs. anyway.

you could get a diesel running and parked around a corner out of sight. you could start around the corner and walk her by it several times with a taut-leashed verbal admonishment. maybe a nudge or a tap, too. does she display aggression at parked trucks?

i'd start with the sit-stay-giddit game, first. it's way more fun, and shorter. i usually play fetch with my aussie shepard twice a day. it's a nice break, plus, she used to be a cantankerous little bitch.

You would hate me. When I went to the vet he palpated her ribs and hips and then looked at me over the rims of his glasses and said, "This dog should have a waist."

I like this idea. I'm not sure how I'm going to get my hands on something with a diesel engine, but if I did this two weekends in a row I bet she'd be a lot better. I have no idea what could be so terrifying about the sound of one engine over another. She does NOT react this way to cars, vans, trucks, etc. that run on regular old gas.

My dog has australian shepherd in her! And border collie too. I've heard that with the working dogs like that you have to provide them with some sort of "work" to do or they get anxious. I think running after the ball would count as "work".

I'll have to be careful, though - my dog's at least ten (she's a shelter dog, so who knows how old she is) and overweight, so I need to make sure I don't give her a little doggie heart attack or something.

Amen.

Exactly. And you don't need to take them with you.

So eloquently put. If you are going to quote me, quote my suggestions as well. I made suggestions on how to help the dog while it's in the car.

We used to give Ace to one of our dogs before taking car trips. It wasn't really because she was aggressive, but the poor thing just wouldn't calm down. Everything got her worked up. When we told our vet about it, he suggested giving her Ace before putting her in the car. She has since calmed down, and we no longer need to drug her before trips, but having that Ace was priceless. (Our dog is a Border/Aussie mix - weighs around 50lbs - and a $10 bottle of Ace lasted quite a while. Granted, we didn't put her in the car everyday, so yours probably wouldn't last as long, but for us the cost was pretty minimal.)

Have you thought about the dog being sensitive to diesel smell? One of my friends has a problem with diesel fumes - she has to set her ventilation system to recirculate when she's driving in traffic. Couldn't hurt to try.

I hadn't thought of that, but it's a great thought! I know dogs' noses are super sensitive... it makes sense that there might be a smell that was offensive to them.

It appears that you don't actually own a diesel fueled vehicle then (unless I'm very confused). So why is it necessary to drive one to work or on long trips? Perhaps you might could just drive something else? Just askin', sis.

I don't ever drive a diesel.

The problem is when we're driving down the road or sitting in traffic and there's a diesel the next lane over. That's when she goes bonkers.

Ohhhhhhhh. :p

ETA: What about a toy/blanket with a soothing smell and something that emits sounds soothing to dogs? I don't know if it'd work but maybe Marley can just put her little head under it and zone out?

Hey vets - at what age do you neuter a dog?

Not a vet, but I think the going age is 6 - 8 months for a male dog.

Not a Veterinarian only a Registered Veterinary Technician, but you can neuter a dog anytime after 8 weeks if both the testicles descend, but some will still wait until around 6 months.

I meant spay, not neuter. This is for a girl puppy.

In my opinion, spays should be done anytime after 8 weeks, and before her first heat, as the chances of mammary cancers are greatly increased by her going into heat.

I agree with kstar just as long as she (your puppy) doesn't have puppy vaginitis.