Spin-Off: Mentally Unstable People with Advanced Degrees
 

It was stated in another thread that they don't give MBAs to crazy people.

I assert that the mentally unstable are perfectly capable of earning advanced degrees.

Any of you care to chime in with examples to support or refute my assertion?

Most of my profs. held advanced, if not terminal degrees. Most of them were a little "touched."

Bruce E. Ivins, aka Prune Tacos in the GC World, the anthrax scientist, PhD in Mircobiology
Ted Kaczynski, the Unabomber, PhD in Mathematics

Ahhh PruneTacos.

I am honestly surprised that more people didn't seem to be disturbed by his story.

YES!

John Forbes Nash, Jr., PhD, pioneer in game theory, paranoid schizophrenic, subject of "A Beautiful Mind"

Eccentricity has always been tolerated, if not accepted, in academia. Think of the "mad scientist" or the "absent-minded professor." Extreme success in one part of your life seems to excuse other, less savory aspects of your life. There are plenty of crazy-ass people who have PhDs or other advanced degrees. The ivory tower, and especially once tenure is granted, is far more accepting of certain nonsense than the private sector.

Also, why do people ascribe such prestige to an MBA? The University of Phoenix, for crying out loud, grants an MBA. With an open admissions policy, don't think the crazies aren't going to come calling!

I had a good number of crazy professors in college, fewer in grad school (they were just idiots), and I dated a man who, after we broke up, I realized that he was actually insane. We met while he was getting his MBA.

*raises hand*

http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/sh...ad.php?t=79946

http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/sh...ad.php?t=80434

^^^ Yet and still, people just don't seem to be any more cautious, even though they know we had a killer among us.

Don't get me started on the "prestige" of the MBA.....

Since most schizophrenic patients present during their mid to late twenties, it is very likely that someone could get an advanced degree before they even knew they were mentally ill. Also, no one can stop a mentally ill person from obtaining an advanced degree since that is discrimination. I had a schizophrenic girl in my med school class who dropped out second year during a psychotic break. They let her back in three or four years later. My class had graduated long before, so no one knew anything about her. She ended up doing a General Surgery residency. I've always wondered how she held up under that immense amount of stress!

Me

Graduate schools don't ask questions about mental stability. I know crazy people with PhDs, MBAs, masters degrees, EdDs, JDs, etc.

lol lol

Dang, I missed that one.

I've found that most psych majors have some serious problems themselves...

Boy, isn't that the truth. I've run across many a psych major with serious issues.

If psychology majors are psychopaths, are sociology majors sociopaths?

Are television majors telepaths?

I don't think anyone is suggesting that mentally ill folks should not receive, or should be prevented from receiving, advanced degrees. Sometimes, when confronted with someone who is clearly mentally ill, people will say, "well, they have a Fillintheblank Degree so they must not really be crazy!" I think it happens in some communities more than others.

Television major? Is that the proclaimed Couch Potato?

LOL

At some schools I'm familiar with, there is an RTVF major (Radio, Television, Film) in the school of communications.

Haha, don't know if you're joking or not...but some schools have television and film undergrad programs. My undergrad had one (out of the College of Communications), and it was essentially the film majors and those who wanted to go into TV and film production. Some of the programs are quite good; I know a bunch of people who have gone on to be producers of nationally-broadcast events, or some of the big national nightly news programs.

There are definitely crazies in every field, with any degree, from undergraduate degrees, to those with an M.D., J.D., MBA, etc.

Here is my take on it. I know many socially awkward people (some mentally ill, as well) who stay in school to avoid working with other people. Often they either become too stressed by human interactions or are extreme introverts. It is easier on them to dive into research and become experts in their field of study.

I remember one of my Calculus professors who was like this ("Dr. Tom"). He knew the material inside and out and often talked over our heads. Once in the middle of a problem. He stopped and stared at the board for 5 minutes without saying a word (we had a very small class and no one said a word - just shot glances an one another). Finally, he walked up to the board and placed his forehead on it, as if he was transmitting a signal between the chalkboard and his brain. Then, he turned around and just started lecturing again as if nothing happened.

Dr. Tom was also a concert pianist and never married. he lived at home with his parents and doubt he had any friends. The biggest kicker was during a final. Since several of his classes were small, he held all of the finals at the same time in an auditorium. About 15 minutes into the final, he sat down at the piano and started playing Beethovan's 5th. I think more than a few of us were freaked out.

Having several students with Asperger's, I recently read a great book about the condition that was written by a woman who has it. She felt that many academics had it and I believe this was confirmed by other people involved in writing the book.

We've had several really odd people on the faculties of colleges where I've taught and they were probably affected. Of course, Asperger's isn't a form of mental illness per se but if a victim is odd enough, it could certainly look like it.

BTW, has anyone mentioned serial murderer Ted Bundy? He had a JD.

Ooooh, I know one...

Yes, I would say bipolar is a mental illness that makes people unstable.

I can't speak for everyone who has an advanced degree, but in my area, life sciences / biomedical sciences, very often people are quite normal when they enter grad school. The 'craziness' usually comes during grad work because of all the pressure and expectations associated with obtaining an advanced degree. Not just that, working in a life science / biomedical lab can be very stressful. And, dealing with your grad committee is no picnic either.

When working on an advanced degree, you don't have a normal life. You have to give up a lot - hobbies, activities, relationships, for the degree. Some people can handle the pressure, some can not.

As for the crazy prof, obtaining tenure can be just as stressful as grad school. Some universities have dealt with tenure by eliminating it, or not making such a big deal out of it. And, for those schools that still have a tenure system, maintaining tenure can be stressful also.

You hit the nail on the head. My brother's nephew has Aspergers and is highly functional. He received an Associates Degree in computers where he can concentrate (ok, more like obsess) over something that would drive someone else crazy. He can write a paper on anything you ask him, but if you want him to communicate orally he sounds like Rainman!


For years, I worked with a guy who was a Fulbright Scholar and never could quite figure him out. Highly intelligent, but socially awkward and speaks in a monotone voice. One day, we had someone come to speak at a Brown Bag Lunch on Autism and I brought up the quirky things that my brother's nephew does. Then it dawned on me. My co-worker has Aspergers.

A lot of signs of Schizophrenia appear in early adulthood, which would be consistent with College and Grad School. I think the additional pressures is often the catalyst for setting the illness into motion.

I normally don't actually "lol" but I just did. I'm just picturing what would happen had that happened in one of my classes. That's awesome. What did everyone do?

A lot of jaws dropped, as did a few pencils. By that point in the quarter, we all knew how strange he was. Just the icing on the cake and something to talk about during the next quarter.

I just checked his CV. He is still teaching.

Bump!

Whoops.

It's always a timely topic! :)

My daughter is taking the same learned professor I took for Logic some 24 or so years ago. She asked me if he was awkward or insane. I answered I thought it was some of both.

My experience has been that most logicians have advanced Philosophy degrees. And most philosophers are a bit odd (awkward, insane, what have you). So, it makes sense that your logician is awkward and insane.

I could argue that you'd have to be insane to teach logic for 24 years, but then I'd be making a case for my own (inevitable) insanity. Tell you what, though, you can learn a lot about people by teaching logic. It's truly amazing to see some people's thought processes in action. But that's another thread.

"Dr." Phil (not you, Chaos! ;))
"Dr." Laura

I believe you can make a fairly convincing argument for insanity being the result of teaching ANYTHING for 24 years. (And when I took this professor, he had probably been teaching 10 - 14 years - so think about teaching logic for 32 - 38 years!) FWIW - my daughter is a philosophy major. She was in the philosophy library, looking woebegone. An upperclassman asked her what was up, and she answered something to the effect that it was a shame the world didn't opperate the way it logically and philosophically should. "You must be a freshman" the upperclassman replied. :rolleyes:

I know quite a few non-mentally ill people (mentally healthy?) who are staying in school to avoid working with people, responsibilities, and adulthood. Usually they go to law school because they can't think of what else to do.

My family says people who do that are "on the Campaign to Avoid Life".

I've met several "consultants" through work who have advanced degrees, but definitely are at minimum socially awkward. Many of them refer to themselves as "eccentric." Mentally unstable is probably more accurate.

I went to a talk given by a Law Professor at USC about 6 months ago... she was promoting her book "The Center Can Not Hold", which talks about her experiences with schizophrenia.

I think it's nice to see that mental illness doesn't have stop you from getting an advanced degree.

I've worked with lots of psychologists, and I always said that people go into that field for one of two reasons: A sincere desire to help others or to figure out what's wrong with themselves.

Carnation, what's the book you read?

And yes, please let's not confuse Aspergers with mental illness, much less mental instability.

This is what I'm talking about. Why on earth would "mentally unstable" probably be a "more accurate" description of someone who, in your words, is "socially awkward"?