i have never been on the yahoo group, didn't even know we had one until reading your post. i will have to go check that out. but in answer to your question, that wasn't me.

also please understand that the things said on the mtv board are usually within a context of my actions, gestures, general appearance, what i eat, skin tone, and basically everything about me being torn to shreds. it is hard to be consistently kind in response to such things, especially when it is the sisters of sigma who are usually doing the bashing from the safety of screen names. i know i have come off a bit harsh on some of the threads, but look at the things that are being said in the first place, about myself and my friends.

Thank you for responding, I have to admit that these things are what have been bothering me the most.

If you like I will send you a private message with the text that was said in your name from this chat, it got really nasty towares Candace & Amanda, and these girls thought they were talking to you.

Also regarding the MTV board, I can see how rude some people are, and I also admit that I look specifically for the posts by the pledges & sisters. It just bugged me to see personal stuff being said in that context, and what can be taking as instigating. But after what you said here, I do give you the benefit of the doubt and I'll have more of an open mind towards it in the future.

Mara, thanks for giving us the whole story when you really didn't have to. I actually COMPLETELY understand what you are saying about how when the Sigmas watch the show they are gonna see exactly what was said and done by Candace et al. I would think it would be far more difficult inside that organization after the show has aired. My question is, did this experience sour you to the Greek system as a whole? Or have you just chalked it up to an isolated incident? Also I didn't really feel that you followed Jordan. Can you tell us how her speech was set up? It seemed very spontaneous, and like she gave the speech just because you did. One last question...do you still have contact with ANY of the pledges or members from the show? Thanks!

Mara....
 

I just sent you a private message with the info

Crossing
 

"Crossing" is simply a synonym for initiating. It's roots lie in the
old cliche about "crossing the burning sands" which is a euphemistic
way to refer to old-fashioned hazing practices. Usage of the term is
most often associated with the NPHC organziations, especially the ones
that have explicit references to Egyptian mythology in their rituals.

Thanks for the info on the term "crossing" Richard. It's quite interesting to know!

Christin

I just want to apologize for my previous post. I'm not going to delete it because it's already "out there" and responded to. My sarcastic tone certainly wasn't necessary. I was simply surprised to see a GC member advocating a tougher new member period when many of the earlier threads had almost practically accused the SAEPis of hazing.

I personally believe that in general the things that the NPC, NPHC and NIC and individual chapters are trying to abolish in the name of "hazing is bad," really are bad. There are Greeks, I realize, who disagree, and I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree. But in our litigous society, the anti-hazing wave is the wave of the future, I suspect. It's not so much political correctness as it is a desire not to have our rears sued off.

......I agree (with FuzzyAlum)! Political correctness and fear of liability is one thing (ok, two), but the main thing is just plain ol' right vs. wrong. What gives one person in a GLO the right to think that they have the right to be "superior" to another? I've been calling it the "ladder" mentality.

"Climb the ladder just like I did; pay your dues just like I did; it was done to me, so you should go through it too" and on and on and on.........."

It just shouldn't be happening in today's day and age. Whether it's a "do to others as you would have them do to you" thing or anything along those lines, hazing just doesn't have a place--or shouldn't--in our GLOs today. Bottom line is respect. It needs to be earned, but the best way to earn it is to give it!

~End Soapbox~

Iris

Re: Crossing
 

Just FYI

Crossing and Intiation are not synonymous with most NPHC orgs. it ia a rite of passage but they are seperate in nature and practice. When and NPHC Org uses the Phrase..."crossing", You are correct it has to do with "Crossing the Burning Sands" or "Crossing the Sands" but the phrase is not an "old Cliche" but a common practice/rite of passage.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to disrespect anyone's rituals. Way back when
I was still in college I did a report on "rites of passage" for a
Philosophy class and in the various books I used for my research the
phrase "crossing the burning sands" shows up in a lot of different
contexts both inside and outside the world of GLO's, and it goes back
into the early 20th century and perhaps earlier than that (I mean it
was used by other organizations, fellowships, and secret societies, not
just college fraternities and sororities). But this is a whole
different topic than what this thread is about.

Thanks for putting in the correction.

Re: Re: Crossing
 

What exactly is the difference between crossing and initiation? I thought that both terms referred to the point where you become a full member... "initiation" typically used for WGLOs and "crossing" for BGLOs. :confused:

If the answer to my question is of a secret nature, just say so...

This argument about tougher pledging policies goes straight to the heart of what is tearing apart some of the best and brightest.

I won't go into details but here's my opinion: If you want interested members who fully understand the history and significance of your organization and can work succesfully together as a whole group, exhibiting selfless sisterly traits, then I don't see how you can be against a REAL pledge process.

Even though i hate to talk about old things and get off the subject, the reason why the association members aren't allowed to drink is because they wear pins with our letters on it. Since they wear the pins all the time, they can't drink through out their process. NO MEMBER, active and alumna, is allowed to drink with their letters on or even be around people who are drinking in public wearing our letters. So when you wear our letters, you don't drink.

Yes, I understand this. And the same goes in Kappa. No drinking in letters. But our new members are not required to wear their pins or letters all the time. Nor are actives, nor are alumnae.

Re: Re: Re: Crossing
 

I think it is a generalization that the terms are used differently - the specific acts of crossing and initiation are secret but generally crossing precedes initiation. They may seem to mean the same thing to some people because people generally refer to their crossing or initiation in terms of a season: fall 69 or spring 82, etc. and the two rituals will probably occur in the same season so to the outsider it sounds like the same thing.