As for Mara's question, I think that chapters have a responsibility to make all of their new members feel welcome -- when people feel they are being "tested" it is hard to develop a sense of trust. As zchi said, individual women shouldn't be cornered if there are concerns, a pledge class should be addressed. It seem like there was a lot of segregation between the pledges and the actives (specifically the rock-moving activity), both sides should make efforts to include one another.

I respect and admire any sorority that abstains from drinking during their pledge period. However, at some chapters this may not be a realistic expectation for some organizations -- some houses have pledge classes that range from 50-70 women. It may not be possible to monitor or keep track of the behavior of this many women (nor does it create a sense of trust) - it is more realistic and healthy to teach women about drinking in moderation.

Dry pledging is hazing. It makes the pledges comply with something that the sisters do not. However, if all the pledges are under 21 and you have a directive that no one in the sorority is allowed to drink underage, it is a fait accompli. (translating into English) Of-age pledges cannot be made to completely abstain from alcohol if of-age sisters do not.

mara, do the sigmas use the term "crossing" or is that just from your own experience? I thought only HBGLO's and MCGLO's used that term as a rule. Plus I didn't hear anyone say it on the show.

What is "crossing"? I do not understand.

blah blah blah blah

I'm so sick of politically correct "hazing"

The way things stand, is there anything that isn't considered hazing these days?

I am so glad I went to school when pledging was pledging.

shoot stacy, I'm just trying to make it possible for poor Candace to have a double or 2! LOL :p

my point is that people get all bent out of shape when pledges have to do interviews, signatures, scavenger hunts etc but then when you say "dry pledgeship" people are like "oh, yes, good idea." What if you said the pledges couldn't smoke, wear makeup, drive or any other legal activity - I think not. ASA actually declared dry pledgeship to be hazing somewhere back in the mid 70's.

I'm from the school that thinks pledges shouldn't be drinking, period. We weren't allowed to drink, and for a large part of when I was active, pledges weren't allowed to drink.

I also don't see anything wrong with interviews, signatures, scavenger hunts, or anything of the like.

What is ASA?

I pretty sure "crossing" means crossing over and becoming a part of the greek community. Although I must agree w/ the person who posted the comment about not hearing the term when not in reference to an HBGLO.

stacydphie

As a fellow DPhiE, I am somewhat challenged by your attitude.... can you elaborate a little?

Iris

yes NOWorNEVER, that's what I meant.

um, stacy, ASA is Alpha Sigma Alpha...a member of NPC...founded in 1901.

No, I don't intend to get into specifics, but suffice to say that when I pledged in 1990, things were different.

A lot of the politically correct stuff that I'm seeing just irritates me, and a lot of what is considered to be hazing by today's standards was completely acceptable when I was in school.

Ah, gotcha, thanks!

stacydphie
 

PM'd you...

Iris

Our rules about alcohol state that houses must be dry, rush events must be dry, and nobody underage can drink at Kappa functions that do have alcohol.

The statement that forcing NMs to do anything that actives do not have to do (or probhibiting them from doing anything that actives may) is tantamount to hazing is correct.

As Becca said, most of the sisters are not used to having anyone other than freshmen pledging. Therefore, some of "our" pledges' attitudes and behaviours regarding alcohol took many of the sisters by surprise. And I don't know this for certain, but I would hope that the Sigma house is dry as well and not just the pledge house.

I don't mean to get into a whole hazing conversation here (since there is a board for that), but if I was hazed, I would have left. I went through recruitment as a sophomore and was already very invovled on campus. I didn't have time to run around getting signatures in books or being called in the middle of the night for activities. I don't feel like I missed out on getting to know the sisters or anything like that because we did other things where we were all put on an equal level.

Okay, so there's my hazing speech -- just a little. As for Sorority Life hazing, yeah, the rock thing was definately wrong, and I agree that making pledges refrain from drinking is hazing if it's not being done to sisters who are under 21.

Jen

Most sororities and fraternities have some kind of protocol or procedure in place to try to ensure that such (apparently) drastic behavioral situations just don't happen. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, because things DO happen. Of course they do. There's always someone somewhere who takes great pride in nabbing the one guy you're really hooked on, or maybe has an addiction problem. There are girls who are virtually flunking out of school, who's gotten herself in nasty financial problems, who takes great pride in and encourages all of the "drama" involved in everything the chapter does. Don't try to tell me it doesn't happen, because it happens with women in general, sorority member or not. The difference is that the overwhelming majority of the time it's a private thing, not splashed all over national television for anyone and everyone to see.

There's some type of officer position in every GLO I'm familiar with that handles these standards and sisterhood issues, both good and bad. This office may be named Chapter Standards, Member Relations, Vice President of whatever, Chapter Relations, Standards Chair, Standards Board, Member At Large...there's probably dozens of officer titles for that sister who is responsible to educate and moderate any "standards" issues. There usually is, however, a very clear communication of expectations and those standards to be maintained very very early in the New Member or Associate period. From what we saw on the show, it didn't appear as if the Sigma new members were educated on the sorority standards, expectations and beliefs.

How would I address some of the behaviors as portrayed on the show? If someone had slapped another, initiated or not, it would have been taken to my organization's equivalent of standards faster than you could have blinked. If it was a new member, she most likely would have been depledged. If someone had been hitting on a guy that another sister had confided an attraction to, ditto. I'm from the olden days, so when it comes to alcohol issues it would have been handled differently than a chapter would today. For the most part, there's no alcohol involved in chapter sponsored events anymore and if there is, the procedures must be followed to the letter or you run the risk of losing your charter.

As for building or rebuilding trust, it's not going to happen overnight. First, you must have the desire to go forward. If people don't want to resolve differences, clear the air and move on together it'll be extremely difficult to accomplish. Luckily, most of the time it happens. You just have to be willing to start over and not assume the worst. A GLO has those treasured rituals, histories, good common memories and more to help them remember why they are there and what can happen in the future.

I know, I'm rambling again. I wonder if things weren't as bad with Sigma as MTV portrayed it to be at times. I wonder if the new members really were truly interested in joining a sorority. I wonder why so many upperclasswomen were interested in joining a sorority with such a specific emphasis, such as Sigma. Why didn't they approach Sigma before their junior or senior year? I do wonder, honestly, if anyone pledged Sigma just to star on a MTV show and get free housing for a quarter. I think most GLOs have gotten far away from "Pledges" and "Members." No one should have to prove themselves worthy of a GLO, the fact that the GLO invited you to become a new member should indicate worthiness. Yes, I think that there has to be some kind of education process so that the new members are prepared, ready and committed to be initiated. But it shouldn't be (IMHO!) an "us" vs. "them" process. We saw an awful lot of "us" vs. "them" and very little of "Sigma" as a group on the show. I'm sure that can't be real, or Sigma probably would have never survived as long as they have.

Christin