It appears that whatever "happened" between Phi Gamma Delta and their Tau Deuteron Chapter has been resolved.

Now you're reaching beyond your area of expertise and into mine. The classy people at Harvard and Yale -- old money and others -- NEVER talk up their money, influence, trust funds etc. in a public forum like this. A serious talk about investments with close friends is one thing. But any gentleman at the Cottage Club at Princeton would rather transfer to Rutgers than publicly discuss how his grandfather founded Goldman Sachs. If you expressed that kind of thing among the tuxes and strawberries at the Eliot House Spring Fete, you would be universally considered an embarrassment. Publicly expressing your "disgust" with "black culture" would pretty much destroy your reputation permanently. You can have whatever opinions you want, but tact is considered the heart and soul of manners among the classy people at Harvard and Yale.

If the essence of what's desirable about "frattiness" is being prepared for a business setting at all times, I haven't seen much that's business-ready in this thread. No leading i-bank or law firm would hire a candidate who talked publicly about how interracial marriage is bad for society, or about his reluctance to socialize with gay people...it's very bad for business. And it wouldn't matter how tasteful his clothing might be.

Note that there isn't any "IvyHard.net" board where anonymous Harvard and Yale undergrads talk trash about their wealth and how they are too classy and exclusive to voluntarily associate with those useless gel-heads who go to Big State U. Why? Because they actually have class.

Well theres also a difference. That site you refer to is a mostly anonymous site FOR those kind of people. It is not for outsiders. Similarly, this is a message board, and a mostly anonymous one. It is appropriate then that subjects such as gay marriage or black culture be discussed here. There is a certain sub society of the elite, who carry on a more English tradition of absolutely not speaking on anything of controversial nature, except in a very private nature. The fact that you would project that on to the entire elite of Ivy League schools, however, is mistaken. For every well reared student who has perfect social etiquette, there is a snobby and spoiled student who will not hesitate to use their wealth, race or family standing as offense or defense in a public argument. I know you've seen this occur, as have I.

Ok, if they are not giving up our ritual, Creed, or Standard - how would they be a separate fraternity? And, as a chapter advisor who is in contact with many other advisors and headquarter officers, again: I have never heard of a Sigma Chi chapter that is wishing to break away. I also haven't heard how our Headquarters is screwing up the chapters. While sometimes chapters don't care for policies of Headquarters, they suck it up, act like men and carry on the traditions of Sigma Chi.

Eh, not really. Many of us know each other, have met IRL or can easily figure out who is who based on screennames, location, posts about their school, etc.

Just admit that you got pwned and STFU already. You and your various personalities have nothing positive to add to this board...let alone life.

Again, I am not totally sure of the situation. One of my FIJI friends told me the story but it was quite a long one. I'll have to ask him again and report back. It is pretty widely known though...I was at my ranch with some Phi Delts and FIJIs from Texas Tech and even those guys had known about it.

For one, pwned isn't a real word, so if you're going to speak directly to me, I would prefer you use the English language. Also, telling me to STFU is very classy on your part, I'm sure the great states of South and North Carolina, along with your sorority, would be proud. For me, it is anonymous. It allows me to make various opinionated statements without being deemed "racist" or "intolerant" in real life. Unfortunately in our society, disagreeing with something that is politically correct can often lead to a label, and one that can be quite damaging.

I miss that show...

Actually its a hunting ranch in West Texas, we don't have horses....but I appreciate your miniscule attempt at humor. I was unaware that owning a ranch was something to be made fun of. Land ownership is pretty fratty in my book.

You're funny. Not funny in a tee-hee sort of way, but funny in an "Everyone is laughing at me but I think they're laughing with me" sort of way.

But you still got

http://mishilo.image.pbase.com/u13/c...5711.pwned.jpg

Beep! Beep! Beep! I hear the sound of a back peddle. This post is written in the present tense (i.e., "and is now known solely as FIJI.") clearly showing that you were giving information for something that is currently in effect. And by saying "here on campus", you are giving the impression that you knew this for a fact. I think if a chapter on my campus was a local instead of a national/international, I would definately know about it.

Little red x?

Shiner, if you accept "STFU" i think you have to accept pwned as well...

It's some weird internet slang rule :p

Shows up fine for me...even in your quote. :( Maybe it's like Buttonz's Delta symbol in her siggy...

I'm confused I got what? I really don't know who this woman is, but she's pretty annoying and seemingly unintelligent. Now regarding the internet slang rule, at least STFU makes sense. I mean its an abbreviation. According to Wikipedia (created by an Auburn grad, genius), "pwned" is a slang for "owned" which was created through some sort of nerd video game. I would put it in the category of "what is destroying our country," right beside Derek Jeter.

I don't know what you are talking about nor why you are trying to refute my statement. I said that my friends at Texas Tech knew of the story, it has nothing to do with the chapter at Texas Tech, nor did I say it did. Again, I twice stated that I was unsure of the whole story because there was alot that went into it when I was told. Yes, I do know for a fact that something had happened in the past....and that I would ask my friends for the correct story and report back. As you obviously know absolutely nothing about the matter at hand, why don't you shut the hell up and let me find out for the sake of the discussion. I was merely commenting on a situation that related to the matter of breaking off from nationals.

No,you originally used language that made it clear that the FIJI chapter was now separated from their national. Only after TSteven showed that FIJI is still part of national did you start backtracking and saying that it was something that you "heard". I will concede your point about Texas Tech. When I realized that I misread that section, I went back and edited my post. However, I stand by what I quoted your earlier post. You used present tense language stating that FIJI at UT was separated from their national.

Your original post. Notice the words and phrases: "is now known", "They don't use". All imply current facts.

How about you stop trying to prove people wrong and deal with what we're talking about?

As rap, jean shorts, liberalism, and so on gain a further foothold into American culture, we will continue to be split further apart. The split will happen. Our chapters are rich, we can afford the extra costs of insurance.

If I hadn't had to pay for those national dues, I could have bought that No Limit Soldier gold and diamond tank necklace I wanted. I guess no bling for me.

So do it.

Drop those letters you're so ashamed of now, and then try to start a new organization.

Don't keep a hold of things you don't agree with just because the insurance is still to high. If you really believe in this, I don't know why you'd remain with your present organization.

Technically, TSteven proved him wrong. And instead of acknowledging his mistake, macallen continued to compound it.

As for discussing it: there's no real discussion. There are no Sigma Chi chapters threatening to break away from Headquarters. If someone comes on here and gives information about my fraternity that I know to be wrong, I will refute it.

If breaking away from a national organization has more upside to a chapter than down...what the heck, they should do it.

They should really go into the process with their eyes wide open -- including the costs (insurance is only a part) and relationships (personal, historical and financial) with their alumni.

Nothing is ever as easy as it seems on the surface though, so I hope a chapter would do a hard study before taking action that could be regretted later.

If there really is benefit, though...why not? Tradition, fraternal oath and brotherhood aside -- which are just some of the reasons that I couldn't even consider it.

Well, in actuality, it would be to preserve tradition. We're not the ones moving away from the fraternity's history, thats what HQ is doing.

Yes but if you break away from HQ, they're going to be considered the REAL XYZ and you're going to have to change your letters and ritual etc. Those things are copyrighted.

You're discussing minor details...Sigma Chi Order... that would work, it honestly doesn't matter..

I repeat, yes there is. They aren't going to threaten it openly but I have talked to many Sigma Chi's from approximately 4 to 5 major campuses who have discussed a break away. It will not happen soon, but there are definitely chapters that have looked at it. Just because your chapter isn't up to date on the happenings of the bigger, wealthier, traditional chapter doesn't mean it's not happening. And I'm not even a Sigma Chi! I have heard the same rumblings from KA and SAE, but not much from my own Kappa Sig.

These southern breakaways are looking to preserve the fraternity, whereas the National HQ is looking to destroy it. It is only logical to breakaway from the HQ.

As far as I know, neither you nor TSteven is enrolled at nor is involved with a chapter at Texas, why don't you stop being such an unbeliveable faggot and quit your mission to discredit me. He didn't prove me wrong, he posted the link to the University website.....congratulations. As I said again I am not completely sure of the situation, but I do know for a fact that there is something largely different with the way they operate which spurned from a situation a while back. If you want to travel to Austin and find out for yourself than by all means do it. But if you want to argue with me that they don't operate solely as FIJI and don't use the Phi Gam letters whatsoever.....then I can promise you that you are wrong. I f*cking go to school here and live down the street from their damn fraternity house....so please stop.
Sorry that my horrendous use of the wrong tense got your panties in such a wad. Maybe you should go create a grammar forum so that you can write dissertations on every person's post that you think is an abomination of the English language. Sorry, its a message board..lighten up.

I have no doubt that you - and the general you when applicable - may have heard talk about a possible break from/by some people. But again, what you heard: "It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

As you noted, you are not a Sig, you are not a KA and you are not an SAE. So why are you so concerned about what is going on in those fraternities' chapters? And on a side note, when in the hell do you find time to have all these discussions with Greeks from other fraternities that are not on your campus? ("I have talked to many Sigma Chis's from approximately 4 to 5 major campuses...") Do you spend time with your own chapter brothers, go on dates, attend football and basketball games? Maybe even go to a mixer now and again. Frankly, you - this collective you - seem to spend way too much time worried about what may or may not happen to groups other than your own. Which just seems down right odd to me. Even as a ninth generation Southerner and an SEC Alum, I just don't understand it.

Actually, these so-called "breakaways" are not looking to preserve the fraternity, but members that are looking to preserve a specific chapter as they know it or want it to be. Again, fraternities have been evolving since their founding and will continue to do so. If - *if* - they take a wrong direction, I'm fairly confident that the membership will correct the direction.

I do agree. It is logical to breakaway from HQ if that is what a chapter - or some members - want to do. Hell, Sigma Chi got it's start when six of the founders broke with the Miami U. Deke chapter. So by all means, make the break and get on with it. I am sure that Sigma Chi, Kappa Alpha Order and Sigma Alpha Epsilon - and others - will survive and continue to prosper.

You take that back right now. I heart Derek Jeter!

My bad. Add ludacris to the list.

On a side note, I talk to people in other chapters from other campuses a lot. Thats what happens in the SEC, when you actually go to away games.