"Hello, ShamikaT. it appears that you have not posted on GreekChat in several weeks, why not take a few moments to ask a question, help provide a solution or just engage in a conversation with another member in any one of our forums? "

GC be alllll up in mine, again! Okay, here is my two cents.

What the hayle am I supposed to do? Pop my spit? What if yo breath clownin'? That seems more rude than chewing gum. I aiiiin't never heard of any mess like that.

I agrees with this one. Smoking bud on a public street is a fast way to get thrown in the birdcage.

Then where else I supposed to do it? What if someone had cut up the bathroom? I would have no choice.

Shiiiiiiiiii! Why? It ain't Christmas time or anything. What do I owe a hostess? Now, if there's a HOST, I may give him a lil somthin' somethin' if he treats me well. :o

Only if they deserve it. Feed me well, that means 6 White Castles, a order onion rings, french fries, and some strawberry sody...and maybe I'll shoot you an email. And keep them mangy ass dogs away from me. No, I do not want to pat Fido and let him lick my face, put him away!

How are you defining drinks here? A glass of wine? A can of beer? Boppin' Berry Blue kool-aide?

That just sounds nasty right there! :eek:

ROFLMBO:D

Now I'm hungry for fair food. Thanks ;)

You're welcome. :p Anything that can be put on a stick, those guys will do it. And it is wonderful :D

I am sorry, but I HAVE to ask; are you for real or a caricature of what someone told you a Southern lady ought to be? :confused: My mother was Saint Cecelia's(that's Charleston) and Tri-Delta in the 1950's and I never heard such foghorn-leghorn stuff come out of her mouth. It's like you picked up some primer (Or Rebecca Wells book) and copied the language and are projecting it as your own. :rolleyes:

I was raised by real women of substance and they would say your manner is 'putting on airs'.

I am probably banned now, but after reading your posts, I just couldn't keep it in anymore. It's simply ridiculous. :rolleyes:

If imagine were as important here as it is to you and if all five of our chapters were so uptight there wouldn't be ANY greeks here...

Your method doesn't work everywhere. In fact at my campus, for instance, it would be COMPLETELY detrimental to be so uptight and nitpicky.

I imagine that if you could spell image correctly it wouldn't reflect poorly on you or your group.

KIDDING! I'm only kidding. :)

Hey, it's not a good idea to eat while walking because of the risk of choking! Many child-rearing books point out this particular hazard, so for safety's sake, just stop walking for a minute while you are eating your whatever-on-a-stick.
Gum chewing is my personal pet peeve. I've seen bridesmaids chomping on it as they went up the aisle - and a friend swears she saw an actual bride chewing as she made her way down the aisle. I can't tell you how many times my children have stepped in someone's discarded gum in a parking lot - and as a teacher, I hate finding it on the bottom of desks.
As I look around, it seems to me the problem with our society is not that too many people are concerned with following ANY rules. Nope - it's this "Me me me - whatever makes ME happy is okay" attitude that results in a general disregard for the welfare of others.

I think it's very funny that you assume the groups on my campus were uptight or nit picky. We have rules....OH MY GOD!!! I had many sisters who would qualify as sluts by most people's standards, but they were discreet. I had a sister who broke her jaw after she was kicked in the face by a man who we all thought was selling her drugs. We didn't know for sure, but it wouldn't have surprised any of us. She didn't get kicked out....she was well liked and accepted. Nobody actually was kicked out of my chapter or any other chapter during the time I was a member. We all put up with a lot of crap, but if we started being known as the "sluts" or the "druggies" some heads would have rolled. But...that's my campus...and it did work. Maybe at your campus, squirrel, every chapter has their open sluts and crackheads so no one group is ostracized for it....more power to y'all, but THAT doesn't work at most campuses.

jwithers,

honeychile is indeed a real person, who was raised properly by her southern mama. she is genteel and gracious-the epitome of a southern lady, even if she was raised in pittsburgh.

for instance, she would never tell a fellow gcer, especially one relatively new to the forum, how crass and ridiculous her post was. that would be too, too tacky for words.

Too true.

honeychile is the LAST person I would accuse of putting on airs. She wrote a reasoned response detailing why certain rules of polite society are not nit-picky, but are instead considerate of other people. Those of us "raised right" as the expression goes would never put on airs - but we also know rudeness and crassness when we see it. It is a free country, as they say, and you may do whatever you wish. However, you do not get to dictate my response to it, and if you chose to belong to a sorority you do have to consider how your actions reflect on that sorority. If you think that a rule is silly, if you are an active bring it up for discussion at your meeting and vote on it would be my suggestion.
JWithers, if your mother attended or debuted at the St. Cecilia's Ball, she followed many rules that may have seemed nit-picky - but I would suggest reading C.S. Lewis' wonderful discussion of ritual and formality in his Introduction to Paradise Lost to understand why the rules do matter, and why your own dear mother undoubtly followed them.
I think it is important to distinguish between rules particular to a certain group, campus or region, and those actions which would be rude, immoral or illegal anywhere. While I do not think anyone would get kicked out of a group for eating her hot dog while walking, participating in a wet t-shirt contest with your letters would seem to warrant a talking to by the standards committee. (I have personal knowledge of the wet t-shirt incident - and the member had trouble understanding what the problem was - "But I won!" she said !!!)

Maybe in your chapter, but not in your whole sorority, and certainly not in mine.

In all seriousness, I think the issue of expelling sisters is a very difficult one. If you read other threads...like the Legacy one, people advocate kicking out people because they're annoying or trouble makers. I think for most chapters the decision is very tough and is usually preceeded by some very egregious actions by the member. I'm sure there are those very judgemental, uptight chapters out there, but I'm hoping they are few and far between. One thing I learned from living with many sisters in college, taking courses in psychology in college as well as my psychiatry courses in med school is that you'll never get along with everyone! When you gather 50 or a hundred women together there will be many with personality disorders or poor upbringings. You can't bond with everyone, but you can show them respect. In general, I think most chapters do a good job of balancing the need to preserve a good campus/national or international reputation with accomodating members whose values may be slightly different. But, I'm sure anyone can think of at least one action that would be contrary to everything their ritual teaches that would warrant discipline.

Silly me, I thought that sisterhood was everything in a sorority.

Ha Ha! What universe are you living in?

ASA's universe. The no-pretentious BS seems to be a Nationwide thing for most of our chapters. I'm sure there's one or two out there, but for the most part, not so much.

You have got to be kidding me. :eek: How could she not realize that doing that in her letters would be a huge problem? :eek::eek:

After a group of sisters went to Florida for Spring Break one year, I recall hearing very vague details about an "incident," but the 2 women involved were mortified and everyone was completely discreet about the whole thing. Although some of us heard very generally about the fact that there was an "incident," no one was told specific details. (Not even me - who was very close to both women, both were my roommates at one point or another and also from my pledge class.) Apparently, as the story goes, they were running very low on money and ended up entering a wet t-shirt contest - they assumed that no one there would ever see them again. They won the contest...and then saw that 3 guys from a fraternity at our campus who we did a lot with were right there in the audience. The gory details were never released, but supposedly they had to get pretty wild to win and were horrified to find out that fraternity guys from our campus who recognized them were there - these 2 women were typically very reserved and conservative while at school and under normal circumstances. The situation was never brought up before a standards committee, because it never became common knowledge (I only knew b/c one was my roommate), the fraternity men were kind enough to be discreet about it when they came back to campus (if they did share the story w/their other brothers when they came back, they at least all had the decency not to discuss it openly or spread the story around campus), and the sisters were genuinely upset that someone they knew from our campus was there.

Now, if they had participated in a wet t-shirt contest near our campus, while wearing our letters, and didn't care who saw them or how it would reflect upon our chapter...heads would have rolled!

noob. :p

People going buck wild on spring break thinking they won't get busted crack me up. Hello mensa, if you book the trip through your school, don't you think someone else (or a lot of someone elses) from your school might be there too?

lol...I know. I think they thought they were safe, because they deliberately tried to plan a trip at a different destination from where most people on our campus were going that year. And they hadn't happened to bump into anyone they had recognized during the early part of their trip. (The wet t-shirt contest happened later in the trip, when they were running out of money.)

You have to give the guys of Theta Delta Chi some credit though - they could have come back and gossiped about it with their brothers (I'm sure they may have shared some details, but it never became a well known story), or they could have come back and tried to spread the gossip around our chapter. But they did a good job helping to keep it fairly discreet. I do think they occasionally joked to them about having "blackmail material," but it was all in good fun and not a real threat. ;)

I believe you.

Hey, Susan, her arguement was not only had she won - she beat a Chi O!!!:eek:

OMG - looks like I just got

http://blog.glennf.com/images/mt/180px-Pwned_cat1.jpg

OMGWTFBBQ!!!!

:( :( :(

Yes, it's nitpicky in my opinion. It just seems like there's a contradiction...it's so INCREDIBLY important not to (gasp for air at the audacity) drink on the dance floor but I mean...possible drug dealing relations? Eh...we'll let it go. You are making an incredibly inconsistent arguement...at first it was all about image and now you claim to have possible drug relations and "discreet" sluts (the truth is, it's never discreet if anyone knows but the two involved). So why in the world worry about a drink on a dance floor? I mean really...that's really ridiculous...if image is so important that you couldn't get a pledge class if a sister held a drink while dancing or smoked without crossing her legs or something I suggest re-evaluating.

Don't bother acting all offended...sorry but I do and will think the logic here (or lack thereof) is baffling. No, on my campus I doubt open crackheads would work (personally I've never met one) and yes, every chapter has at least A hobag...and as it's college, so does every chapter everywhere.
I just thank the lord we're lookin' out for something besides nitpicky rules...respecting letters is one thing, this is another. Rules, written or not, about things deemed by the MAJORITY of society to be immoral are reasonable, as are rules regarding respect towards letters. I guess you have problems differentiating but I assure you, those sorts of rules and a list of rules regarding your every movement on campus (and of course image is everything...that's why it makes total sense that you would completely just go down the drain if you drink on the dance floor...but I mean drugs and sluts are cool...just not like, holding your cigarette in the wrong hand while you cross your legs the other way...) are different. The logic does not follow.

I guess we're just more about sisterhood here, so I don't understand chapters like that. I am grateful even more for the five here...no one has to change themselves as a person to fit in because "image is everything"...I think we're all more interested in fun, being ourselves, and companionship. The kind of greek system in which image (however contradictory the definition is) is more important than sisterhood is one I do not want to be associated with.

No, you're confused. It's image. I mean why join a sorority for friends and sisterhood? That's crap...it's ALL about how you hold your drink. Geez. Seriously you should get your priorities straight.

I thought it was all about what color your letter jerseys were.;)


Kidding.

Eh. Funny.

Respect is a big issue for me...which is why the colors are a big deal to me as well as promoting sisterhood over image. I get worked up. Some of these posts are straight out of Pledged.

That is just too funny. I wonder if Chi O disciplined their member as well, and if so, whether the fact that she lost to a GPhiB was considered. :eek::rolleyes::D

I certainly never said image is more important than sisterhood. That's ridiculous! I would, though, like to see this utopia you describe that is your campus where no one judges, no one gossips and everyone is happy being strippers if they want. I would love to believe it, only I know human nature, and I have a modicum of common sense. You can't get rid of any of this. The point of maintaining a good image is to not have a bad reputation eclipse your sisterhood. If you want to jump on me for that go ahead, but I have to tell you that picking words out of my posts and twisting them for your own bizarre needs does nothing but make you look silly. They certainly don't make me feel small or petty or less sisterly. I have much better self esteem than that! Not to mention I think this is a stupid argument...I don't think either of us really thinks the other is that far on the polar ends of this debate. I also will not debate that the rules I mentioned earlier are strange...but they are the rules of the group. No one has asked to have them change so I'm not sure what the big deal is!

I request that the OP (who is also a Mod and has the ability to do this) changes the title to reflect that we are not Sorority Girls, we are Sorority Women.:cool:

Hey, someone had to say something we can all agree on.:rolleyes:

Thanks for changing the tone of the room Alpha....I guess it's good to have some peacemakers in this world!:)

1. You might need to either read more slowly or review reading comprehension skills. I did not say a) that my campus is a utopia b) that no one judges c) that no one gossip d) anything whatsoever about strippers.
2. Your arguement was that it was vital that your girls not drink on the dance floor because that is bad image. And then you say that you have a slut in the sorority and a possible druggie. Now...you tell ME if that makes sense? Petty "ettiquette" over the big issues?
3. If you think things like smoking with uncrossed legs, eating while walking, or drinking on the dance floor will so damage your sisterhood that the entire campus will think you are bad girls...again, look at what you've already said. I can't fathom the incredibly stupid herd that would shun a chapter because a sister ate a hot dog while walking but would completely ignore a slut or a druggie. If that's where people's priorities are...I don't think you're getting your money's worth.
4. As I had said earlier, there are things that are deemed immoral by the majority of society including, for instance, sleeping around a lot, being a consistent sloppy drunk, doing drugs, or most importantly just being a mean person. Every organization must have rules to function. My point was that they are in my opinion extremely nit picky in your case and seem to TOTALLY miss the point if, as you say, it's ok to do nothing about sluts/druggies but not to hold a drink when not sitting.
5. I'm actually supremely unconcerened about how I look in this particular arguement. See number one before telling me I make myself look silly in an arguement. Revise. Then try to make me feel silly.

Did this make anyone else laugh? I mean, considering 98% of the time, I'm the instigator instead of the peacemaker.;) I'm just feeling weird today.

I am so proud to call you my sister.

You win at the internets for this.

GC: 1
AOII Angel: 0

You win a tank cat!

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y9/...ANKCatwhat.jpg

EDIT: What the hell is your problem? Do you have an owl stuck up there somewhere that makes you continue to pick on 33girl? Tell us, I'm truly agog.

Well Squirrel...I'm really touched by your concern for my reading comprehension, though, I'm sure after my 26 years of schooling that my education level is a bit higher than yours. If you'd actually look back at my posts you may see the error in your reading skills. Since you like numbers, I will number my examples.

1. I simply gave an example of general rules adopted by each group on my campus. I gave reasons why they may have been adopted...etiquette and all. I never said that a ban on eating while walking was a rule of any group on my campus....you are confused by later posts by other members. I also never said that doing any of the prohibited things makes you a bad person, gets you kicked out or any other retribution other than being politely reminded of the rules. I never said it was "vital" that no one drink on the dance floor. My only point was....rules are rules. Follow your chapter rules...if you don't like them, change them. Sisters who just choose to consistently break chapter rules willy nilly (whether these silly rules or bigger ones that I'm sure your chapter would recognize) are not good sisters any more than a "born again Christian who blows off all her duties and continually hurts other sisters by her lack of support." (As quoted from 33girl's post.)

2. I certainly did not generalize that every one of your school's sorority members where sluts or crackheads. I actually said that you may have openly risky behavior on your campus that is not frowned upon, but at many campuses, especially small ones, this type of activity will kill your chapter's reputation. Is that necessarily right? Maybe not, but people do judge and judge frequently!

3. I brought up that we had people in my chapter who slept around and experimented with drugs. It's a common occurence on most college campuses. My point was that my "nit picky" chapter didn't run around expelling or ostracizing members for making adult decisions that we didn't agree with. The common denominator was that despite the choices they made, they kept it their own private business. I knew about some of these things only because I was close friends with some of these girls, not because it was common knowledge. Sure secrets are only secrets when kept to yourself, but sisterhood means you can occasionally share your bad decisions with someone else. As for the broken jaw...we had no proof that it had to do with drugs....it was a rumor. She wasn't expelled because if she was doing drugs, she didn't flaunt it. For all I know the broken jaw was a tragic accident. Sisters close to her had a conversation with her about the rumors. No other incidents occured in the future involving this sister.

4. Image is important. Image is not more important than sisterhood. But, it is completely ridiculous to say that your school's chapters don't worry about image. You worry about image when you dress up for badge day, when you prepare for rush, etc. It doesn't have to be an evil word. At no point did I say that any chapter at my former school cared about image over the sisterhood in the chapter. My point is valid....bad image and reputation is generally the reason behind most chapter closures. I personally get sad to hear about any chapter closing...what a horrible experience for those sisters. Usually, though, their image was made for them by someone who was long gone by the time the chapter reaped the consequences of their sister's actions.

5. Generalizing makes you sound silly. That was my point. Jumping to conclusions about an entire campus because of a set of rules with which you don't agree is a disservice to other greek women. And by the way, you do make it sound like your campus is above the usual foibles of human nature. I don't buy it!

6. I don't disagree with all of your statements. "I'd like to think that people take their vows to remain sisters as seriously as their vows to behave themselves. For instance, if a girl is repeatedly getting drunk at frat houses and doing things she shouldn't, is it ok to just kick her out, no questions asked? In my opinion, no. It's everyone else's duty as sisters to attempt to help her; volunteer to go with her to AA meetings, volunteer to be a go between with parents if they are difficult, volunteer to keep an eye on her at parties, that sort of thing. If she is given a second chance and refuses ALL help from EVERYONE who offers it, then I think her membership should be called into question. I take sisterhood very seriously...on the other hand I'm also aware that as college students we all have very limited resources when attempting to help others." (quoted from your post.) I completely agree with this statement.

Ahhhh Pittsburgh. That might account for the affected syntax with which she posts. It is offensive to real Southerners and well, just 'icky'. ;) No one I know speaks that way unless they are auditioning for an antebellum role in a movie.

And as for St. Cecilia's....yes, my mother was rather ridiculous in her ideas of proper behavior, but she was also St. Cecilia's 1952. She stuck to her guns, but Lord have mercy, she was from another era. :rolleyes:

Thanks for the clarification. It helps me to understand a great deal more. It is still horrifically affected, but, I imagine, in imitation of her mother and not in mockery of the South. ;)

Tacky is as tacky does. And posing is always tackier than exposing said poseur. Call me tacky but I am not pretending to Southern aristocracy. I am the real thing, sugar. ;)

Glad to know honeychile is innocent in her affectedness.:)

Some people just don't get it.

Some things speak for themselves . . .
 

To quote Miss Manners (Judith Martin) -

Miss Manners is constantly besieged by people who want to know the tactful manner of pointing out their friends' and relatives' inferiorities. . . The answer is that they cannot, certainly not politely. . . Even if it be proven that the mistakes of others come from gross ignorance or from maliciousness, it is not the place of anyone except God, their mothers or Miss Manners to bring this to their attention. As dear Erasmus said, "It is part of the highest civility if, while never erring yourself, you ignore the errors of others."

ETA - unless, of course, you are on standards . . . (!!)