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-   -   Univ.of Illinois Recruitment FALL 2012 (https://greekchat.com/gcforums/showthread.php?t=129192)

IL Anchor Girl 09-09-2012 08:22 PM
Wow, I step away for a few hours for a family event, and I apparently missed a whole lot. :rolleyes:

Anyway, glad to see this thread is still open, and super happy to read all the happy updates for daughters, sisters, and rec girls! Wishing everyone the best for Bid Day and a lifetime of great friendships and traditions!

I, too, had to smile at the idea of moms at Bid Day - just doesn't happen. My mom was an ADPi at a southern school, and made sure I had all kinds of recs (also a little unusual at the time I rushed in the early 80s). Given the opportunity, she probably would've shown up for Bid Day! :)

And to the mom from out of state who was worried about everyone being from Illinois: we used to joke that as far as geographic diversity at Illinois went, students came from 2 places: "Chicago" and "downstate". But in the Greek system it was "Chicago SUBURBS" and "downstate". I was one of only 3 girls in my pledge class from the actual city of Chicago. But- it didn't matter at all! Once we were a pledge class, we bonded. If anything, girls from outside Illinois were like a prize because they were such an exotic rarity! :D

HQWest 09-09-2012 10:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby (Post 2176908)
I know of so few PNM's who get dropped from every chapter (and the statistics bear it out) at Illinois. My first thought was that this was an effect of having so many chapters, i.e. it's unlikely for a PNM to click with NOONE, but then other schools with a lot of chapters (Auburn, for example) seem to have a much larger number of women who are not invited to prefs.

Any thoughts on why this is? If I had to wager a guess, a lot of women at Illinois know nothing about the chapters when they get there (though maybe this has changed due to the internet?), and I bet there are very few who fall into the trap of going back to the SRCs for first invitational and having nothing later on, when they would have had a bid if they had considered other chapters.
No way at all to test it - but the theory with Auburn (17 chapters) for example - is that women tend to have in mind or know more about 6-8 chapters (or have friends from 6 chapters) when they start recruitment. So they rank their top 12 after first round and everything is fine, but in between ranking their top 7 for skit and receiving 3 invitiations for prefs there is a mismatch between these 6 chapters they know about ahead of time and with which sororities are interested in them, because of cuts required by RFM.

The solution that several people have recommended is to think about it like college applications and to be sure to keep in your top 7 a mix of chapters.

lovespink88 09-09-2012 10:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IL Anchor Girl (Post 2176927)
And to the mom from out of state who was worried about everyone being from Illinois: we used to joke that as far as geographic diversity at Illinois went, students came from 2 places: "Chicago" and "downstate". But in the Greek system it was "Chicago SUBURBS" and "downstate". I was one of only 3 girls in my pledge class from the actual city of Chicago. But- it didn't matter at all! Once we were a pledge class, we bonded. If anything, girls from outside Illinois were like a prize because they were such an exotic rarity! :D
WOO! High five for an actual-city-of-Chicagoan!

Always loved that conversation with new people I met:

Stranger: "Where are you from?"

Me: "Chicago".

Stranger: "Oh, what suburb?"

Me: *Sigh*

pearlalum 09-09-2012 10:53 PM
Just heard from my daughter's best friend who finished her prefs at Illinois today. She has had a very positive experience like my daughter did. She went into prefs with her 3 top choices, pretty sure about which one was her favorite, and came out of it ranking another one in the #1 spot! Can't wait for tomorrow to see where she ends up. I am so excited for her!

Hartofsec 09-09-2012 11:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby (Post 2176908)
I know of so few PNM's who get dropped from every chapter (and the statistics bear it out) at Illinois. My first thought was that this was an effect of having so many chapters, i.e. it's unlikely for a PNM to click with NOONE, but then other schools with a lot of chapters (Auburn, for example) seem to have a much larger number of women who are not invited to prefs.

Any thoughts on why this is? If I had to wager a guess, a lot of women at Illinois know nothing about the chapters when they get there (though maybe this has changed due to the internet?), and I bet there are very few who fall into the trap of going back to the SRCs for first invitational and having nothing later on, when they would have had a bid if they had considered other chapters.
The number of chapters and size of pledge classes seem just right at Illinois – I’m not sure how many more colonizations it would take to begin to reduce the size of the pledge classes at Bama, for instance. The numbers of PNMs seem to continue to climb – I’m not sure where these will eventually stabilize.

I was thinking about your question, and though I couldn’t find comparable data from Auburn, I looked at comparable data from U of Alabama instead (which also has a comparable number of chapters). I was actually surprised at the numbers – not what I expected to find given UofA’s recruitment reputation.

Comparing U of Illinois and U of Alabama – 2010 stats for both (most recent figures posted for IL, and free of 2011 colonization variable for U of A) – beginning with attendance number at Open House -- some figures of interest in bold:

U of IL stats: http://www.odos.uiuc.edu/greek/membership/panhellenicStats.asp
U of AL stats (click to enlarge): http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/121342940.png

U of IL:
Attending Open House: 1258
Total Withdrawals up to and following pref: 325 (approx. 26% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)
Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 2
% placed in chapter: 72.2%
Not receiving bids: 23 (approx 2.5% of those signing pref cards)
Received 1st choice: 721 (approx 79.5% of those signing pref cards)
Received 2nd choice: 138 (approx 15.2% of those signing pref cards)
Received 3rd choice: 33 (approx 3.7% of those signing pref cards)

Uof A:
Attending Open House: 1604
Total withdrawals up to and following pref: 154 (approx. 10% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)
Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 16
% placed in chapter: 88%
Not receiving bids: 31 (approx 2.5% of those signing pref cards)
Received 1st choice: 1226 (approx 87% of those signing pref cards)
Received 2nd choice: 150 (approx 11% of those signing pref cards)
Received 3rd choice: 28 (approx 2% of those signing pref cards)

The UofA numbers were a lot more favorable than I expected – compare the withdrawals during the recruitment process, as well as the percentage placed in chapters. Thoughts? Maybe SEC recruitment is not as scary as its reputation often depicts!

But we still have more mamas and daddies underfoot on Bid Day. :p

ETA:
Auburn: available stats from years 2008-2011 combined, along with comments that accompany stats:
https://fp.auburn.edu/greek/Files/2012cweforweb.pdf

Withdrew from recruitment: 9.74% (most over not receiving a desired invitation)
Released during week (in process): 3.13%
Released Bid Day: 2.2% (all neglected to maximize pref options)
Placed in chapters: 84.94%

DeltaBetaBaby 09-10-2012 12:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2176973)
The number of chapters and size of pledge classes seem just right at Illinois – I’m not sure how many more colonizations it would take to begin to reduce the size of the pledge classes at Bama, for instance. The numbers of PNMs seem to continue to climb – I’m not sure where these will eventually stabilize.

I was thinking about your question, and though I couldn’t find comparable data from Auburn, I looked at comparable data from U of Alabama instead (which also has a comparable number of chapters). I was actually surprised at the numbers – not what I expected to find given UofA’s recruitment reputation.

Comparing U of Illinois and U of Alabama – 2010 stats for both (most recent figures posted for IL, and free of 2011 colonization variable for U of A) – beginning with attendance number at Open House:

U of IL stats: http://www.odos.uiuc.edu/greek/membership/panhellenicStats.asp
U of AL stats (click to enlarge): http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/121342940.png

U of IL:
Attending Open House: 1258
Total Withdrawals up to and following pref: 325 (approx. 26% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)
Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 2
% placed in chapter: 72.2%
Not receiving bids: 23
Received 1st choice: 721
Received 2nd choice: 138
Received 3rd choice: 33

Uof A:
Attending Open House: 1604
Total withdrawals up to and following pref: 154 (approx. 10% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)
Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 16
% placed in chapter: 88%
Not receiving bids: 31
Received 1st choice: 1276
Received 2nd choice: 150
Received 3rd choice: 28

The UofA numbers were a lot more favorable than I expected – compare the withdrawals during the recruitment process, as well as the percentage placed in chapters. Thoughts? Maybe SEC recruitment is not as scary as its reputation often depicts!

But we still have more mamas and daddies underfoot on Bid Day. :p
Thanks. This is a good comparison. I've always thought it was really rare for anyone to be TOTALLY released from recruitment, but we seem to get so many stories around here that go that way.

908sfirst 09-10-2012 12:21 AM
And runtime, I apologize for offending you; I really didn't mean it to be as disrespectful as you obviously took it. Good luck to your daughter tomorrow.

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 12:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 908sfirst (Post 2176994)

So...the sorority thing..

SHE GOT HER 3 TOP HOUSES TO VISIT TODAY!!!! YAYAYAYAY!!!! All of them were her favorites after visiting, and she had such a hard time deciding. A lot of rush infractions were probably happening, as my son was getting text messages from people he knew in the houses updating him on how much they want my daughter. hahaha. Anyway, she is very excited about her number 1 choice, but would be happy with any of them. Yay! I can't wait to hear tomorrow.
Hooray!!! What an exciting day tomorrow will be!

Best wishes to all for a happy, happy Bid Day!

Runtime 09-10-2012 12:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 908sfirst (Post 2176995)
And runtime, I apologize for offending you; I really didn't mean it to be as disrespectful as you obviously took it. Good luck to your daughter tomorrow.
No problem...and I am glad your daughter also got invited back to her top 3. I know how excited my daughter was, so I know it was a good day for your daughter and your family. Good luck to your daughter as well, and check back in after she gets her bid...which I am sure she will.

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 12:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby (Post 2176992)
Thanks. This is a good comparison. I've always thought it was really rare for anyone to be TOTALLY released from recruitment, but we seem to get so many stories around here that go that way.
I just corrected one figure on UofA's "matched to first choice," and added some percentages for both to compare. It does appear rare that girls are released from all chapters (and it does not appear that girls at UofA are withdrawing from recruitment in unusually high numbers -- according to the comparison here, in fewer numbers actually).

I would be surprised if the numbers at Auburn were that different from UofA (just from a regional POV I guess), but so far I'm pretty surprised by the numbers period.

Does anyone have comparable numbers from Auburn (or other SEC school)? I'm curious now.

HQWest 09-10-2012 08:56 AM
I dont have five years of numbers but from the powerpoint shiwn to parents at Camp War Eagle that is online, the AU numbers are comparable to Bama. Less than 2 percent are released from recruitment. The number of withdrawals after round one is higher at Auburn - I have been told this is because of girls tht sign up so they can move in early or who are overwhelmed by the crowds.

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 11:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HQWest (Post 2177033)
I dont have five years of numbers but from the powerpoint shiwn to parents at Camp War Eagle that is online, the AU numbers are comparable to Bama. Less than 2 percent are released from recruitment. The number of withdrawals after round one is higher at Auburn - I have been told this is because of girls tht sign up so they can move in early or who are overwhelmed by the crowds.
You’re right – looked up some Auburn numbers from a presentation (probably the powerpoint you are referring to):
https://fp.auburn.edu/greek/Files/2012cweforweb.pdf

Auburn stats from years 2008-2011 combined, along with comments that accompany stats:

Withdrew from recruitment: 9.74% (most over not receiving a desired invitation)
Released during week (in process): 3.13%
Released Bid Day: 2.2% (all neglected to maximize pref options)
Placed in chapters: 84.94%

I tried to find some numbers for a variety of other schools reputed to have very competitive recruitments (UGA, USC, and SMU), but was not able to find comparable numbers.

DeltaBetaBaby 09-10-2012 11:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2177082)
You’re right – looked up some Auburn numbers from a presentation (probably the powerpoint you are referring to):
https://fp.auburn.edu/greek/Files/2012cweforweb.pdf

Auburn stats from years 2008-2011 combined, along with comments that accompany stats:

Withdrew from recruitment: 9.74% (most over not receiving a desired invitation)
Released during week (in process): 3.13%
Released Bid Day: 2.2% (all neglected to maximize pref options)
Placed in chapters: 84.94%

I tried to find some numbers for a variety of other schools reputed to have very competitive recruitments (UGA, USC, and SMU), but was not able to find comparable numbers.
Okay, but while the numbers of totally released women are small, they are still much higher at Auburn and Bama than at Illinois. 3% of 1000+ women is 30+ women, which is 15 times higher. Of course, I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on one year of statistics, though.

DG Illinois 09-10-2012 12:04 PM
Yeah!!!!!!!!! It's finally bid day! There is a video of bid day on the Quad where the Rho Chis reveal their house and then the pnms open their bids. It's super cute. I will see if I can figure out how to link it here. So happy for everyone!

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 12:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby (Post 2177085)
Okay, but while the numbers of totally released women are small, they are still much higher at Auburn and Bama than at Illinois. 3% of 1000+ women is 30+ women, which is 15 times higher. Of course, I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on one year of statistics, though.
Yes, part of the problem with comparing numbers may be how the numbers are reported. The Auburn numbers appear to be a 4-year average, while IL and AL are same-year comparisons.

Is it possible that the number of girls who withdraw (proportionately) could affect the release numbers over the week? Thoughts?

Illinois (2010): approx 26% of PNMs withdrew during process
Alabama (2010): approx 10% withdrew during process
Auburn (average years 2008-11): 9.74% withdrew during process

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 12:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DG Illinois (Post 2177089)
Yeah!!!!!!!!! It's finally bid day! There is a video of bid day on the Quad where the Rho Chis reveal their house and then the pnms open their bids. It's super cute. I will see if I can figure out how to link it here. So happy for everyone!
Yes! Please do!

WCsweet<3 09-10-2012 01:02 PM
I believe they get bids at 5 pm today. Sending good thoughts to the PNMs and moms!

HQWest 09-10-2012 02:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2177092)
Yes, part of the problem with comparing numbers may be how the numbers are reported. The Auburn numbers appear to be a 4-year average, while IL and AL are same-year comparisons.

Is it possible that the number of girls who withdraw (proportionately) could affect the release numbers over the week? Thoughts?

Illinois (2010): approx 26% of PNMs withdrew during process
Alabama (2010): approx 10% withdrew during process
Auburn (average years 2008-11): 9.74% withdrew during process
Its hard to say because the Alabama numbers have the Alpha Phi and DG expansions to take into account which might also increase withdrawals.

I can say the Auburn number is a little off year to year because they were showing that most of the women who withdraw after first round were withdrawing before day 1 was over in 2011 or before they saw their invitations for round two. That might be attributed to the horrible heat wave last year.

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HQWest (Post 2177132)
Its hard to say because the Alabama numbers have the Alpha Phi and DG expansions to take into account which might also increase withdrawals.
The numbers I used for AL (and IL) were for 2010, which was not a year affected by an AL expansion. But you are correct -- the numbers during years of expansion (2008 and 2011) were considerably affected – big increases in girls withdrawing after receiving pref invites, and also in the “not receiving bids” column. Many girls probably withdrew upon receiving pref invites -- and others purposely did not maximize pref options -- knowing that a colonizing option was available following formal recruitment (the vast majority of the colonizing chapters’ new members were girls who participated in formal recruitment).

UofA stats by year (click on document to enlarge): http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/121342940.png


Quote:
Originally Posted by HQWest (Post 2177132)
I can say the Auburn number is a little off year to year because they were showing that most of the women who withdraw after first round were withdrawing before day 1 was over in 2011 or before they saw their invitations for round two. That might be attributed to the horrible heat wave last year.
Good point – the Illinois and Alabama numbers were specifically 2010, and only those who withdrew during the process (after open house). Seriously – the prospect of standing in the heat for a week could cause some girls to change their minds after signing up or before ever receiving any invitations!

But I what I was actually wondering about is ... if the withdrawal numbers at Illinois were smaller (this number is huge compared to AL and Auburn), would this potentially affect (raise) somewhat the number of girls released through the process?

HQWest 09-10-2012 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2177185)
But I what I was actually wondering about is ... if the withdrawal numbers at Illinois were smaller (this number is huge compared to AL and Auburn), would this potentially affect (raise) somewhat the number of girls released through the process?
The number would increase a little bit, but I do not think that much (not 15%!), because the RFM would account for it and corresponding numbers of invitiations allowed out would increase.

UofISigKap 09-10-2012 05:52 PM
If they are hanging out on the quad, it may be a good time to check the Quad Cam! http://illinois.edu/about/tours/quadCam.html

Hartofsec 09-10-2012 06:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HQWest (Post 2177188)
The number would increase a little bit, but I do not think that much (not 15%!), because the RFM would account for it and corresponding numbers of invitiations allowed out would increase.

I’m not sure what you mean by 15% -- I’m probably not explaining myself very well.

Using the 2010 numbers from IL and AL, since these are comparable, it seems that the percentages of girls released from recruitment are so small that it might be easier to look at raw numbers:

IL: Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 2 of 1258
AL: Released by all chapters (through pref invites): 16 of 1604

But that there is huge disparity between withdrawal numbers and percentages:

IL: Total Withdrawals up to and following pref: 325 of 1258 (approx. 26% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)
AL: Total withdrawals up to and following pref: 154 of 1604 (approx. 10% of PNMs withdrew during recruitment process)

I kinda see what you are saying about RFM compensating over the course of the week – but wondered if more girls had continued in recruitment at IL, if some of these may have been subject to release by all chapters at some point.

Why are the withdrawal numbers at IL so high? Any thoughts?

lovespink88 09-10-2012 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2177201)
Why are the withdrawal numbers at IL so high? Any thoughts?
Based on what I've read here, my guess is that at Alabama, there's more of a "I'd rather go Greek than not" mentality for PNMs, so when they get chapters that they are not happy with, they're more willing to stick it out. I don't think you can say the same thing about Illinois.

Just my guess.

irishpipes 09-10-2012 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2177201)
Why are the withdrawal numbers at IL so high? Any thoughts?
As a former chapter member at U of I, my guess is that it is because sophomores have great success in recruitment. Freshman year is not your best and only chance of placement.

Larkspur12 09-10-2012 07:19 PM
Just posted in the other thread, too, but...my sister is a SIGMA KAPPA! :)

Hope everyone has a lot of fun tonight!

DeltaBetaBaby 09-10-2012 07:23 PM
Other factors at Illinois:

The decision to rush is not necessarily a careful one. A lot of women just sign up the night of orientation, recs aren't needed, it costs like $40...plenty of people do it on a whim and then decide it isn't for them.

Rush happens during the school year, not in a bubble before school starts. Given the time to visit 18-20 chapters (the number has fluctuated only slightly in the last 15 years), you are missing out on a lot of other stuff during that timeframe.

When I was there, the rho chi selection process totally sucked. I don't know if that's still the case, but many of the stories I hear about awesome rho chis are very counter to my experience.

SigKapSweetie 09-10-2012 07:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larkspur12 (Post 2177220)
Just posted in the other thread, too, but...my sister is a SIGMA KAPPA! :)

Hope everyone has a lot of fun tonight!
Yay! Dove love to your sister! Any chance you could convince her to stop by and write a recruitment story? :D

908sfirst 09-10-2012 07:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovespink88 (Post 2177204)
Based on what I've read here, my guess is that at Alabama, there's more of a "I'd rather go Greek than not" mentality for PNMs, so when they get chapters that they are not happy with, they're more willing to stick it out. I don't think you can say the same thing about Illinois.

Just my guess.
Agreed!

AngelMom76 09-10-2012 09:46 PM
Posted on the other thread too….there is a new PI PHI Angel in our family!!!!! soooo thrilled!!!

614 09-10-2012 10:22 PM
I have a pi phi too and she is really happy!! Her sister was a pi phi too (another school) and they are both happy to have the added sisterly bond!!

pearlalum 09-10-2012 11:21 PM
My daughter's best friend and another good friend are new Alpha Phis!!! They are so excited to be pledge sisters together.

AZTheta 09-10-2012 11:39 PM
Heard from an AZ Theta who transferred to Illinois (why? I have no idea. It's COLD there) that there are 45 new members (see? I didn't say anything about kittens. Are you not impressed? But oh Lord I wanted to say PLEDGES. I did. I do). No idea what quota was - does someone have that info? I didn't see it elsewhere but haven't checked IrishPipes' thread yet.

congratulations to all the new Sigma Kappas, PiPhis, Kappas, Alpha Phis, etc. etc. etc.

aesovs 09-10-2012 11:52 PM
Gamma Phi got 48 new members, so I'm guessing quota was probably around 40 or 45!

lovespink88 09-11-2012 12:37 AM
I counted 46 Alpha Chis, 49 Alpha Phis and 52 Alpha Xis in the bid day pics I posted. If those Theta and Gamma Phi numbers are right, my money is on 45 for quota.

DeltaBetaBaby 09-11-2012 07:41 AM
Quota has held steady at 45-50 for a very long time now.

arrowlady 09-11-2012 08:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelMom76 (Post 2177285)
Posted on the other thread too….there is a new PI PHI Angel in our family!!!!! soooo thrilled!!!
Congrats how exciting!

AOIIBuckeye 09-11-2012 11:10 AM
Per facebook, 52 new AOII's

DG Illinois 09-11-2012 11:58 AM
Yeah!!!!!! So happy for all our amazing pnms! Sorry for the late post, my daughter came home sick from school yesterday and wanted to just sleep on me all day. She's still home, but feeling much better so she's back to being a preteen now.

My pnms are so happy!
We have a Theta, a KD and a AOPi and they are all so thrilled!
Recruitment always seems so rough but thankfully there are a lot of smiles at the end!

lovespink88 09-11-2012 12:32 PM
Yay for your PNMs!!

lovespink88 09-11-2012 01:00 PM
Totally copying Jill's who's rushing thread (because it's awesome!) Here's an Illinois recap:

AXOcourtney’s cousin went ALPHA XI DELTA!
AngelMom76’s daughter went PI BETA PHI!
614’s daughter went PI BETA PHI!
908sfirst’s daughter went KAPPA KAPPA GAMMA!
DG Illinois’s rec crew went KAPPA ALPHA THETA, KAPPA DELTA, and ALPHA OMICRON PI!
Larkspur12’s sister went SIGMA KAPPA!
Pearlalum’s daughter’s friends BOTH went ALPHA PHI!
Pawn’s daughter went SIGMA DELTA TAU!
Runtime's daughter went GAMMA PHI BETA!

Only one we haven't heard from runtime. I know there was some back and forth over user names, but I know that some GCers would love to hear an updates, if she so chooses. :)

ETA: I think it's pretty cool that we've covered half the chapters with these PNMs!


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