Well no shit Sherlock. If you have a bunch of idiots killing only Bucks...of course you are going to screw things up. This type of hunting is completely irresponsible and shouldn't be condoned at all. You also posted something from Pennsylvania. I am talking about Texas and the South. I don't know anything about seasons, game management, or regulations in Pennyslvania...judging from the quote.....all of it is pretty crappy. Again, this does nothing for your argument. When you are responsible, hunt within regulations, and do what you are told to do by a wildlife biologists, advisors, and game wardens then things like the above won't happen. What you posted is a direct result of complete carelessness and lack of concern for the deer.



Why did you post this? Again this doesn't support your original thoughts at all.....all it is saying is that the quality and size of a buck is gong to be better if it matures past a yearling and two year old and into the 3 and 4 year old range. The article is also giving statistics for hunting in 1989....nowhere near anything relavent considering how quickly things can change concerning deer in 15+ years. Realistically, nothing is wrong here....all the state would of had to do is created game reserves that are off limits to hunting to help the maturing process.

I made this thread, if it concerns hunting I really don't care what gets posted. Not sure why you posted any of the rest of that.

Yeah man, I understood exactly what you were saying. You claimed that hunting wasn't needed because nature would be sufficient enough to maintain populations and keep things under control. I refuted you and gave examples (situations, places, etc.) on why this assertion won't hold up in many areas. Your respones weren't well though out at all.....if they were you probobly wouldn't have posted them in the first place. But then again, you actually have zero knowledge of anything that concerns this discussion outside of searching the internet for evidence.......so I don't blame you for trying.

-Rudey

Hey I hear there are lots of Doves overpopulating the world. Please help restore the balance Cleetus. Do the doves a favor and make sure they don't get genetic mutations from overpopulation.

-Rudey

What kind of idiot would fence in 20,000 acres with deer on it? Of course fencing in the deer and fencing out the natural predators will result in too many deer -- and that is a human-created problem. Saying that humans screwed up the system (by removing predators and by installing fences) and then need to fix the problem (too many deer) is ridiculous. Take away the fence and bring back the natural predators.

^^^hahaha, you're gonna sit here and tell me that I insult you to cover up my inadequacies and then you post this....you are an unbelieveable douchebag.

I didn't insult you in my last post at all. You posted a bunch of garbage and I responded and commented on it.

Sorry that you were completely outclassed in your moronic/idiotic attempts to refute my posts and provide some sort of rational argument against hunting. You have absolutely zero knowledge on anything discussed in this thread....and I called you on it.

ummmmmmm.....are you kidding me?

When did I ever say that we kept the deer in and moved all of the natural predators out. Please tell me you actually don't think this is what happens when you have a hunting ranch or any type of large land ownership. I'd like to see you try to remove all of the countless numbers of bobcats, moutain lions, coyotes, etc. etc. etc. No, this doesn't happen and I have never seen or even heard of that.

This isn't the mid 1800's. Ranches are going to be fenced in.....especially when you have cattle on your land...like we do. Fencing separates property to property and keeps out people you don't want.

If you have a cattle ranch, why would you fence in deer? Wouldn't you only fence in the cattle?

Uh, I think we can solve this entire shit show with three simple facts that are indisputable:

-In many areas, modern hunting regulations help to control animal populations

-The reasons why animal populations would grow out of control without hunting are entirely related to human actions (usually altering environments/killing predator populations)

-We can prove #2 by noting that herd populations were controlled via natural balance and carrying capacity prior to human overpopulation and continued industrialization (and it's also worth noting that deer overpopulation generally leads to . . . dying deer, or equilibrium)

See? See. Easy as apple pie and nailing fat drunk girls, and everyone's right!

Its not a cattle ranch....its a hunting ranch with cattle on it.....about 300-400 head.

We don't fence in deer. There is a difference between regular fencing and putting in high fences.....which are used to keep deer in.

See, I thought you were saying that some jackass fences in a bunch of deer and then says it's necessary to hunt them. Now you're talking about your ranch where the deer are not contained by a fence. Are you saying that hunting is necessary on your land and, if so, why?

I'm confused. First you said this '

and then you said that the fences don't keep deer in because: Which is it?

I made some changes.

Yeah, thats what I figured you were thinking, no big deal. Technically, the deer are not restrained by fences.....they can jump pretty damn high. However, the ranch is big enough to where you aren't going to really have any considerable fluctuations in numbers because of them moving in and out of different properties (are ranch is in between 4 other ranches.)

We hunt for many different reasons....food, enjoyment, sport, entertain clients....all sorts of things. We do though work extensively with wildlife biologists concerning all of the different game on our property (namely deer, turkey, quail, hogs, and dove. Some ducks, but not alot by any means.) We aren't going to go shoot a bunch of things simply becasue they are there. Reckless hunting will really screw things up. Considering how we can positively influence the wildlife by hunting....I would say that it is necessary.

I didn't explain myself too well in that first one. I was just using that as an example. Some people do have high fences to contain deer. Most often these ranches breed deer themselves to produce trophy bucks and whatnot.

Our ranch is just fenced in. No high fences.

Can you provide some info on where your assertion that hunting to maintain wildlife populations is limited and , I guess, small scale? I'm not trying to start anymore shit with you.....I'd be interested in seeing some statistics.

I still don't get what you have against hunting. I understand your points you made...but now your talking about justification and "actions" or hunters and hunting.

Do you not eat meat? ARe you a member of PETA or something?

I'd just like to know what you have against it and why you obviously think hunting is wrong.

Growing up in a family full of hunters I was always the odd ball. I never got why my grandfather would feed the deer all year long and then go out and shoot them:confused: . Most of the people I know hunt and i just don't go there with them anymore(meaning the subject of hunting). Unfortunately, I probably kill more deer every year than most of them. I don't have a choice though, they come in with broken legs, head trauma, etc...all courtesy of us lovely human beings and our cars. Just please don't hurt the opossums :D .