I'm not familiar with the honorgal username but I don't think the person is trolling. This is one of many complex issues that spark discussion, debate, and emotions on both sides.

It goes back to what some of us said in the beginning of this thread: the investigation should be handled correctly by the school and law enforcement for the alleged victim and the alleged perpetrator. It is all alleged until proven otherwise. Alleged physical acts against women and children are the few times people say "you're guilty because I said so 2 seconds ago" and I'm not okay with that. That is partly rooted in protecting victims and mostly rooted in societal views towards women and children. But when it comes to women who, unlike children, are legal adults, it is not unreasonable to process these alleged incidents without instantly demonizing the alleged victim or alleged perpetrator. Automatically believing a woman who claims sexual assault or rape is the opposite extreme of automatically discrediting her. Both sides are arguably rooted in aspects of gender inequality, patriarchy, and sexism. There is a more reasonable and realistic middle ground that neither equates (girlhood or) womanhood with victim nor liar.

Hey Dr. Phil. Definitely not a troll. I just have never posted much, but yes, this is an issue that hits some hot buttons for me. And I agree with much of what you are saying, but I will stand by my earlier statement that we don't know exactly how this was handled (or mishandled). This is especially true of the University, as they are bound by strict confidentiality laws. But I do know a hatchet job when I see one (the NYT article in particular and the media in general, in this case) and that's another hot button with me. I don't like the use of scapegoats.

You are asking for investigations to be handled correctly, and that there is a middle ground. I'm sure there is room for improvement, but my sense is that in the vast majority of these types of cases, no system will work. Which is why it burns me up that the campus activists and the media are almost exclusively focused on the process after the the fact. Because anything else is just victim blaming. (You know, like telling young co-eds that maybe they should think twice about getting blotto and climbing into bed naked with some guy they barely know). At the end of "the process" the girl is still violated, even if the University does everything by the book and with compassion to boot. Time to use some common sense. What you call gender inequality, I call gender differences. It's also known as biology.

I stand corrected-I should have said that I don't want to share my own opinion at this time, as it may appear biased.

And again I ask, have you read the case records?

Troll=/= Honorgal. Honorgal has been a GC member for a while.

No.

1. Gender differences are exaggerated.
2. Biological sex is biology. Gender is not.
3. There is nothing biological or innate about anything in your post.

The irony and hypocrisy of this faux rape crisis are entirely lost on you, I see. It would almost be funny if it didn't involve the actual well being of real young people.

In my observation, most people don't ever take the time to bother with the facts.

People need to stop randomly throwing "irony" and "hypocrisy" in sentences and pretending they are making a well-articulated point. Either explain what you are talking about or move on.

You think this boils down to gender differences and biology. I consider that a ridiculous unfounded assertion. Other than that, you did not disagree with anything I typed in this thread. Now what?

Like this is a well-articulated point?

Bottom line - those who are claiming that we have a crisis and that 20% or 25% of our female college students are being raped are playing political games.

Okay, if you have the time and energy to discuss this with someone who thinks campus rape statistics are some kind of conspiracy that goes all the way to the president, be my guest.

I've already answered this question, and if you weren't here to defend FSU, you wouldn't have posted the links you did.

Yes, this is not about gender differences and there is nothing biological about this.


What do you not understand about gender differences being exaggerated, biological sex is biological whereas gender is not biological, and there is nothing biological or innate about anything in your post (or this thread)?

What does this have to do with my posts? Do you actually understand my posts?

Misinformed on some key points? Yes. Troll? Probably not.

Get back to me when 20% of college males start complaining they are victims of rape.

How does that make this about gender differences and biology? Do you know what gender differences and biology mean?

DeltaBetaBaby [QUOTE}I've already answered this question, and if you weren't here to defend FSU, you wouldn't have posted the links you did.[/QUOTE]



Posting the case report is unbiased, factual information sharing. It is part of the information that was used to determine whether or not there was enough evidence for a criminal case. The State Attorney deemed there was not enough evidence.

I do not know enough about Title IX procedure to comment on whether or not FSU followed Title IX protocol or not. I had hoped to learn what other people around the country thought and on what their opinions were based. Accusing me of posting links in order to defend FSU is as accurate as if I had accused you of defending the accuser by posting articles from Jezebel and the NYT. I posted the analysis of the case report from Tomahawk Nation because it gave a brief synopsis of the over 240 pages of transcript, which I was afraid some people wouldn't take/have the time to read. I posted it with the caveat that it was biased.

Journalism (I do not equate Tomahawk Nation or Jezebel with journalism) has become less fact reporting without opinion, and more opinion sharing with facts used to support that opinion. I think that most of us can read the facts and form our own opinions. It's too bad the media doesn't seem to think so.

Of course I do.

Men and women are having lots of boozy sex with each other on college campuses. This should be a good thing in the eyes of the campus feminists. And the men certainly aren't complaining. But some of the women are. Not only are they complaining, they are insisting that men have to change, become more chivalrous, treat women with the respect they deserve. It's almost comical. Almost. But keep telling us that we're pretty much the same.

Even if you were a Title IX coordinator yourself you couldn't know if FSU followed procedures or not, in any specific case. It's a secretive and confidential process. FSU can't tell us what they did or didn't do. How convenient for those claiming they didn't follow procedures.