:rolleyes:.

It's really not a Greek specific question. The same thing could be happening with a sports team or in the dorm and the same answer would still apply: Butt out.

She didn't butt in...she just came to a Greek specific board to inquire about procedure/policy. She was not asking us what to do or how to do it. She was not insisting that someone fix it. She was, essentially, venting...no harm.

I didn't see heli-mom behavior. I saw "inquiring minds want to know" behavior.

I call this butting in.

Butting in would be calling the chapter and demanding answers from the chapter president. Or adviser. Or HQ.

And creating a thread on GC about your daughter.

Butting in doesn't have to go so far as "helicoptering." Are people really pretending that they've never heard someone being told to "butt out" when they act a little too concerned or act too impacted by something? Sons and daughters tell their parents to butt out all the time when they get tired of the concern and the advice. That obviously hasn't happened in this instance but that's why there's now a thread and some of us are responding as we are.

Butting in would be asking your daughter to tell you all the 'scoop' on new member period activities, probing for detailed info on the meetings and what drama goes on during them, calling up chapter advisors and complaining or demanding action, giving unasked for advice on daughter's activities or concerns about new member period.

You all have your lists of butting ins and we have ours.

I totally agree with you on the concept of someone needing to "butt out." I just don't think this mom really butted in. I actually thought she was coming on here so she could avoid butting in because by asking for info in this format, she could find out what she needed to know without going to a chapter advisor, etc for answers.

I am, now, butting out of this thread.;):)

So, she wanted to go beyond what her daughter has shared with her and go above her daughter to find out some info (or vent). LOL. I call that butting in.

Someone say "butt" again.

butt butt butt.:p

I'm on the side of the mother asking the question anonymously because she's wondering what is SOP instead of asking/telling the daughter too much.

The answer here could just as easily have been your daughter needs to be fighting for her rights! or something else completely contrary to the responses given. How's she supposed to know? In the land of compromise, asking strangers a simple enough question is somewhere in between being no support to your daughter whatsoever and calling the chapter president in a rage. If she has friends who are sorority alumnae, they would also have been an option.

What she said.

I don't know why I'm even bothering to voice an opinion here, but the whole thing seems dysfunctional, or potentially dysfunctional, from many angles.

I have never understood sororities that micromanage their members' behavior. This goes all the way from XYZs only date ABCs to an infamous SEC sorority that used to tell their new members exactly what they were and were not allowed to wear on campus. Presumably you do your best during rush to select girls who fit in with your house vibe, not girls you have to remake over in a certain image. Why did all these party girls get into the house if the sisters don't like that sort of party girl? And as for "punishing" a whole new member class, that's hazing and shouldn't be happening. The party girls should go before Standards, if any punitive action is taken, and really Standards is as much to blame as anyone for not working more closely with the membership chair and the chapter to ensure that girls who directly clashed with the house ethic weren't invited to join. I feel kind of bad for the new members who went through rush, were chosen, and now are being told that they are unacceptable. I mean, I get that the chapter doesn't want them going around dancing on tables with their letters on, but did they really have no inkling before and during rush that these girls were likely to do this?

Who knows how exactly the daughter phrased things when she complained to her mother. As several of you have pointed out, there is a wide variety of behavior that could have sparked the concern. It sounds to me like it is relatively minor behavior, since the mother's main concern is that her daughter is getting "punished" along with the others. But there are more serious problems in sororities these days. Cocaine use is rampant among many chapters, and if that is the sort of thing that the daughter is having to deal with, well, then I'd be pretty frightened also if, as an 18-year-old away from home for the first time, I found myself in a pledge class with a bunch of cokeheads. Obviously the daughter joined the chapter because she felt comfortable with the house ethic, and then the surprise was the fact that there's a group of new members who are totally at odds with it. Something went wrong during rush, and I hope the chapter can call in a consultant to help figure out how to avoid this happening again in the future.

Mom, if you're still reading this thread, this is something your daughter is going to have to work on out her own. I agree that it is dumb, in this instance, to punish the whole new member class. I don't think it is a productive way of resolving the situation, and I think it will just create more tension, between the sisters and the new members and within the new member class. I don't think it is going to be very effective for a new member to tell another new member, "stop doing XYZ because we are tired of getting punished." Personal opinion, but that sort of thing works better in a middle school class or on a scouting camping trip or in the army and is not appropriate in this situation. So you have every right to be aggrieved that your daughter has to deal with this, but the solutions you're seeking are not the right ones, because this is the responsibilities of the young adults involved and the national headquarters to work all this out. Just tell her that yes, it is annoying, and you hope she and her new member friends can keep themselves away from any particularly scandalous and/or illegal behavior. But the best thing she can do is express to the more sympathetic sisters her frustration with the whole thing, work to make the rest of her new member class close and positive, and then work hard the next rush to ensure that these types of girls aren't extended bids again, if indeed they are clashing with the rest of the house ethic. She's got a long time ahead of her to be an active, and so this is a bump in the road rather than a major disaster. It will be a great learning experience for her to work through this herself. Just listen to her, validate her feelings, and then tell her you're always there when she needs to talk.