It has little to do with that for those who don't want to be in an NPHC org. It has everything to do with that for those who want to be in an NPHC org, as evidenced by what I was specifically referencing. :)

You call it consistency and legitimacy and I call it mirroring the NPHC orgs that largely impacted the campus culture.

Yes, because I am right.

I was referring to why probate videos tend not to show up on youtube.

Like I joked on myself about but now must be real serious, you are not gonna see a Probate show online. (Only reason I bring this up is because you responded to my comment about does anybody really "probate" anymore). Not if they don't want it used as evidence against them.

What we call probate shows today are plentiful on youtube. They are really come out shows. I believe it was pointed out in another thread.

My first and only probate show I saw was on my campus when I was a freshman. Only one org was bold and brave enough to do it (and during my freshman year it was only three orgs on campus...the rest were on..."timeout".)

By the time I was ready to pledge, they stopped doing them. Never understood until an old head told me in love, when I thought I was a Super Bad Neo, the deal.

I'm with you except for the underlined sentence. If by "probate" you mean a "show" while you're still pledging, it still happens, and often. Perhaps we're talking about different things now.

To me, a literal probate is what people now call a surfacing. And, what we refer to as probates now are coming out shows.

I don't like the idea of surfacing because it does little more than give you the impetus to continue pledging right before things get really bad.

K

Yep what you call surfacing was once called probate.

And yes I can believe some people still do it. Does not take away from the fact that not posting doesn't for the most part have anything to do with respect, but because of the broad definition of hazing as adopted by the NPHC, if anything were to happen between surfacing/probate show and from when Grad Chapter/regionals/nationals receives said information that the people participating are members of the organization...it is evidence if something happens between that time.

Maaaaan, SEE! LOL!

You might want to speak for yourself and perhaps where you're from. I've been greek over 17 years now (and currently active and working with undergrad members) and this is the first I'm hearing of "surfacing," so it's not a universal word, not at all.

Although some of what you see online these days aren't true coming out shows either. Fools.

Oh Lord.

If I didn't know you been in the game 17 plus years, that comment proves it.

LOL

That you haven't heard of it doesn't make it a unicorn. :)

Wow. Is my age showing? LOL.

WOMP WOMP @ this thread :)

Only four years longer than I've been Greek. I've been talking about non-NPHCs in this thread as I would not want to insinuate that NPHC orgs pledge.