Wow...hanging out at Gosselins Without Pity, are we?

I don't think anyone is to "blame" for having 8 kids. If a couple really wanted so bad to be parents, who's to stop them from having kids? I don't think either of them knew that a) they'd get a hit reality show, b) have their lives turned upside down, or c) that they'd split up when they went in for fertility treatments.

If Jon really wanted to be with another woman, at least dump her first. There is no excuse and no good reason to cheat on your spouse.

Phyllis, are you okay? This anger and hatred toward someone on reality TV is very unlike you.

Random:
My cousin was wearing an Ed Hardy shirt the other day and it made me think of this thread

I don't blame them for having the kids...it wasn't their aim to have this many, and let's face it, stuff happens. I don't understand all of the science behind fertility treatments, but I know that there can be some unpredictability with the process.

I also understand some of the reasons they did the series - Jon didn't have much education and wasn't in a secure position professionally, and it was a way for them to provide for their children. Having that many kids is expensive, and if you can do something to make more money and give them better lives...I totally get that.

But...I don't think that they are blameless as to what has happened. There's only so much creative control that you retain (unless you're a producer, etc.). If you're going to start a reality show that centers around how you raise your kids, you need to realize that there will be some negative reactions. It's a big commitment.

I would think that would be part of the thought process if you're deciding to go on a reality show. How is it going to affect my life going forward? How will it affect the lives of my family and friends? In this case, how will it affect the kids? Do the negatives outweigh the positives?

I just don't think they can come back and criticize a process and series of results that they helped to create.

I would be a bitch too if my husband was as massive a tool as Jon.

I'm probably going to get flamed, but I like Kate Gosselin. Yes, she has a strong personality, but I think she is strong woman, a woman who truly does love her kids and wants the best for them (contrary to what the tabloids report). Those kids could do a lot worse than to have Kate as their mom.

I've been personally affected by a "Kate". I've seen a "Kate" treat a "Jon" the same way and it's really sad. It's when a "Jon" finally sticks up for themself, that problems in the marriage start.

If this were the other way around and Jon were treating Kate like that, all you (general) women would be crying mental abuse, but since it's a woman doing it to a man, it means she's got a "strong personality" and he's a tool/douchebag/etc. A woman can have a strong personality and not belittle her husband, being a complete bitch to him in front of their kids. How do you think the kids would respect the father if that had continued? One day these kids will look back, maybe see the episodes, and see their mother for what she is. A heartless bitch.

I know! I agree. I have people that have done shady things to me, stabbed me in the back etc, but I don't hate them. Hate is such a strong word, especially for people you've never met.

Thing is Jon never stood up for himself...instead he decided to cheat. He wants to not be married to Kate anymore, whatever, but to cheat on your wife and then publicly talk about how much you despise her is not "sticking up for yourself." Jon is a stupid little boy who doesn't like the idea with the idea of being a grown ass man. He can't deal with the fact that he's 33 (or however old he is) and has a family he needs to take care of. Fool hasn't even worked in a while, he took full advantage of the situation he was placed in--the same situation he's bitching about how he couldn't "deal" with it, and blah blah blah.

Having a family was what the Gosselins wanted (even though Jon wasn't too enthused with the idea of the sextuplets), and Jon decided that he didn't want that life and up and left. I seriously doubt Kate morphed into this "raging bitch" overnight. So I don't buy all of Jon's whining and complaining about how he was "verbally abused" and couldn't take it anymore.

As in most divorces, there is fault on both sides, and this case is no different. Both of these people have a TON of baggage - some of which Jon touched on when mentioning his alcoholic father, another is whatever is the situation with Kate and her estranged family. IMO, and I am sure I will be flamed for this, anyone who has relationship issues as large as these two do with their own siblings and family members, is going to have one heck of a time maintaining a healthy marriage unless they get help.

They needed marriage counseling - Jon says he has gone and she has refused. I don't know what the truth is, but at the very least, if they had gotten some sort of counseling about their own personal issues, then they might have been in an emotionally good place to work on their marital issues. As it stands, they both still need independent counseling sessions to prepare for the problems they are undoubtedly going to have with their children.

Kate is overbearing and Jon is immature. Both are selfish.

This.

For the sake of their their relationship with each other [even if they are separated/divorced] and their children, I hope that they both seek counseling. It's impossible to harbor feelings of resentment and not have it negatively affect their children.

How did they wind up with 6 kids on the 2nd pregnancy? Did she do the same procedure as Nadya Suleman (i.e. the octomom)?

I look on the soothsayer of all knowledge, Wikipedia, but it doesn't really get into the nitty gritty.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_and_Kate_Plus_Eight

Well, now we are going to have to know more info! Are you a mom who has had multiple births? I think this is pretty interesting!! :)
Hmmm...maybe I am a nerd for being interested despite my single births and impending menopausal status??:confused:

When they had one of their FAQ episodes, Jon and Kate said that they did an IUI procedure.

Freaking amen. I'm so over these castrating "women" (I don't even want to claim them in my gender).

I would never wish that on someone, on the benefit of the children. No child, no matter what age, should have to deal with hating their parents. Before this whole debacle, before Jon started acting like a douchebag, Kate treated him like crap. Maybe had they cut the show, supposedly like Jon had wanted, then it wouldn't have gotten to this point. No matter how much I dislike someone, I'd never wish them bad.

I was just thinking about their families. If it's that bad that your own family turns their back on you, and from what we've read earlier in this thread that their church did too (or that they thought badly of her? can't remember), that's pretty sad.

Jon and Kate Plus 8 is now just Kate Plus 8.

http://www.usatoday.com/life/televis...jon-kate_N.htm

I also read today that Jon has filed to have the divorce delayed 90 days. :confused: