I think that most of the older GC'ers from the D9 who are familiar with the HBCU's realize that make happen. However, we know there is something rather "fishy" about the process of the "colonization" and it entails money... Which makes HBCU's just a money grubbing moochers as anyone else...

Then it just makes kids like saetax use that "wonderful knowledge of his" fodder to attack HBCU's and "black people" more for taking money, again, from "the man"--which essentially is neglecting the whole "global" reason why this entire process commenced...


Good luck with that... You all probably can buy off some administators at the 'House... However, I fail to foresee you buying Massey off very well... And raiding the coffers at Morehouse has already happened.

Then you are battling the fact the Morehouse men start pledging when they get their freshmen acceptance letters and they think they are a part of a fraternity already...

Which is why they actually get the D5 fraternities kicked off campus so often because they have to pledge them harder than when these boys started school.

So what would your organization have to offer differently to these men of Morehouse?

The fact that you all have the "all inclusive", "global brotherhood" that really the D4 fraternities cannot offer?

Okey? I guess? :confused: But good luck with that...

Some people might be in for a rude awakening... I'm just saying... And hey, it might be the D9 :eek: :rolleyes:

uhhhhh, when did I "attack" any black fraternity or say anything about blacks taking money from "the man". don't remember when I said anything relating to that in this thread. you quote, "the black man" like i said something wrong....or are you one of those types that thinks they should all be referred to as African Americans. I'm Scottish and Dutch. Should I refer to myself as a Dutch-Scot American??

"Buying" off Administrations?

Dont try to think to hard on that one!

Ridiculous statement. Why buy anything when it is free and have the right to colonize where there is a need or a want.

I beleive that the young man from H U stated that the group of Men petitioned PKA, not the other way around.

you should be.

talk about a completely useless and irrelevant jumble of words.

AKA_Monet said-
"I think that most of the older GC'ers from the D9 who are familiar with the HBCU's realize that make happen. However, we know there is something rather "fishy" about the process of the "colonization" and it entails money... Which makes HBCU's just a money grubbing moochers as anyone else...

My beautiful AKA Sister-

First off, there's no money involved - whoever is giving you your info is way off base. None of the NIC Groups I know pay schools to come to their campuses. that would be silly. It's about being asked to come to a campus by a group of men or deciding that a campus would be a good place for expansion. I understand that the onus is on me to expalin to you how NIC groups do things, but how does the D9 grow and prosper - you don't just show up at a campus and say, "we're a chapter now - give us all the rights that everyone that's been here has." Do you?

As for what Phi Psi, or any group, has to offer the Men of Morehouse or any School compared toi Alpha, Kappa, Sigma, Iota or Que - A lot. We're different. that's the biggest thing -we give another option. What does Alpha have to offer at UCLA? or Kappa at Duke? options!


The fact that you try and make fun of the fact that we are diverse - kinda makes me wonder, especially since I just saw one of your Sorors do the same thing on National TV. Why does it seem to me (and if I'm wrong I Do apoloigize) that you just don't like NIC or NPC groups? Have they done something to wrong you. much like the D9, we all have our problems, but we have to work together - if we don't we'll all fail alone.

I hope that this finds you well, in the spirit of our interfraternal bond.

Just wanted to quote this in case anyone missed it. People keep saying it has to do with money. NIC and NPC orgs do not give colleges money to be on their campus. Is the Pike expansion still "fishy"?

:confused:

Student groups, esp Greek orgs, can only be organized on campus WITH THE PERMISSION of the school administration, esp at HBCUs. Those who attended HBCUs can speak more to this topic but I understand that these schools tend to regiment structures such as membership intake for the Greek orgs.

Therefore, your premise is FALSE.

I don't know where the issue of money came from. I do not approve of my fraternity colonizing Howard University and I damn sure wouldn't pay for the opportunity. I agree with many of the representatives of the HBGLOs who have posted here. Howard is a distinguished university, but we shouldn't be disrupting someone else's culture.

Phi Psi guy...applause
 

The various Valkeries, Jubilances and Lady Pi Phis...I do not give a
rat's ass what you think. I personally think you are angry, and
a feel good PC aspirant. And shallow and myopic.
But you have a right to air your views. But I cannot see how so
many of you can ignore the strides made and how many of you still feel you are entitled to a handout. And the "us" has been used many times on this site. It is first person plural but not necessarily all-inclusive. Is that too much for you to grasp?
The pronouncements made by some of you dummies will keep you
busy in sites like this where you can do no harm.

Student groups, esp Greek orgs, can only be organized on campus WITH THE PERMISSION of the school administration, esp at HBCUs. Those who attended HBCUs can speak more to this topic but I understand that these schools tend to regiment structures such as membership intake for the Greek orgs.

That's not necessarily true - in many cases, the student life office of a university encourages groups to start and exist, on their own. Permission is tacitly implied by the fact that students are involved. Do you really think that the college republicans or college democrats or SNCC or any of those groups got permission before they started.

Also what usually happens in a situation where a group of men come to an organization and ask to colonize is that group meets and then, after talking to someone from the national org, decides to take the next step and become a colony - on their way to their charter.

On a different tack - Firehouse, why don't you want your fraternity to grow? what about going to Howard bothers you?

I didn't know that any GLOs gave money to colleges to be on their campus. I guess administration pay-offs happen somewhere though.

To my knowledge, when people talk about money they are talking about:

1. the membership fees that we all pay to become initiated and maintain active status in our organizations

2. the good public relations that both HU and PIKA could receive from this ordeal. That isn't a bad thing but our organizations and expansion are always about business as well as brother/sisterhood

Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

And "issues" rhymes with "tissues."

Someone get this guy some Kleenex because he's having a moment.

Speaking as a Delta, a new charter can only be obtained if the school administration signs off on it. This goes for HBCUs as well as non-HBCUs. There have been many times when we were unable to establish a chapter on a campus, because the school would not allow it.

Most campuses require approval for all student groups that wish to be formally recognized by the university. This approval process is even more stringent for GLOs. I don't know why people think that organizations do not have to go through forms and other processes to become established.

Just because someone was able to have their knitting group meet in their dorm room every week doesn't mean that this group was a "student and campus organization." Anyone can start meeting and get the idea for a group, but to become formal you have to go through the administration.

lady greek you're absolutely right - to get a CHARTER, the university has to sign off on it - that's the same with our group as well - but while they are striving towards that chartering date, they are just a org - no different that the dodgeball club, except they probably have to go through the step of havng Greek Council or IFC or Panhel saying that they can be on campus. But the university allows for those all encompassing groups to give initial approval.

So, what are you trying to say?

also, there is a big difference between registered and recognized - For example, at one of the schools where I'm a Chapter Advisor - and deal with the university Administration on a weekly basis - the chapter, like all orgs on campus is simply registered , meaning that they have to meet the same requirements that every other group does - along with that, they self adminster Greek Council and IFC - meaning that those groups adminster discipline and set policies that member groups live by - they did not need recognition before they got their charter. it was not until they were applying for their charter that we even had a discussion with the university about our status.

At the other school I advise, the Chapter is recognized, but there, too, the university, through the auspicies of the IFC , the Panhel and/or the MCGC (depending on what type of group it is) allows for the members of those groups to make a preliminary decision to let a group come on campus - it's not until the Colony period is over does the University step in and make sure everything is on the up and up. Of Course they check in along the way, but they don't give permission.

what i'm saying is that we have to first get the nomenclature correct.
A colony is a group of men/women that have gone out to a national organization or been selected by a national organization during a recruitment process with the goal of, one day, receiving a Chapter Charter from that organization. To achieve that, which sometimes takes anywhere from 3 months to 2 years, they have to meet many goals and complete many tasks - one of which is getting approval for existing on that campus. it is not something that you get at the beginning of the process, but instead at the end.

Does that make sense - at least that's how it works in the NIC world - it might be different in the NPHC world, and that's where we are arguing. I don't want to argue with a Delta - my sister would kill me.

so what responsibility/culpability would the university bear if an "incident," hazing or otherwise, occured before the registered organization's chartering process was complete?

For NPC's, teh university recognition comes at the beginning. After all, the University is who invited the group to colonize in the first place.

Usually what would happen in that instance would be that the group would not be allowed, via the IFC, to get their charter and usually the national HQ and Exec would shut down the Colony - i've had to do that before - its one of the hardest things in the fraternity world - because it's usually one idiot or a small group of idiots that take you there

in the registered scenario, the university bears no responsibilty - that's what i've been told by a few Student Life personnel.

if the 06 in your name refers to you wearing Black and Old Gold, then Congrats on your Century of Greatness -

thanks, smart blonde, but as you know, you tend to only expand when the university says its ok, while we on the NIC side go out looking all the time for places to "plant the flag"

Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

Sorry buddy, but I've never been one for handouts, which could explain why I'm working on my second master's degree. According to you, I'm sitting at home ranting against the man and collecting welfare checks. Its so easy to "ass"ume something negative about me, instead of actually listening to people when they tell you that your posts are offensive. Yeah I'm angry, cause I could be the most successful woman in the world, and folks like you would still think I'm a product of handouts and quotas, instead of working hard and getting somewhere on my own merit.

Try again.

Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

dear jubilance1922,

i :heart: you. you're my hero.

love,
tld221

No, My premise is not False.

Granted any Organization has to be recognized by The College.

"My main point being, there were a Group of Men who decided that they wanted something different than was being offered". They did not just go to PKA and say We want You whether the College wants You or not.

These Young Men made the decision and proceeded with getting PKA in becoming interested in Colonizing there.

I do not beleive PKA or anyother NIC/NPC Organization will ever go to a Campus where they are not wanted.

LXA would not have gone onto NC A & T unless We were welcomed.

Let them do their thing and live or die, not with everyone on GC trying to make decisions for them. None of You made the decision anyway.

None seem to want to listen to anyone such as the posters who :

1. Is a member of the Founding Colony.
2. A Member of another GLO who holds a Very High Position of His Organization.

Not in Delta. A group of young ladies call our NHQ and express an interest in chartering a chapter. They are sent application materials. Included in these materials is a approval form that the school must sign. If the school does not approve the request, the process is done and the group is not allowed to exist even remotely in the name of Delta.

If the request is approved by the school (and of course Delta) then the group is formalized and the process begins and it's usually no longer than two to three months.

You're right it is one of those differences between our two organizations in that we do not have colonies.

Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

I do not want this post to get lost in the midst of all this other stuf. What jubilance1922 said right here needs to precede every other post made by these kids erik conrad and saetex or whatever their names are. Every now and then I get a little miffed at some of the ignorance spouted like people like them an at that point, I take my GC break, but I wanted to make SURE this post was seen and read by the intended reader. See it? GET it? Good.

Re: Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

Erik Conrad is about ten minutes younger than dirt.

Just wanted to make sure you knew.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

CTHU!!!!!!!!
I would also like to add - too dayum old to be having hissy fits on the internet, or otherwise.

Carry on...................:p :p

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

What's age got to do with it? So a person past a certain age is not allowed to get angry, or as you say have a "hissy fit" on the Internet, nor in RL?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

I only said that because Eric's constant going on rants about things he has no knowledge of.

*Please don't beat me. I'll be good next time. In the meantime, I'll just stand in the corner :( :( :(*

welcome
 

while you are farting in the bathtub, I am still happy to see you
are on top of it all.....Har har har de har har

Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

If you're going to say "us" (especially in regards to a topic in which plural pronouns are QUITE OFTEN used to denote an entire race/class of people) please at least clarify which "us" to which you are referring.

Alpha Phi Omega has 51 "black chapters" (read: issued 51 charters at HBCUs), the majority of which were long before the fraternity went coed. The first one was at Johnson C. Smith back in 1947, and the second was at Howard a year later.

I mention this because frankly, Alpha Phi Omega was one of the first fraternities to proactively push to break down racial barriers with regards to membership long before other GLOs even cared to even think about dealing with such an issue.

So as far as predominately white fraternities with black chapters go, Alpha Phi Omega was at the forefront of all-inclusive membership at a time when most orgs was just talking about it, APO was actually being about it.

I've been thinking about all this the whole time through both Pike at Howard threads, but I didn't want Tom Earp to tell me that we didn't count.

EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT POST!

Very well said.

You have hit the nail on the head as to what the core issue on what this entire debate is all about!

Now everyone, forget all the snide jabs and smart-@$$ comments everyone has been throwing around, because it’s totally irrelevant to the discussion at hand and listen up to what I am about to say.

The reason why some people in the NPHC don’t want to Pikes to come to Howard is rooted in ELITISM, which is in essence a form of classism, whereby one group of people express a sense of superiority over another group of people via a sense of privilege, be it real or perceived. THAT is why I “hate” the NPHC orgs so much. As if being a black person isn’t enough of a challenge, I have a group of “my own people” looking down on me or clowning me because I didn’t join one of their organizations? Well, let me tell all the NPHC folk why I never joined one of their orgs, or for that matter, never had enough “energy” to pursue membership in a graduate/alumni chapter. For the record it was because deep down, I simply do not think that with my personality, that I would make a good “fit” in any of the so called “D5” orgs. I would look good on paper for any of the 5 orgs as far as the org’s principles would go, but from a social bonding standpoint, even if I did join, I would still feel like a square peg in a round hole. So if I was to start my own org or join one that would be more ideal to my personality and style, sure NPHC folk would say, “Do your thing”, or “Whatever floats your boat”, but I know a lot of them would whisper behind my back, “He probably got a rejection letter(s) from [insert “D5” org of your choice here].

Why are black college students socially obligated to seek NPHC orgs without risk of ridicule from their peers? It’s interesting to hear NPHC members proudly declare their selectivity and exclusiveness in one breath, and in another breath snicker at someone who joined an NIC/NPC org or a service GLO. I say it’s interesting because chances are, you wouldn’t have taken the person in the first place, and since the individual bypassed the NPHC to join something that was for them more lucrative, it’s almost as if the NPHC is mad at them because the individual didn’t give the NPHC a chance to reject them first, almost as if to spite them. This is just my personal take on it, and I will not debate this point with anyone, as it will be an exercise in futility.

But here is my point of contention with regards to the NPHC elitism as it pertains to the Pikes at Howard: The elitism is so thick, that the NPHC dissenters is not doing the one thing to the Pikes with regards to their racist past that God asks every man do to one another:

FORGIVE THEM!!!

Sure the Pikes may have had a racist origination, clauses, or behaviors, but the important thing right now is that they saw the error of their ways and corrected them. And the NPHC dissenters is still holding them accountable to their past. Well, two wrongs don’t make a right and it doesn’t make it even, either!

So in essence, this whole issue of NPHC elitism is the very thing that makes me want to post and debate on CG time and time again. I hate, abhor, loathe, and despise it. And for the record, as long as it continues, I will continue to contest, fight, and debate it. Because after all, if you don’t take a stand for something, you’ll fall for anything. And in this case, I have to say that the NPHC dissenters are clearly in the wrong on this one.

In short, join a GLO for where you will best fit, not for what you will mostly get. (hey, I like the rhyme scheme). And if that happens to be a NIC/NPC org, more power to ya.

Still fightin’ after 6 years on GreekChat,

Rain Man

boy scout frat
 

Some NIC fraternities had black members before 1947 but that is
not the issue any more than Theta Xi had non-engineering members of Delta Chi had lawyers.
Alpha Phi Omega did not count, they had no house, they operated
as a club of boy scout alums; SAEs and Betas, even Pikes, could join. You are talking as a wannabe and while APO is in the
IFC on some campi (campuses) it is hardly in the mainstream of the traditional fraternity, the NIC one, so you are mixing apples with oranges. Is that hard for you to understand, smedley?

Re: boy scout frat
 

Actually.....

In this case, APO does count. You see, APO chapters don't exist in a vacuum. The fact that APO DOES have SAEs and Betas and Pikes says something valuable here.

APO was a fraternity of men -- all men, and mostly white -- that expanded to historically black colleges at a time when NIC fraternities were not. Yet, many of those men were also members of NIC fraternities.

I wasn't going to let you trash-talk my fraternity when frankly, an all-white GLO is an all-white GLO, regardless of what type of "outfit" is is. It MEANS something that a group of white men colonized at an HBCU. In 1947. And again and again for years and years.

Not a club -- but a fraternity.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Phi Psi guy...applause
 

LOL. I really don't care. Based on the level of intelligence reflected by his commentary, he's a kid in my book.