Please explain to me the difference between "YOU KNOW" and "YOU KNOOOOOOOOOW", besides the extra O's.

Also, where the hell is Norf Currrrlina?

You said "We know, we know, we know...some of "you" get really sensitive and paranoid when things APPEAR to be black and white " Please, tell me what "you" means? Does that mean the "white race"? You have been assuming, so I will assume too. You are pointing out black from white, so its not a matter of appearance anymore.

I say "You're damn right I get mad. It's always the white man trying to keep the black man down." Pure bullshit.

Lastly, thanks for participating.

I can't beleive this thread REALLY got taken to the level of inanity that it has.

White orgs have/had calls and whistles. I learned something new.

Another observation I have is that some of these calls and whistles are ritualistic in nature, which may be another reason why they are not common knowledge.

Can we please hear more HISTORY about NPC orgs with calls?

THANK YOU!!! Dang. . . :p :rolleyes:

Norf Currrrlina!!! hells ya. :)

To my knowledge, Pi Beta Phi has no call/whistle. I think it's really interesting that some NPC/IFC orgs use these.

For you NPHC folks, when did calls come into use? I'm curious to know whether the NPHC and NPC developed calls at the same time, and when the NPC quit using their calls...

ZTA does have a call/whistle but its not public knowledge and I don't believe it ever was. Anyway, I can't imagine it being very ladylike for a woman in the late 1800's to whistle in public!

Re: NPC sororities with calls?
 

Yeah, I saw it mentioned in Watchwords and I was like "Huh?".
I thought it was interesting....

DG also had a sort of eagle crest that has fallen into disuse (again, thank you Watchwords)

No no no. You're ALL missing the point, because there ISN'T a point to the inane arguing in this thread.

Get the ish over it, mmmkay?

Hmmm...How about this?

1. How about NPC/IFC people stop making this into a race thing? Cause I read this thread, and I could tell that it was the non-NPHC-ers who threw in the whole "race thing".

2. ATTENTION NPC/IFC: To the NPHC, doing someone's call when you are not a member of that org. is like wearing your letters when you not a member. Would a Phi Mu wear Chi O on her chest? I don't think so. Well, in the D9 world, doing an Alpha call when you're a Sigma is the same. It just doesn't happen.

3. I think some people got too damn sensitive cause someone asked a question. If you don't know the answer, then just say that. And...If somebody wasn't talking to you, then don't say anything, k? How about that...

***stepping off soapbox*** Thank you and have a good night...

Wow, this thread may already be too far gone, but it's a really interesting question so here's my attempt to rescue it...

First, there's a distinction to be made. There are calls that the D9 folks have been discussing - these are generally a fairly modern invention, public in nature (even if "proprietary" to the group), primarily for the purpose of promoting the group, and non-ritualistic. Then there are the calls, whistles, etc. that I think ariesrising was originally asking about. These are ritualisitc features; formal, secret, added to the written rituals of quite a few fraternities and sororites.

The ritualistic convention of using a call or whistle is primarily seen in Era I GLOs - those founded in the early and mid-1800s. (later fraternities and sororities undoubtedly copied them without really knowing the original purpose).

Remember that GLO membership (in fact, almost any form of student organization) was largely forbidden at a lot of colleges in this time period. If it became known that a person was a member of a GLO, there would certainly be some kind of faculty retribution and in fact that person would likely be expelled. So... Badges and letters and crests were not openly displayed. Badges were often worn inside a jacket lapel. Ritualistic meetings were held at some secret place. Codes were used to announce meetings and for any public correspondence. And the members necessarily developed whistles and calls and secret words as a way to identify themselves without arousing attention.

That's the history of calls, whistles, snaps, hand signs, etc. Later groups no doubt adopted these because they do add a bit of clandestine flair.

So, maybe Phi Mu did copy the DST yell. Maybe not. Who cares? Both groups took the original concept from an Era I fraternity anyway. There's nothing new under the sun.

Frankly, it is interesting though... the practice started as a way to secretly identify yourself, and today it has evolved into a way of proudly announcing or promoting yourself.

wptw

On a continuing quest for knowledge:


Which Fraternities are considered Era 1 Fraternities?

I BELIEVE they are the Union Triad plus a couple others....but I'm not sure.

Ok, I'd like to run this by you guys to get your opinion of whether or not this is "stealing" or what not.

I find it great that NPHC GLOs take pride in the yr they were founded, and I know Alpha Phi Alpha's call is their founding yr, so would you see something wrong if my chapter said "1-8" "9-9"?

Note: NOT a troll post, I actually want to bring this to my chapter.

Era I fraternities are typically referred to as those in the mid 1820's to 1860 or so.

Stan, the Beta's here do the same thing as the APhiA's, except using 1839 - they love it. Again, no asses handed on platters.

WPTW - great analogy of all this starting way back when....

wptw....comes out from the shadows and saves the day when you least expect it. thanks for the knowledge.

Stan...now, please take into consideration that although I am an Alpha, I am a pretty liberal one. If you want to shout out the year you were founded, nobody can take that away from you. My suggestion is to be as unique about it as possible, and be able to justify why you do it (if you so choose).

Cuz at the end of the day, if somebody has a problem with that, they really have too much free time in the first place.

Dividing the groups into “eras” based on group character or on the prevailing circumstances of their founding is interesting, but somewhat arbitrary by nature. The guy who has the McRae greek pages put the following groups into the Era I category, and I tend to agree with him.

Kappa Alpha Society 1825
Sigma Phi Society 1827
Delta Phi Fraternity 1827
Alpha Delta Phi 1831
Psi Upsilon 1833
Delta Upsilon 1834
Beta Theta Pi 1839
Chi Psi 1841
Delta Kappa Epsilon 1844
Alpha Sigma Phi 1845
Delta Psi 1847
Zeta Psi 1847
Theta Delta Chi 1847
Phi Gamma Delta 1848
Phi Delta Theta 1848
Phi Kappa Sigma 1850
Phi Kappa Psi 1852
Chi Phi 1824/1854
Sigma Chi 1855
Sigma Alpha Epsilon 1856
Theta Chi 1856
Delta Tau Delta 1858

::back into the shadows::

wptw

1.) The difference in spelling is to show the difference in how it is said. That seems pretty self evident, since "calls" are said, as opposed to written.

2.) North Carolina...see above for a similar explanation

3.) Hmmmm..."you" means whatever "you" would mean when the word YOU has quotation marks around it. Have fun figuring it out, as I will have fun with whatever conclusion you draw.

This became a race issue because of defensiveness and paranoia. So "you" all can make from it what "you" choose.
:cool:

Check my signature for how I feel about the "white man..." blahzey blah you just typed.

P.S. Everything I say is said for a reason. Riddle #1,913.

Thanks for participating.

How about you get over it, mmmkay?

Yeah, who cares? :rolleyes: We were NEVER talking about PhiMu copying the DST "yell." So, yeah...who cares? :rolleyes:

Your Era I theory does not quite apply to ALL GLOs, too. Just a thought.

Thanks for participating.

Yup....

Actually I remember seeing the Pi Phi whistle in a song book in our archives. I have no idea how it sounds though.

For clarification:

Would that mean that Pi Phi has a regional or chapter call, as opposed to a national call? Just wondering, since the other Pi Phi was unaware of one.

Also, if you read where there is a whistle, or any other call, do you ever come in contact with older members who could let you know how it sounds?

Just asking out of genuine curiosity ;)

If something is found in a national/international songbook, it's national/international. I think a reason you aren't getting a lot of answers is because a lot of this is a ritual secret for NPC and IFC orgs. Just like we don't know why you OOOO-OOOOP, you can't know why we do or do not play the kazoo as our secret sign to each other.

I assume it was a national whistle because it was in a song book from Nationals. But the song book was very old. Maybe that is why breathsgelatin has never heard of it.

But I'm sure there are older Pi Phi's that know how it sounds. It was actually on sheet music so I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to figure out. I would love to hear it. Although it would do me no good because I can't whistle. :)

I'll dig through our songbooks and see what I can find when I get back to school. I'm sure it's there.

man, is it really that hard for people to understand this? good ish, AXE.

Thank you...someone who actually sticks to the point of the thread and doesn't get in everyone's face. As another AOII said earlier, AOII did have a call, and I've been trying to figure it out since I've been a collegiate/alum...so going on 10 years, and I still don't know it. I don't know of any AOIIs that know it, though I will have to go ask some of the little old ladies at the next Founder's Day...Maybe they might have some insight.:)

Maybe you need to re-read his/her post, then.

If you all want this "topic" to die down, and return to the original topic...TRULY let it die down :p

I did stick to the topic. I wrote about the AOII call. :) And I was giving him some props for talking about the history of calls. Is this a bad thing? No need to be hostile to me, thanks.

:rolleyes:

Chaos, clearly you don't like my answer to the original question. But in rereading this whole thread I don't see where you've come up with an answer of your own. Since you're urging us to return to the original topic, here it is:

"NPC sororities with calls? I remember a post a looong time ago where CutiePie2000 mentioned she found that Delta Gamma used to have a call. I'm curious, do any of the other NPC have or used to have one? What is it? Why do you think it's not used?"

What's your opinion? Are you here to debate or just to practice sarcastic potshots and ":rolleyes:" smilies?

wptw

Ritual
 

I think that some people may not be responding to the thread's original question because sometimes these things (well, whistles at least) are part of ritual.

Did I ever say I didn't like your answer to the question? I happen to disagree with the part that I've already addressed. Feel free to re-read my response to it, if your memory fails you.

I never urged you to go back to the original topic. I said "if you all want to let this "topic" die and go back to the original topic, TRULY let it die." That simply means to leave out snide remarks and TRULY move on.

My original intent behind posting was for clarity. The debate portion of that ended a while ago. So, 6 pages later, I'm just here to practice sarcastic potshots and ":rolleyes:" smilies. Good observation, Watson!

I've said my piece. Peace.

Yes, indeed my memory fails me and even on rereading your responses I am unable to find your point. Do you have one? If so, perhaps you could do me the courtesy of repeating it in very simple terms so I can wrap my feeble mind around it.

Humor me.

wptw

Instant Vintage.

My point TO YOU is that you NEVER understood what my inquiry was about. So my advice TO YOU would be either:

1) read from the beginning of the deviation from the original topic

ORRRRR

2) get over it and move on

I suggest 2 because I've never been good at humoring people. So, wrap your "feeble mind" around that.

Take care :cool:

riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.....

You keep saying take care, yet you don't go away.

:rolleyes:

Nope :cool:

I always return when someone posts to me.

Hint, hint........

Ohhhhhhhh, OK. Thanks. Now I see!

See, I never gave a crap about your inquiry.

Still don’t.

I was addressing the original topic. Quite correctly, I might add. Like it or not, both the NPC and the D9 inherited this particular convention.

night night

wptw

wow, was all of this really needed?