Call me racist, but the black fraternities I have seen remind me more of a street gang then a fraternity. I know that while most people are too PC to admitt it publicly, they would agree with that statement. Are all of them that way? No. Are most of them? Yes.

And by the way, I can't believe you're actually bragging about founding dates in the 1900s.

Is there something wrong with that??? Please elaborate on this...

I don't think bowsandtoes realizes that african americans weren't free or welcome in his organization at the time that many of the NPHC groups were founded...don't worry....it's just his stupidity and ignorance showing....:confused:



but he probably thinks he's super smart and cool.

See, this is what bothers me. Someone makes an honest statement, and gives credit to the idea that it is probably not that way everywhere, and gets called racist and ignorant...

Regarding your comments about blacks not being free or allowed to join...I don't know if that is the entire reason. The organizations are not simply black replicas of their previous white counterparts, but rather have entirely different goals and activities. My fraternity still has never had a black person, not because we are white trash racists, but because we have different ideologies, and just as a black person probably wouldn't get much out of our fraternity, he probably wouldn't fit in in our organization.

It's not an honest statement, it's his opinion. And to make himself look even more ignorant, elitist, and stupid, he goes with the "if it's older, it must be better" comment by jabbing somebody else's organization just because it was founded after his. And I'm trying to make the point that it was founded after his because the founding members weren't welcome in bowsandtoes organization because of racial attitudes/exclusion policies at the time. Don't tell me if there was a black student who wanted to be a Kappa Sig in 1900 they would have been allowed/welcomed with open arms into the brotherhood.

I'm not even telling you a black guy would be met with open arms today in Kappa Sig. If you truly want to get into why black fraternities were founded after white fraternities, its not only because they werent allowed in white fraternities, but also because they weren't even in college when many IFC fraternities were founded. You're right, it is his opinion, but you didn't do anything to refute it, only began calling names. If you want to refute the somewhat thuggish image black fraternities may have in parts of the country, why not highlight the ones that create lawyers and doctors and politicians. As somebody who went to school at a major southern university, I think I understand somewhat what he's saying. There were only 3 things I ever heard out of NPHC groups...1) That they were having a big blowout party at some club for black university students 2) That they were doing/sponsoring a stepshow or 3) that they were having some sort of forum/speaker/etc regarding racial inequality. Note I didn't say thats ALL they did, thats just all they publicized. So yeah, I never felt like they were anything like the same greek community that I belonged to.

Your ignorance really shows. I think I know a little something about big southern universities--I'm an alum of UGA, class of 2001. I also know a little something about the NPHC groups. One of my friends my freshman year was a sister of Sigma Gamma Rho. They do quite a bit of service in addition to the stepshows and parties at the nightclubs you talk about. I remember a workshop in the dorms about campus safety sponsored by her sorority and the UGA police department. There was also a panel discussion in the dorms about the differences/similarities between "white greeks" and "black greeks". It was really interesting and brought up many of the points discussed in this thread. During spring semester, all of the girls on my hall attended the step show to support our friend in SGR. Despite the notion of a "thuggish/street gang" atmosphere, it was anything but. My friends and I had a great time supporting our friend and nobody got cut, mugged, or stabbed. Gee, what a surprise!:eek: Now that I'm a teacher, I work with several women who are active members of graduate chapters of Alpha Kappa Alpha and Delta Sigma Theta. They still do active service projects, such as a science camp for teenage girls. Anything thuggish about that? And my experience is by observation only--I'm a member of a "white sorority"

Right, so again I'm ignorant how? Because I simply state what I've seen? I never said they arent active in philanthropy, I simply stated how they presented their organization on my campus. The only thing I said they WERE NOT, is something similar to the greek community I have been involved in, which you did not refute. I currently attend the University of Georgia, and hopefully I won't come out as ridiculously accusatory as you have.

Say it ain't so. :(

Well...that I have to agree would explain all of the posts...

Its true, and why would you mind? You don't go there do you?

I believe you mean to say your CHAPTER has never had a black member.

And even with that qualifier, honey, you might be surprised.

My apologies, my chapter has never had a black member. Trust me, not only can I assure you of that, but I can tell you the 2 IFC fraternities at my school that have had black members. Well, I can't say who was in my fraternity before about 1965, but given the situation of the period, I find it highly unlikely.

Are you POSITIVE? :D

Haha, yes I am. It simply doesn't happen much(understatement) on that campus.