Look, I understand that this is a discussion board. I particpate in this discussion board, and read it daily. I am addicted to it and spend more than my fair share on it (when I should be doing homework or sorority work!)

My point that I am trying to make is this...I can't believe that people actually take this drug recreationally. Whether it be for fun, to stay up for work, whatever! I can't believe that some people are actually discussing whether this stuff harms you! I can tell you from experience, IT DOES!! Physically and mentally. It affected me in my personal relationships with my friends, family and romantic relationships. Jeez, I haven't been able to have a long-term relationship since then. And it has been almost four years.

PLEASE!!! Just realize this, this is definitely not a drug to mess with. The recipe for it is easily found on the internet nowadays. The &$&(%&) who gave it to me got it from where he worked (he was a physician assistant). I don't and hope no one ever has to go through what I went through.

I just was shocked to see how some people were talking about it like they were. Maybe I should have walked away from Greekchat and taken some deep breaths before I posted. I am sorry for that. :(

Please understand where I was and am coming from in my feelings though.....

Fraternally.
Meredith

You see, I obviously wasn't clear enough. By saying that the drug is "meant" to put you to sleep I am presenting a different perspective on it.

If you take too much you will pass out. Simple enough. Its what the drug is supposed to do. A lot of people have gone to the ER for an expensive Nap because their friends panicked (justifiably) when they passed out.

ITs when you take it improperly that you get "high". See? Thats why it is so easy to "nooch out", G-Out or whatever the term is near you lol.

The street stuff is the same really because its so easy to make. But, you don't know the dose, or strength. Hence its much easier to "pass out"? See?

As to the different "types" of GHB out there Axjules, I don't understand. Uf_pike is not completely correct.

There are three popular types of "GHB".

Sodium based GHB. Which as he said, sucks ass in taste.

Potassium based GHB. Which also tastes like hell and is almost identical. Think for a second. "Salt Substitute" is a potassium product and is made for people looking to cut salt. It tastes the same as Salt. So its far from tasteless or whatever.

The third kind was a potassium/sodium combination.

GHB "analogues" are products that the body converts into GHB. There are two you need to be aware of:

GBL (Gamma Butyrolactone), which is converted in the liver by lactonase into GHB.

1, 4 butanediol which is converted in the liver by alcohol dehydronase the same enzyme that breaks down alcohol.

Most of the "GHB" in the club scene now is actually GBL mixed in juice or something.

Now, justa couple years ago they were selling GBL products over the counter.

These can be especially misleading. One: you don't know the strength. 1ml (mililiter) is roughly 1 gram of GBL. So how many ml have been mixed per ounce of fluid?

Also, GBL placed in fluid slowly begins to convert to GHB acid which actually hits you much harder, quicker, and stronger than straight GHB or GBL. Hence why sometimes people will be like: "That was soo strong".

There are some scientific inaccuracies here but its basically correct.

HEALTH ADVISORY ON ¡§GHB¡¨ AND RELATED SOLVENTS
JUNE 2002

SUMMARY

An increase in the number of drug overdoses has been observed at some clubs and parties over the past 12 to 18 months. Anecdotal information from MedEvent, a network of volunteer health professionals who provide medical services at dance events, suggests that approximately seven in ten overdose situations involve GHB or its analogs, usually in combination with other substances.

Substances sold and known alternatively as ¡§G,¡¨ ¡§Gina,¡¨ or ¡§Swirl¡¨ may, in fact, be one of three chemical solutions that have similar characteristics, but some important differences that can lead to undesirable effects or overdose. These chemicals are:

? GHB (gamma-hydroxybutyrate), a nervous system depressant
? GBL (gamma-butyrolactone), a lactone-based industrial solvent that is converted into GHB in the bloodstream
? B, BD, or BDO (1,4-butanediol), an alcohol-based solvent that is converted in the bloodstream first into GBL and then GHB

All three chemicals may be obtained in different concentrations and may be clear or tinted with food coloring. Without a great deal of knowledge, it is difficult to distinguish one liquid from the other by sight, smell or taste, although there are some differences. Each of the three chemicals varies with respect to potency. The difference between a mild euphoric effect and an overdose can be as little as a teaspoon of liquid, depending on the chemical and the concentration, and on other factors such as body weight and the amount of food in your stomach. All three substances magnify the effects of alcohol and some other drugs, including some sleeping pills, anti-anxiety drugs and other depressant type medications.

The Date-Rape Drug Prohibition Act of 2000 classifies both GHB and GBL as Schedule I drugs, the same legal status reserved for drugs such as cocaine, LSD and heroin. In New York, possession, manufacture or distribution of small quantities of these drugs can carry a prison term of up to life in prison. Some states, including California, have banned ¡§analogues¡¨ of GHB, which includes both GBL and B.

In light of these developments, the health and legal risks associated with use of GHB and its analogs are considerably higher now. In addition, the contingencies of providing for medical care at dance parties are costly and increasingly difficult to manage.

PRECAUTIONARY MEASURES

Those who choose to use GHB or related solvents may reduce the risk of overdose by taking precautionary measures:

- do not mix GHB/GBL/B with alcoholic beverages, sleeping pills or any prescription drugs in the benzodiazepines family, such as Xanax, Klonopin, Valium, Ativan, and Restoril; numerous deaths have been attributed to mixing these drugs
- do not assume that the right dose last time will be the right dose next time; concentrations vary from batch to batch; pre-measuring doses of known potency can reduce risk; avoid pouring from a container directly into a drink without measuring first
- allow more time to feel the effects; B-based solutions can take longer to hit you
- allow more time between doses; GBL and B remain in the body longer than GHB, and repetitive dosing will have a cumulative effect
- taking smaller doses can reduce the risk of overdose
- using the same supply might reduce the risk of getting different analogs with differing potencies, although this is not assured

Overdoses related to GHB and its analogs require careful observation by trained medical personnel and may require transport to a hospital. While some clubs and event promoters offer on-site medical assistance by volunteers as a service to their patrons, many do not. Emergency medical personnel are likely to transport patients who appear to be in a GHB-induced coma.

For these reasons and others, the Electric Dreams Foundation advises that, for their safety, patrons refrain from using GHB, GLB or B-based products at clubs and parties.

ADDITIONAL BACKGROUND

GHB was developed in 1961 as an anesthetic, but research in the U.S. was discontinued when the drug was found to have unwanted side effects. Throughout the 1980s, GHB was available at health food stores, most commonly used as a sleep aid or to enhance bodybuilding performance. Claims that GHB releases human growth hormone, however, are unsubstantiated.

In 1991, the FDA labeled GHB a ¡§dangerous drug¡¨ after receiving reports of adverse effects. Around 1998, manufacturers began distributing GBL and B-based products, which, at the time, were not banned. These products were sold as dietary supplements on the Internet under brand names such as Blue Nitro, RenewTrient, Revivarant, Enliven, and Serenity. Product labels can be misleading, cryptic or vague, sometimes referring to the active ingredient as ¡§2(3H)-Furanone di-hydro¡¨ or ¡§proprietary polyhydroxol complex.¡¨

Similarly, products based on B have been sold on the Internet as cleaning solvents under brand names such as Jet Clean, Pro-G, Thunder, and Mystic. The active ingredient may be labeled as butanediol, butane-1,4-diol, 1,4-butylene glycol, tetramethylene 1,4-diol 1,4-dihydroxybutane, 1,4-tetramethylene glycol, butylene glycol, or sucol-B.

Once ingested, GBL and B are converted into GHB. But GBL and B are metabolized differently. While GHB and GBL can take effect in 15 minutes or less, B usually takes longer to produce an effect, depending on body weight and how much food is in the stomach. The additional time involved can be anywhere from 15 to 45 minutes or more. Overdose may occur when someone who thinks they took ¡§G¡¨ actually took ¡§B¡¨ and, expecting to feel the effect in a short time, takes another dose.

There is no easy way to test a solvent-based drug to know which solvent is the active ingredient. GHB and GBL, in their most concentrated form, usually will not freeze if put in a household freezer. Any of the solvents will freeze, however, if diluted with enough water. Left standing, GHB and GBL solutions will separate, with the solvent settling to the bottom of the container. The liquid in the bottom of the container can be much more concentrated and, if ingested, produce a markedly stronger effect. Shaking the container will help to distribute the solvent more evenly in the container, and may reduce risk.

GHB is made by reacting GBL with water in a base of sodium hydroxide (lye) or potassium hydroxide. Sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide produce different concentrations of GHB. In controlled production, sodium-based GHB is about 10-15% stronger than potassium-based GHB. Uncontrolled production can result in a range of outcomes, some with potentially severe consequences. If the chemical reaction is incomplete, the final product may still contain lye, which can cause burning if swallowed.

Illegally manufactured GHB may contain contaminants such as heavy metals (e.g., lead), which can come from the equipment used to process the chemicals, or hydrochloric acid, which may be present in the pool cleaners, floor cleaners and industrial solvents that are used in the production of "G" products.

Undiluted, GHB has the consistency of syrup or cooking oil, although typically it is diluted with water. If diluted, the GHB may settle. GHB has been described as tasting somewhat ¡§salty.¡¨ GBL and B, in concentrated form, have a decidedly bitter taste.

Numerous cases of GHB, GBL, and B addiction have been documented, particularly where daily doses were taken as bodybuilding supplements or as a sleeping aid. In instances of GHB/GBL/B addiction, detoxification can be very serious and may require hospitalization. For more information about detoxification, see an article published in 2001 by the Texas Commission on Alcohol and Drug Abuse, available as a downloadable PDF file at http://www.tcada.state.tx.us/researc...ithdrawal.pdf. For additional information about safer partying, and for additional informational links, visit www.partysafe.org on the web, or email EDFoundation@aol.com.

Recent changes in the supply and patterns of use of GHB and related solvents prompted this advisory by the Electric Dreams Foundation, a non-profit organization that promotes health and safety in the gay club/party subculture. PartySafe.org is an outreach program of the Electric Dreams Foundation. MedEvent is a volunteer network of medical professionals whose work is supported by the Electric Dreams Foundation.

I do not understand how this is even a topic????

Isn’t talking about the drugs you do just a little bit of bad PR for the Greek community and your house in general? I believe I am correct that every house has a drug and alcohol policy and most of the posts here are violating these policies.

I mean anyone can see pretty much what school you go to, what house you are in, and what your name is.

I just do not understand.

how about this -

Let's say you go to a bar with some friends, and someone (non-greek) slips some "liquid E" into your best pal's glass. Now, this is most likely (near-)commercial grade GBL - wouldn't it help to know exactly what the drug effects etc are?

That said - here's a MSDS for GBL:
Material Safety Data Sheet for GBL

Thanks
 

Much better. :)

Maybe I do not understand being a non-drug user but, I do understand seeing the benifits of hearing what you need to look out for and what happens if someone slips something into your drink.


Thanks.

GHb as a growth hormone releaser is not exactly a myth but has been over rated. For some reason, people do get leaner when taking GHB regularly, but it might have more to do with sleeping better.

IT does increase growth hormone dramatically in the body, however, it also increases a hormone called prolactin that counter acts the growth hormone effect.

Curiously, after the big push to pull it off the market and make it ilegal a perscription version immediately came out.

The difference in price? What was 35 dollars now sells for about 1200 dollars and is not something your insurance will cover lol.

There is always an agenda.

Look you idiot, What I had mixed up before I left this weekend was the sodium and potassium ghb.......The chicks who posted in this thread were more off than what I was.


It's obvious you know very little about this stuff. If you don't have any important info to give, shut your mouth.

I was off about the salty flavor from the potassium ghb. That was it. It we start to criticize the girls in this thread about all their false information, they'll get all bent out of shape.

I really don't care if you believe the story about my friend or not. It freaked me out to see a friend in a coma for 5 days because of G...whether or not it was GBL or whatever is irrelevant. I don't like Librasoul22 anyhow. I shared something that is sometimes a regular thing that occurs to people I know. But what happened to that girl was no G hole....that b!tch was in a fuggin COMA......no G hole lasts 5 days.



As for rollin......people who say they've heard of people dying from rolling have some sort of bad info. First off, the people who die didn't take X.....they probably took one of it's imitators.....most likely sold as X from a cheap a$$ dealer. About the only thing that can happen to you is that you get a little too hot and sweat kinda bad if you're in a club. Naturally your body tells you when you need water and so you just get something to drink. Sure doctors and people in the medical field will tell you otherwise....but hell, the docotrs didn't even believe us when we told them that my friend had taken GHB. They let her sit in a coma for an extra two days before they took our advice and treated her as a GHB overdose patient. They said they ran tests but didn't find G in her system...despite us telling them. Finally they treated her for what we said and "amazingly" she came out of her coma. With that said, I have a hard time trusting doctors when it comes to drug problems.

I've had many experiences rollin, too many to count. I first took it when i was 16, in 96. In south florida it was real popular for the longest time. 97,98,99 and part of 2000 I was on my binges periodically. I don't see anything wrong with it except that it's a hard drug. In that I mean that it's not something you do carelessly, like weed. You can't roll ALL the time. You have to give your body a break. It does do a number on your immune system. I can't remember the last time I started dating a chick before we rolled together. In fact 3 of my friends are going through that same pre relationship test with their girls right now. Some people like it, some don't. It's kinda like weed......some peopel hate it, saying it makes them paranoid and how they think people are talking about them all the time. Other people love weed. If I had a drug of choice, rollin was it for a long time. The same went for my crew as well as the chicks who hung out with us. In one aspect it kinda sucked having huge rollin parties in Gainesville because many people knew about all the $hit we did, especially when some in our crew started failing NCAA drug tests and got suspended from football games. Phi Mu Nursie knows one particualr person whos a best friend of mine, who she had a class with and who got in a little trouble. Yet, i don't regret anything I've done.

As for the friend who said he can't mix unless he's rollin.....That dudes a crackhead.....Why? Because just about every type of electronic music sounds ok when you're blowing up ( Except drum and bass). He probaly thinks it sounds really well and the tracks are in sync, but odds are their not. Most superstar dj's will tell you it's insane to try to mix while doing X, coke and weed is a different story however.....

As you get older I wouldn't recommend rollin. It has it's time. Every once in awhile it's ok....I won't say the last time I did it, but this past weekend I ended up calling my now ex lady and broke up with her. I can't do that type of stuff when I drink because if we start fighting i become an asshole, doing something else makes it much easier and I'm really nice. Infact, I'm the nicest person you'll ever meet in that state. I'm always curteous, asking if everyones ok....seeing if anyone needs some water. Making sure people can drive ok. If people need a change of clothes, I give it to them. I always let people borrow money if they need it. If anyone has a particualr type of music they like, I play it for them instead of telling them to shut the phuck up. I'm the one who normally runs to the store at 6:00am for gatorade and smokes so that no one else has to drive. I think thats the reason why chicks want to date after we do that crapp together. When they first meet me they see this bad a$$ attitude, but atfer a night of fun pills they see there's a sweet and caring side as well. After that I'm busted and so I can't act like $hit don't phase me all the time. It's kinda wierd. Anyhow, I honestly believe the good and bad exp you have with rollin, or any drug for that matter, has to do with the enviroment you're in at the time and those around you. If it's not a comfortable enviroment and there are some people around you're not totally comfortable with, you might not have a good exp. I'm by no means telling peopel to go out and do this...but I am giving you one version of the whole rolling ordeal. I'm sure there are others who will disagree with me and tell you the exact opposite.

Actually, mine cover the hospital bill.........Then again I have really good health insurance.

Actually I know people who buy GBL and then convert it into GHB. GBL is some nasty stuff and easily puts you in the hole. I won't do it knowingly. I think thats used to date rape chikcs more than GHB.



Another thing I seen done.....people take a gallon of GHb, then boil it in a pot until most of the water is evaporated......makes it much more powerfull and you need very little to get where you want to be.

EXACTLY. Everyone is going to have a slightly different experience on the same drug depending on their environment.

Um...should I be getting defensive about this? :confused:

First of all, I have yet to post any info on GHB, GHL, NBC, CNN, MTV, whatever. Why? Because I have not, and will not, use it.

My post in this thread was an attempt to clear up misinformation going around. If you take the time to READ rather than floating around in your drug-induced stupor, perhaps you would see that it was James, not me, that said you were inaccurate. THANKS.

And as for taking what you say with a grain of salt, I will continue to do so. It is not like you have an awesome trackrecord with honesty, bud.

Also, KSig RC is the only one posting sources. I think ANYONE who questions the veracity of other's facts should at the very least post the sources of their own info.

I feel sorry for anyone who comes on here posting about how many times they have tried these drugs as if it is something to be revered, like old war stories or something. :rolleyes: Sad.

Ok look at what you're saying- you're basing your opinions on experience. I don't think there's anything wrong with that- that's exactly what I'm doing. But don't sit here and tell me that the people that died didn't take X.You said yourself that it can make you overheat, and that's exactly what happened to a girl I worked with. The people at the club saw her lie on the ground and cook herself to death. Obviously her parents wanted an autopsy and guess what was in her system? X. My logic is no different then yours, since you believe your friend od'd on GHB even though the doctors said it wasn't there.
When I had GHB or Special K (they didn't find traces of either but it was obviously one or the other) they told me I just got drunk. So I totally understand that doctors sometimes can get it wrong and you have to go by what you just 'sense'. But given that, all we can go on is what we've experienced. I don't see how you can guarantee that no one has died from X, only imitation X. I think that's a pretty big claim to make.