If it was that simple there wouldn't have been a perceived need to cheat in the first place.

And as I previously stated cheating and other issues are more common in predominantly poor districts across the country.

Districts can pretend it's an issue with the specific people involved and focus on criminal and professional sanctions. But, since these districts have histories of being horrible multitaskers, I hope they do some sanction but put the most emphasis on reducing the perceived need for cheating and other negative outcomes.

I don't think I denied that there was likely to be more cheating in districts with more poor kids, especially as in regard to basic proficiency tests.. When it comes to cheating across the board, I think it's as likely to happen anywhere. It might be more likely to happen with affluent kids because they have more resources to spend on it, like paying someone to take their SAT.

You can talk all you want about other outcomes, but you probably can't deliver much or people would be doing it. If there were better ways of doing things that ensured success in the districts we are talking about, why don't you think people have used them?

People across the country have done it and are doing it. It is relatively rare but not because those who can enact change are clueless about what can be done. It is a rarity for other reasons...but people want to concentrate on some cheaters. Either way, the biggest lesson for APS to learn from this is not that there are criminal and professional sanctions to hand out.

At this point, it's out of the district's hands. We're talking a state investigation and perhaps a federal fraud investigation with federal charges.

I think that's going to do wonders to cut down on cheating, both because corrupt district personnel have to worry about the ethical standards of the outside world but also because it will give teachers who never wanted to cheat a safe haven when they are being pressured to do so.

The Georgia cheating scandal has already caused testing procedures to be reviewed and in some cases changed, which I think will eliminate the opportunity for the relatively small percentage of teachers who might have tried to cheat just to make themselves look good or because they couldn't deal with good faith concern about what their relatively low test scores meant about their students' learning.

The big thing that I think you are ignoring is that the negative stakes in Atlanta were actually really low, except for the internal craziness in the district. Surrounding counties had a lot of Needs Improvement schools and the sky didn't fall. There didn't seem a big push for expensive transfers in district or without. There's was no big loss of funds. Sure, it was probably embarrassing, but as countless other schools and districts showed, ultimately other than the label, not much changed. As far as I know, we've yet to have a single school in Georgia even get "restructured."

All it should take to do away with the perceived need for cheating is for the district personnel quit scaring the hell out of people about scores that didn't really matter that much, except as they indicated student learning and secondarily resulted in a label that got you a gold star or black mark.

Show me. Link a few.

^^ This poster is trying to boost google rankings.

you can have Jesus come to a school at attempt to teach, but if it's not being reinforced at home with good parenting pushing academics, not much is gonna change.

I know. I recognize the MO. Trying to create those backlinks is hard work...and pricey.

So I take it you weren't out celebrating with the entire population of Sandy Springs when they succeeded in breaking away from the City of Atlanta?

I used to teach. Bringing in teachers from Cobb and other suburbs won't change Atlanta schools. Parents who begin to value education and make certain they pass that value on to their children by having them at school on time, every day, ready to learn and ready to cooperate with their child's teacher by supporting them far more than they do now.
That goes for any school district, anywhere in this country.

Social Studies will by necessity make a comeback in Cali. There is no other way to incorporate learning about all the important historical figures who were gay, which is a mandate just recently passed by the Cali legislature.

NOT a slam, anyone. But that's a fact.

There is unreal pressure on teachers in this state to produce great test scores. Even if your subject isn't being tested, you are pressured: from some school districts (Atlanta, I guess), there's obviously the push to get those scores, whatever it takes. From others, there's the pressure not to screw up the administration of the test. If a kid throws up on a test, there are actually instructions for how you gather up the messed up test (lest you give the puked on test to someone who hasn't seen one yet?) This is an "irregularity" and it can invalidate your whole class's results because now the rest of the class is supposed to be so grossed out that they can't possibly finish testing that day.

Other "irregularities" that got recorded at the last school I taught at: a bunch of ambulances screamed past the school, the dump truck came by and loudly picked up the trash outside one room, a girl got a fit of the giggles, one class was accidentally let out down the hall early, and someone used the copier in a room next to a testing class. It used to be that students wouldn't even notice something like that but the state is so tense about scores that there's a long list of potential irregularities that teachers have to read and watch out for. They have to watch a film about how not to have irregularities and are warned numerous times that their jobs might be on the line if they screw up, even if it's inadvertent.

The teachers were always basket cases by the end of the week. :(