That's OK. I still love ya, but mine was founded by a Saint. :p

Mine too! :D

Loyola?

Yes, but Hopwood was overturned in 2003; the 10% law was instituted in 1998-99 (I believe). So, why didn't the State legislature change the law when Hopwood was overturned? Clearly, someone is benefitting from that law.

Please don't think I pulled my statements out of a hat:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...z/5634400.html

This article states that black and hispanic enrollment at UT increased by an average of 30%.

http://www.utexas.edu/student/admiss...8-Report10.pdf

This one supports the assertion that the students who are admitted under the 10% deal actually do better. Who better than the actual university to determine how its students are faring?

I can tell that this may impact your kid, which might be why you're so against it. But, I've been involved in selective college admissions for a while--if I wasn't doing architecture as a career, that's what I'd be doing, and I might start doing it full-time within a few years--and we're extremely familiar with national trends, and not just state/regional ones. The Texas, Florida, and California responses to the removal of race-based affirmative action is a VERY hot topic, and one I feel completely qualified to discuss.

The plan may not be perfect, but it shouldn't be thrown out completely just because your kid may not be guaranteed entry to UT-Austin.

I doubt it will change anytime soon, so this back-and-forth may be a moot point.

Obviously, you and I will never agree and that's fine.

I, personally, feel that colleges benefit from having artists, musicians, athletes, mathmeticians, writers, etc. This is also believed by a vast majority of both public and private institutions. That is why they have Holistic Reviews when evaluating applications.

AND -

Actually, you're wrong in stating that the reason I'm so against it is because of my kid.

I was against it 5 years ago when my oldest was accepted to UT because of NMF status; I was against it 2 years ago when my middle son was accepted because of class rank (he was 1%); I will be against it when this son is (most likely) accepted because he will be top 10% (unless he completely caves this semester - his class rank will be set at the end of this, his junior year).

The reason I'm against it, as are a large percentage of Texas residents, is because we are against the idea that college admissions should be decided by ONE factor and one factor only - as I laid out in my novel on the last page. And, I feel strongly that it will hurt our state college system in the long wrong to be shackled by this law that does not allow for any discretion on the part of the admissions committees to look at anything other than rank.

If college admissions based solely on rank is such a fair and fantastic method of acceptance, then why don't all schools move to this? It would certainly speed up the process and make it much more economical - no need to read those pesky resumes or essays, no need to verify test scores.

What a waste of time - CLASS RANK is the only indicator of how a student will perform!

You know, another biproduct of this would be to put the evil College Board (who administers the SAT) out of business! No need for test scores anymore!!

Let's start a movement!!

CLASS RANK IS KING!

FORGET HOLISTIC REVIEWS!

THIS WILL SOLVE ALL THE ILLS OF THE APPLICATION PROCESS!

I bet the Ivies will jump right on board! What do you think?

But doesn't this analysis only work if every student outside of the top 10% is shut out? I mean, there's still a chance for them to be admitted, right? They just won't get the automatic acceptance that goes with being in the top 10%?

I just think there's a big difference between the rule limiting the amount of people who get admitted, and completely shutting everyone else out. Looking at your analysis, you don't make that distinction.

Thank you! I was just about to call BS on srmom claiming that the black & Hispanic enrollment hadn't increased since '97.


I'm just going to say that I am NOT referring to anyone here on GC, because I haven't seen these type of comments, but I (and many of my friends) have been hearing these things....so here I go.

I am soooo sorry that you don't think the Top 10% rule is inadequate for your situation. But i'm soo tired of hearing, "well if the students in your city can't pull the grades to compete with students in Austin/Dallas/Houston, then too bad, you have UTEP." UTEP is a good school, a great school but this isn't the fucking '60s. You keep referring to us going to UTEP, because you wanna keep us "stupid Mexicans" out of UT. I'm sorry that your son/daughter couldn't get into UT w/ the Top 10% and that he had some outrageous 10.0/4.0 scale. But to say that, "his/her spot probably got taken by some stupid kid in El Paso" doesn't make you look too bright. Me, along with the other El Paso students, deserve to have a good education. We should be given the option of being accepted at any state school and not be relegated to UTEP just because it's here.

Don't blame the Top 10% school, just say what you really feel. You want UT to be white-washed, and want all the minorities at the smaller state schools. God forbid that your son/daughter couldn't get into UT and had to go to UTEP. :rolleyes:

/end rant



I know that srmom and the others probably don't feel this way, but everytime I see the whole "my child has a 4.0 and still can't get in the top 10%" I remember these conversations.

I got this from a news article I was just reading from the LA Times and thought is was apropos to my view:

KSigkid - read this report put out by UT - it will explain the conundrum that UT is getting into. You ask if every student outside the top 10% could be shut out - the answer is Yes. That is why they are not having "summer admits" this year - they don't have room in the freshman class for those non-top 10% kids this year. They are projecting that by 2013 there will be NO spots at all for anyone out of the top 10%.

http://www.utexas.edu/president/spee...dInterest=1292

and epchick - I don't even know where to start with your post, honestly... as you so eloquently put - that you were going to call bs on my post, please read the above report. The quote I sited earlier comes directly from it.

I'm not trying to keep anyone out. I would hope that the people who get in have more to offer than just a rank.

Like I've said, one single soletary measure, in Texas's case RANK, should not be the entirety of a student's admissions criteria - there's just too much that goes into what would make a student an asset to a campus.

To quote from the report (for those who don't want to read it):

How's that for a diverse and interesting campus composit??

You know, I sometimes feel the same way when I hear those complaints. A lot of people, even mediocre students, feel like they're "owed" their state flagship, and if they don't get it--blame a minority! That seems to be what triggered the four major affirmative action lawsuits of our time.

Yeah, that's what it's all about. I want UT to be a white enclave of priviledged students from suburbia - You've all found me out:cool:

Forget all the other tripe I've posted, it's clearly just to cloud the argument from my real purpose - white supremacy

Thank Heavens I don't have to hide behind the mask of reasonableness and fair judgement that I've been wearing.

so glad to see you've read the entirety of my posts - snark.

Beating my head against the wall......:(

But no one is accusing you of feeling that way; did you see this part of epchick's post?

@ srmom - You shouldn't take this so personally - this isn't a cut and dry issue, and it's apparent from this thread that there are a variety of viewpoints on the issue.

LOL! Just putting me on blast! Yup, that was me.

Where were you?

I'm familiar with Mu Psi so I just assumed -- I'm from Georgetown :)

I've read your posts--clearly, you didn't read epchick's disclaimer in her post; otherwise, you would not have reacted in the manner in which you did.

I think it's time to give this one a rest. Obviously, you're personally invested in this. It's okay. Like KSigkid said, we all have different viewpoints on this issue. Based on our own regional and educational backgrounds, we all come at this from different angles.

it wasn't epchick's post that I was referring to.

but, you're right - I'm giving it a rest.