No it does not come down to biology. What you are talking about is APPEARANCE. TOTALLY DIFFERENT from biology which has a science basis. Appearance! You mean appearance! Once I understood that was what you meant I 'got' what you were saying. I just wish you understood that what you are discussing is NOT Biology or science (which are terms that I feel, unlike racism- or hell, any ism, have pretty standard definitions), but completely superficial judgement. Yes, people DO base judgements on appearance! You're correct! They do! But it's not biology!

LMAO! This is comedy!

Nevermind about the holistic healing.
Exquisite5, can we get a prayer chain going on?

As for AA... We wouldn't need it if groups were equally represented. But they're not! I personally see no problem at all with providing education to those that could not otherwise afford it.

Afterall, this is the United States. You're supposed to be judged on your own merit, not your parents or your community's.

Once you HAVE an education I begin to have a little trouble understanding it. It's so damned hard to get a job out of school... I don't care what color your skin is. I honestly think that after someone has proven themselves in school they should be able to be judged solely on their merit.

That's a big damned complicated issue... but since it's out in the open that's my $0.02

clarification on MY beliefs
 

People who think that me n' Honeykiss n' librasoul22 are some sort of pc gang really don't know anything about any of us! Our beliefs differ a great deal- but we really don't express them in front of you on racial topics on a regular basis. We discuss our opinions on the black community all the time, and believe me they are very very different for each of us. The effective segregation on GC btwn BGLO members/interests and other folks means that you just don't see us enough to know that.

I am much less liberal than both of them, lol.

And to clarify my issues with AA, let me state that I actually don't like it. I feel that AA is not a program that effectively reaches the people who need it's help the MOST- the kids in those broke ass public schools who have no prospects! Something like a third of the black community lives at or below the poverty line, but they are not the people who benefit from this policy! Upper middle class blacks with access to educational opportunities that approach parity with whites' benefit more than their poorer brethren.

I have a PROBLEM however with most AA detractors, because they don't have any ideas about how to CHANGE the policy. Get rid of it, and then what? The COMPLETE social stratification of our society along racial lines? IF you are going to propose getting rid of it, then tell me what we should put in its place. Until I see a better program developed, I will fight for this one, because as small of an opportunity it is, it's really the best one Black Americans have got.

I have a PROBLEM with white female detractors because they are the people who have benefited the MOST from this policy, not ethnic minorities. Yet I almost never hear anyone challenged on being hired for a position because they are female (unless they want to be a firefighter, which is actually a pretty valid worry)! It was a policy white women fought for until the moment they were perceived as approaching parity with men, and then it was ok to start bashing it. That's just wrong in MY opinion.

Folks, come with something better than "it's racist against white people" because quite frankly, I don't think it even BEGINS to redress the racial inequalities of our society! I was never one for the power definition of racism, but here I feel it is valid. How is it racist against whites when it ultimately does NOT A THING to change the status quo? The balance of power remains.

Tom, I am not trying to clown or flame you. I have an honest question.

Why is it that every time these topics are discusses, you take such HUGE exception to things posted by blacks? Maybe I haven't read enough of your posts, but I have yet to see you get so worked up at anyone who was not discussing these issues from an African-American community centered point of view.

I really don't think it's us. Most of us aren't radical at all, but just want it to be acknowleged that racism didn't just go away one day in the 60's and stop affecting black people!

Youa re an older person, and that probably informs a lot of your views. Maybe it's generational. But I honestly feel that it's starting to look like you are targeting anyone who disagrees with white people on this board, or are willing to argue their stance.

Once again, I am not trying to judge or be disrespectful (I was raised not to be like that with my elders, even on the net, lol) but I really think you should consider what I'm saying.

This thread is out of control. I don't understand the need to debate this issue. Racism exists. Affirmative action is flawed, but so far it is the best solution to compensate for past systematic exclusion and current inequality or disparity in education.

I think that an education is the best way to improve the quality of life for anyone regardless of race or gender. When I look at many of the public schools in NY and other cities, some are overcrowded and can't give students the individual contact that they need. Quite frankly some schools are downright dangerous. Many children in these schools don't even view college as an option. Until the powers that be can end the disparity in education at the primary and secondary levels, programs like affirmative action are necessary to level the playing field in college admissions unless or until they come up with a better policy.

Re: clarification on MY beliefs
 

A bit of an aside - not so much germane:

Where the in the world do schools pay for AP tests, or SAT prep? I went to a wildly successful magnet school, well-ranked nationwide as a top public school, and the best we got was 1/2 the test paid for and even that was dependent upon an A in the class. The rest of the public school system (one of the better-funded nationally) got a whopping zero. No paid-for SAT prep . . . maybe that's something that exists in other parts of the country? That would blow me away, that's a really poor appropriation of funds, considering the other options available.

Re: Re: clarification on MY beliefs
 

You would be surprised.

I was fortunate enough to attend a magnet school, Houston's M.E. DeBakey High School for Health Professions [also nationally ranked, a TEA Exemplary school, a National Blue Ribbon School and a New American High School]. I received FREE (well maybe like 20 bucks to cover supplies) Princeton Review. Since my school was a magnet school and had a different funding allocation than most HISD schools it was "rich" enough to have a $50,000 Owl-Link lab installed and to be on Owl-Link (a video internet connection with Rice University) so the Princeton Review class was taught there and simultaneously webcast at my school. We could interact with teacher and students at Rice and everything. Also, in my high school curriculum we were required to take a "SAT prep" class in tenth grade. It wasn't any brand name, but did help lead to my school having one of, if not the, highest SAT averages in the district.

As far as AP exams go, many suburban schools in Texas pay for them for the students. I don't know how, or what budget it comes from but I know that at least in suburbs of Houston and Dallas it occurs. If you want me to do research and actually find school names, I can and will. Something in my head is leaning me towards some schools in Plano ISD (a fairly well off Dallas suburb).

First off, Exquisite5, Lovelyivy, ^5. Ooops, better not have a public display of solidarity! ;)

Cream great post!

LOL!!! :D

Alright, fess up! What does that mean? It's like the fifth time I seen that tonight.

Thanks! Can I be endorsed by librasoul22 also? ;) :)

^5 = high five!! :)

High five?

I think this is a great thread - very informative from all sides/POV's. I, for one, am loving the dialoque between everyone.

OK, maybe not everyone... :eek: :rolleyes:

LOL! Careful! If you are endorsed by me, that makes you one of "US"! And if you are one of US your views must be indentical to OURS at all times! Unwavering solidarity is a must! ;)

Serenity, I am with you. Although this thread has sometimes gotten off the beaten path, a lot of it has been extremely valid. Even SOME of those I do not agree with have expressed thought-provoking arguments. They're just wrong, that's all. LOL, j/k!

For those of you who have thrown up your hands in frustration and started to see all the opinions that differ from yours as one lump of wrongness, you are doing yourself a disservice.

That being said,
^5's for Cream, KSig RC, Honeykiss1974, Lovelyivy84, Exquisite5, and even you Rudey! ;)

You know, if nothing else, we have ALL expanded our vocabulary to include prejudISM and prejudIST. See, this thread was not a waste after all!

Re: Re: Re: clarification on MY beliefs
 

Solid - I went to DM Central Academy, same concept, top-10 AP school . . .

Anyway - the "magnet school" funding I can live with - that's a top-up educational structure, rather than the quest for homogeny that many school districts tend to strive for. As far as paying for exams as a suburban thing I'd believe it, simply due to the higher amount of funding that they have. It's interesting to think that this might happen for one true 'public' school in a district, but not another, though - that would seem to me to be blatantly illegal, and somebody should just smash them on that. I can see the split between a school you test into, compared to the other schools in the district - but there shouldn't be any distinction between schools based purely on location . . . how sad.