Well thank you Tom. :)

You are more than very welcome!:cool:

Kuddos are due where they are due!:)

What's the difference between sororities and fraternities as far as "hazing" (how much and what type is "necessary")?

Theoretically, fraternities do more physical hazing and sororities do more mental hazing, but I think that's a crock, personally.

Sorority hazing (and girls hazing in general) has always seemed more.. mean to me. Caveat: I've never personally seen or experienced hazing in a sorority. I've seen some of the guys though and one fraternity did a fake scavenger hunt followed by the pledges getting doused in water and hit with water balloons. Some make them drink and such. But they never seem angry or hateful in the same way that girls seem to be.

This was just something I'd thought about

/This post does not approve hazing in any form.

After the disclaimer and example you gave, you still stuck with your assertation that sorority hazing (in general) seemed meaner? :confused:

I also disagree with that. Both do a combination of both.

But, I think people's generalizations about sorority versus fraternity hazing are based on what they perceive to be "the rule" (based on personal observation or something more in depth) versus what they perceive to be "exceptions to the rule."

I would say that if someone's telling you every day that you're ugly and not worth anything, that's way meaner than getting hit w/ a water balloon (and going home and drying yourself off and forgetting about it).

When my little sister's class was pledging, I remember one of the girls in that new member class telling me about how her best friend was pledging a sorority at her school and that her friend was complaining that she was always sore because the sisters made them do ridiculous amounts of push ups and sit ups as punishment. The girl started to get scared that we were going to make them do push ups as well. That was the first and so far only time in my life when I have heard of sororities ever doing anything physical.

This is your illustration and not the illustration provided by the poster I quoted. ;)

But, plenty of fraternity men can tell you of how they were called ugly (for being too pale, too dark, too skinny, blah blah blah), demeaned, or called worthless while they were pledging. Their masculinity and/or sexuality was questioned while being pledged or they were told to "prove" how much of a man they are by being willing to objectify women.

Many of these men may not perceive it or articulate it in the same way that women perceive and articulate their experiences, partially because of gendered context and socialized communication differences, but I think there's little qualitative or quantitative difference.

I've "seen and heard" it all regarding women and men pledging.

I didn't give an example of sorority hazing. To me, the stuff guys tend to do isn't MEAN. Water balloons are (while still hazing) not a big deal to me. I wouldn't throw a fuss if it happened to me.

Everything I've heard about sorority hazing suggests a different attitude on the part of the hazers. Male hazers don't seem to be angry at the pledges even if they yell. There's not the same amount of emotion involved. Female hazers act like they hate the pledges and are disgusted by them.

Perhaps it's just behavioral differences. But its simply my unoffical observation and opinion.

/your results may vary

I don't think it's the pledges that the women actually hate. They're taking their revenge for what was done to them. And girls tend to hold grudges, where guys just get over it. To quote one of the most famous hazing scenes ever from a movie: "I did it when I was a freshman, and you'll do it when you're seniors, but you're doing great. Now fry like bacon, you little freshman piggies. Fry!"

Exactly! And I just meant there seems to be so much real feeling in it. LIke they really want you to suffer.

As my friends and I say: Girls are mean. Guys will fight and get over it, girls work at bringing you down until the day you die.

And while sometimes this has its good uses.. its generally a negative reaction.

Obviously since the chapters that haze so bad haven't died out yet, there are positives from hazing pledges. The frats and sororites that have difficult pledge periods are known on campus, its not a big secret who hazes and who doesn't. Still rushees sign their bids to the "hard" frats and sororities time and time again... and once the hazing starts, they don't quit. Because of this, I believe that hazing is not as big of a deal as most of you are making it. I've read a lot of the "anti-hazing" comments, and honestly, but if you have no experience with it, how can you judge whether it is effective or not? Same goes with the hazing groups, it isn't fair for you to judge the chapters that do not haze. It is a matter of choice for the fraternity or sorority to make amongst themselves. It is their risk, and their organization on the line, meaning there's no purpose in fighting about it.