Well his name's out there so they should put him on the banned from membership roster. :D

It doesn't? I've never heard nor observed this before. :confused:

Take a look at cities like Compton, Inglewood, and Hawthorne, just to name a few in Los Angeles County (let alone the rest of the state).

Exactly. He didn't need to call out the other organization. He should of just focused his comments on the organization he was interested in.

Your location states that you're in SoCal...but did you grow up here? Do you live in the Los Angeles area? Hell I grew up in Alhambra...high concentration of both Latinos and Asians. I also lived in the city of Los Angeles....went to Horace Mann Jr. HS, the entire population of the school were Af-Am and Latinos....

Hell all my life my best friends have been Latinas

so I question this statement and say ITS WRONG!

Drawing any sort of large conclusions as to why a certain race or ethnicty joins a certain organization is very difficult to do, because you are bound to exclude some of the data you collect.

From personal experience, Asian American Greeks on the West Coast are VERY different than Asian Greeks everywhere else. This is probably due to Asian Americans having a bigger foothold in the communities and being more accepted.

Additionally, West Coast Asian American Greeks are generallymuch older than their East Coast (and rest of the country counterparts). The first organization founded outside of California (besides Rho Psi in 1916 at Cornell which has no collegiate members now), was my organization, Pi Delta Psi Fraternity, Inc., in 1994 in Binghamton, New York.

Moreover the reasons for creation are very different.

Pi Alpha Phi Fraternity was established in 1926 due to racial restrictions again Chinese Americans that prevented them from joining NIC orgs.
Sigma Phi Omega Sorority was established in 1949 as a haven for Japanese American women in response to the Anti-Japanese sentiment from WWII and following it.

My organization was established to unite various Asian cultures and provide a unifying voice and a haven for Asian American men.
Kappa Phi Lambda Sorority and other organizations established since the 1980's have generally followed this pattern of "Pan-Asian-ness", although it is interesting to note how South Asian American Greek orgs have developed their own niche as well.

While all of my brothers joined for different reasons, many joined because it promoted Asian culture and provided a Brotherhood that they needed.

There have been a few studies on Asian Americans in Greek orgs. One of the best is by Edith Wen-chu Chen which looks at Asian American women in White, Asian American, and Black sororities.

Her results show that the Asian American women in White sororities had no place to be comfortable or discuss their race/ethnicity - basically they had to conform.

Her results for Asian American women in Asian American sororities showed that it provided a haven where race and ethnicity issues could be discussed openly without fear of social ostricization.

Her results for the Asian American women in Black sororities showed that those women joined those organizations in order to transform how race is viewed in the U.S.

Note: She uses pseudonyms throughout the whole study, but uses real dates for Foundings, so it is clear which orgs are which.

Beta Tau: AKA
Pi Zeta Mu: DST
Gamma Phi Alpha: ZPhiB or SGRho (I can't remember)
Kappa Phi Kappa: SGRho or ZPhiB (I can't remember)

Grant it, this was done at UCLA, which is very different than East Coast schools. Her results show that all the Asian American women, except for one who was half Black half Asian, were in either ZPhiB or SGRho. Interviews with one member who was Filipina (and rejected) state:

"There was this social at the BT house, out in another part of town. And you had to dress up. They called it a tea but we didn't have any tea. (laughs) I stood out like a sore thumb. I was the only one who wasn't black. I was the only one. One thing happened that I kinda thought I was dog'd. I felt a little diss'd, like completely ignored. What happened was I was the first one to show up. And it turned out they gave prizes. And one of the door prizes was for the first person who showed up. They didn't give it to me. I didn't say anything. You know I wasn't like "Hey, wait a minute." But I think it would have been embarassing to give it to someone who wasn't black."

Karen then goes on to tell how she got rejected:

I got a letter in the mail a week after the tea saying "We regret to inform you..." But it was a real formal letter. And I assumed it was my G.P.A. But I ran into this girl, this woman who two days later came up to me. She was in BT. At the time I thought we were friends. And she was like "Karen, you know how it is, the voting process and everything. People just don't know you. And they have this impression of who you are because you're not Black". I think she said more than she was supposed to. Because another one of her sorority sisters was passing by and heard her and she was like, "Hilary, Hilary, come here." And that was it.

I think it's very interesting to see this. I in no way intend this to be a bash on a whole organization, because it clearly isn't. What I'm trying to show is that we all have preconceived notions of other races and ethnicities and stereotype them based on our experiences/beliefs. This episode just shows how one woman, who was Asian American, experience it when trying to join BT (AKA).

If anyone is interested in the study, it's REALLY good and well done. It's called "The Continuing Significance of Race: a Case Study of Asian American Women in White, Asian American, and African American Sororities"

Sorry for the long post!!

Latino Greeks were bigger at my school than the NPHC groups, for whatever reason. There were more Caribbean blacks than African-Americans, so most of them gravitated towards the Latino groups, since there seemed to be more cultural similarities with Latinos than with American blacks. This held true for my grad school too, but it was smack in the middle of a few large Latino neighborhoods. The Asian fraternities and sororities were even bigger at both places.

I think after high school, that kids of color will gravitate towards their own ethnic group--especially if they had to assimilate during high school. For a kid who was the only Black/Asian/Latino person in their grade, neighborhood, or social group growing up, it's seriously like being offered a drink of water after being in the desert for 18 years; this feeling is even stronger if the other kids of color have similar experience of never having black friends, being shunned by other Latinos, and such things like that. So, sometimes that explains how students of color seem to, in the words of white students, "self-segregate."

I don't intend to make any generalizations, but this was the experience of many of the students of color that I interacted with in college and graduate school. I had some of that same experience, but I ended up joining an NPC group for several reasons.

L.O.C.K.

Thanks for that, it sounds very interesting.

ETA: Do you have a link or a digital copy? I can't find it online and I'm not sure where to look on my school's Journal search.

Born and raised in Compton and have lived in Riverside, Tustin, Fullerton, Long Beach, Van Nuys, South Central LA, Los Feliz and currently Palos Verdes. I taught in LAUSD for 3 years before I became a college professor in Southern California.

If Blacks and Latinos were so familiar with each other in Southern California as your post implies, what accounts for all the racial tension in SoCal between these two groups? Black and Latinos in Spanish Harlem have never experienced the same type inter-racial conflicts that we have out here in California. Blacks and Latinos live side-by-side on the East Coast and in Chicago while in Los Angeles, usually what happens is that Blacks move when a sizable number of Latinos move in.

Even in Inglewood, there is almost a clear line between the Latino section (south of Century Blvd) and the predominantly Black section (north of Century Blvd). In Southern California more than Northern California, there are distinct pockets of Black folks and Latinos. Competition for low wage work is one issue that keeps these groups from unifying as does gangs based on racial identity. Sure, there are mixed groups but that is more the exception than the rule. Of course, with Black flight out of Southern California to the South, the few Blacks that do remain will have to interact with Latinos if they are to survive. I'm not basing my comments solely on personal observation but also on demographic statistics, incidents of hostility between the two groups and why so many Black folks initially refused to vote for Villaraigosa for mayor (when he was running against Hahn the first time). Blacks fear that with the growth of the Latino community that they will be pushed out. Just check out the message board on BlacknLA.com and see page after page of Black folks complaining about Latinos being favored over Blacks. I'm not weighing in on that debate but I can tell you everything between Blacks and Latinos in Southern California ain't peachy.

If you don't believe me: Google "tensions between blacks and Latinos in Los Angeles". You'll find page after page of articles about job competition, clashes over language and gang violence between the two groups.

PhDiva

Drolefille,

Oops! My bad, I didn't explain it well enough. I had trouble at first too when I first heard of it.

Go to ProQuest Database in your Library's Online Database List. You should see a tab for basic search. Then scroll down and click on Dissertations & Theses or ProQuest Digital Dissertations or something similar. Make sure it is checked, and then search.

If this doesn't work, look on your school library's website for Dissertation Databse International or something similar. Let me know if you get it!!!

Take Care,
Nate

You poor woman.

PhDiva,


I live and work in the area that you are writing about and I don't see it.

The century blvd "line" is of socio-economic area....meaning lower middle class and mid-middle class, at least that is the way that I see it.

People always move out of one area to another area when they are "movin' on up".

I also see you writing statistics, which *sometimes* don't reflect in the real world.

I am speaking from my experience and I have never been in nor witnessed this type of tension you are writing about.

Of course, my life experience is different from anyone else's on the planet. Oh, since I don't live in the city of LA, I didn't vote in the Mayoral elections, but from my understanding a lot of people had other issues with Villaraigosa and his agenda and I can see why people have/had those issues.

Thanks! I found it but now I have to decide if I'm just going to wait until I go to work or download it over dial up :p

Elephant Walk - :p C'mon Compton ain't bad compared to parts of South Central :)

Ms. Gwyn - We will have agree to disagree. :cool: I'm not dismissive of your personal experience because they are real and specific to you nor do I dismiss the statistics because they do reflect larger trends which may have been missed by individuals. You may have not experienced the tension but I know plenty of Latinos that have (esp. ones who were not from California). When I worked for LAUSD, there were times when I did some substitute teaching in predominantly Latino areas and I was met with racial epithets and outright hostility from some students and staff. I have personal experience too but I rely on the statistics because I can't assume everyone has experienced what I have.

There is a vast difference between Black/Latino coalitions on the west coast versus the east coast, however, which might account for more blacks joining Latino Greek organizations in that region. That was the point of my comment.

PhDiva

I think SoCal tensions have alot to do with the location, political climate, and history. SoCal, the entire Southwest for that matter, has had a history with discrimination against Latinos (Mexicans specifically), you also have to look at the proximity to the U.S.-Mexican border, which raises many issues including cultural assimilation (e.g. who is Really American?), I feel students are buying into the typical identity builder of making "the others", Latinos (Mexicans specifically being this other) and are raised with that thus joining a Latin Org will definitely not attract them.

I sometimes see this, I work with kids, and no surprise the Blacks kids sit together and the Latinos sit with one another, I work in a very conservative, segregated suburb, where issues like immigration are definitely debated heavily, I could only imagine that bordertowns have this at the forefront of their minds.

Miami has the same tension between African Americans and Hispanics.

I think its very humerous that there are Asian, and Latino "fraternities" now. What did they feel left out that we were not including them? HAHAHAHA. Im lucky we dont have this kind of discrace at my school.

Yeah.... the only "discrace" at your school is you. You are very "humerous" too. Question, is your mother also your aunt?

No, I am just lucky enough to go to a proper southern school where we dont allow those types of things to go on. My mom is not my aunt, but she would shoot buck shot in somone's eye for sayin it.

LONG LIVE DIXIE

So you don't want minorities in your fraternity but you think it's stupid for them to have their own?

The logic train went that way -> you missed it.

No, its just I find it highly ironic that they have their own organizations. Its just humerous is all im sayin.

Regarding redispot - backwards in name and thinking
 

Attention please!

Disregard all that you read from topsider. He's backwards in both thought and in his being. He's slightly retarded so, only a mixed melange of confused treatises and diatribes will flow from is stinking pie-hole. I'm going to forward two messages that he sent me earlier today so that folks can attempt to understand him.

You say "its very humerous that there are Asian, and Latino "fraternities" now." as if it's a new thing, but if you even bothered to read this thread, you'd note that several ethnic GLOs were established in the 1920s. As in around the time your grandparents were born.

Not to mention I go to a "proper" Southern school with FIFTY-THREE different Greek organizations, only 31 of which are IFC/Panhel.

You are lucky. I suspect the your "proper" Southern school would be embarrassed that it matriculated a student who doesn't know not to put a comma before and when only two nouns are conjoined, and who doesn't seem to know how to spell humorous, Im, dont, buckshot, someone's, and sayin. (If you're tryin' to sound Southern, at least make it sayin'.)

I know that my proper Southern education assumed that I had learned all of those things by 4th grade.

Joining GLO's and BGLO's
 

I don't think that tipsider belongs to any organization, so, to discuss anything with him, would only serve to waste your time. My organization was founded in 1906, and what was great and amazing about this is, that the process to form, create and make actual, an organization who's very genesis occurred at the turn of the century, when actually, black men would have been hanged for gathering in a group of two or more black men. I am happy to report that since the beginning of our fraternity, men of all occaisions, ethnogroups and races have been blessed to become members of our most amazing ALPHA PHI ALPHA Fraternity Incorporated. I have met and have gripped many a Bruh who happened not to be black, but they have been great Bruhs none the less. The fact is, that people join organizations for many different reasons, and they should join the organization that best fits them, their personalities, as long as they work once they get there.

Ignore the Fratty troll and it will go away. Move along, folks, nothing to see here.

Then he is perping as a Sig Ep.

But there may be some entertainment to be had. It's kind of like a cat playing with a mouse.

Yeah, my first thought was sockpuppet, but if he is, he's either a Sig Ep or did some good research.

Sorry, but it takes a whole lot more than ignorant and immature ravings to get my panties in a wad -- at least it would if I wore panties. I was just having fun at your bargain basement-priced expense.

But now I'll join the ranks of those ignoring you. As easy a mark as you are to ridicule, your own posts are ridiculous enough that any further comment on my part would be superfluous.

Wow, Im getting advice from a dude in a music fraternity! Tell me, do y'all haze? Whats pledgship like? Im just dying to know. Do you tailgate? What do you wear to football games? Does your white trash family have to take out student loans to help pay for college? Just stop before you further embarass yourself.

I have been called ignorant before, and let me tell you something, I am not ignorant, I am racist. There is a difference. Or as we like to say where Im from, We are not racist, we just know whats right.

Why is this kind of speech allowed on GC?

Ignoring the ignorant
 

To all who subscribe,

It would be great if the Forum Administrator would take care of the type of post that topsider is sending, but, in case that doesn't happen, all everyone should do, is place him on their ignore list.

But Mystic, he's such an easy easy target. I mean, once I figure out if I'm a minority or a "fraternity fag."

Interesting how many posts are in this thread by new posters though.

akdphi cherry, idiots get on message boards all the time. This one's probably crossed the line enough to get the posts deleted, but rest assured in the knowledge that he's a "frat boy" and not a fraternity brother. I won't believe he's a Sig Ep unless one of the well known members confirms it.

7thSon, welcome to GC and all, but you're a little new here to be giving advice. Let us play with the troll for he is stupid. If the thread gets deleted there's nothing lost but time I would have wasted anyway :D

God y'all are so stupid. Get a grip, you take me too seriously. And, obviously, you take yourselves too seriously. But I stand by what I said. I will not retract my comments. I am a SigEp, I will even give you my roll number of initiation. But wait, why do I have to prove anything to minorities? Thats right I dont, because clearly we (southern whites) are better. Have fun remaing in the second class. Now if y'all will excuse me I have to be at the CC for a xmas party

Just seems weird to me, but then I guess GC is a lot larger than the forums where I normally post. We may be a little un-PC there but we'd wipe the floor with anyone who spoke like that.

Believe me, I'm not letting THAT one color my opinion of SigEp.

I think it's just a bit of a slow day.

Seriously though, must be a puppet, he's crossed a crazy line.

/My GLO is older than Sig Ep so nyah

As to why I'm posting in this topic as a new member of GC, it's because I've been lurking a lot, learning a lot about the differences between my GLO and the social GLOs, and I really want to help bridge some understanding about the differences since I think there are a lot of people on both sides who don't know.

That and I can't resist a troll who makes it personal.

Edit: Oh! And you're a fellow Greek Firefly fan, eh? ;D

Yeah, like Drolefille said, sometimes it's just a lot more fun to laugh at the crazies. See, that way, what they have to say actually has some value -- entertainment value, but value nonetheless.

So is mine . . . even if it is just a music fraternity. :rolleyes:

Troll Be Gone, apply directly to the head...

Troll Be Gone, apply directly to the head...

Troll Be Gone, apply directly to the head...

No, you mean your Klan party...

Why do you care who gets into what fraternity or sorority? Aren't you in the right one originally?

Remember, there plenty of GC'ers here who are a lot older than you that have different experiences that you... I mean if you call hazing "circle jerking"... Or if your fraternity brothers alcohol induce themselves into oblivion... Or if the only way you can have sex is by raping an unsuspecting freshMAN... Whatever...

Guess you are showing us what a true man of Sigma Epsilon is like at your university. And don't tell you are in the SEC and are a Florida Gator... Because we would have to hear your moans and groans when you get your assets handed to you on a platter in the Fiesta Bowl...

Maybe Macallan or Shinerbock can enlighten you on how they handle their "proclivities" on GC. I would highly recommend you contact them by Private Messaging, if you can figure that out...

But I must say I do appreciate you blatantly exclaiming to us that you are a bigot. At least we get all that out of the way and go for the jugular.

Why are you here?

Why do you exist outside the fact that your mother and father had sex and wasted air on birthing you?