It sounds like you are excusing them to a certain extent because "they didn't invent hazing". If so, that reasoning is faulty. Serial killers didn't invent murder, they aren't the first to kill neither will they be the last to kill- so do you suggest that they not suffer the harsh consequences of their actions?

No. Im just saying that those boys are getting what they deserve. Thoses boys arent the devil. They are just like my cousins or any other person caught up in foolishness. The problems go a lot higher than them. The system is flawed and it is nice to make changes but I think the changes need to start top down not bottom up.

:confused:

Are you saying that you know how everyone's MIP is structured?

Me too. :confused:

Hold the phone.....I am sooooo sorry. I thought that those guys have been tried and found guilty. All of this stuff is alleged.

did not know this

*smh*

Me three. :confused:

Well
 

I agree with teena in a way when she said that she hates to see college students with potential get caught up in something like this! I do to!

Most people made undergrad know how things go down on their campuses. People are still hazing all over the place and in many of the cases the're still going over board! Justice can not be served in every single case of hazing so FAMU and the authorities are choosing to make sure that justice is served this time. Is it Fair? Perhaps not entirely.......because so many others have gotten away with going overboard.

Then again what is going overboard? We all know that overboard has already been defined by all of NPHC's national directors but different chapters expect different things of potential members Alpha Xi is probably the most popular undergraduate chapter of Kappa after the Alpha chapter in Indiana not excusing thier behavior but that may be part of the reason why they were taking things to such an extreme. Probably trying to make people drop.....Im not saying its right or wrong Im just calling it like it is!!!!

Right! I am saying that MIP is just one more symptom of the overall entitlement mentality of society.

True!

Don't push it.

i know i am late on this, but i just wanted to respond by saying that we KNOW that it is indeed a sad day when the gospel choir hazes...when a PROFESSIONAL organization hazes... this to me is only indicative that hazing has become a culture unto itself... and that is quite dangerous when we consider the harm that it does to people and the litigious society that we now live in; people are becoming extremely intolerant with this foolishness.

just to underscore what i just said, i think that when NON-greeks (i.e., a modeling troupe) is hazing and wearing line jackets harder than the greeks, it only shows how the culture of hazing has proliferated. i went to a predominantly white school and there were TONS of little black groups that hazed hard, strolled, wore jackets, had signs, calls... it's a culture and some people just want to be down with somebody's clique...
i never mean to blame a victim, but ten to one, these people getting on these UNDERGROUND lines, trying to pledge when they know FULL WELL that pledging was no more back in the earlier part of last decade, have to take some responsibility, too. i mean, nobody wants to be paper (a whole 'nother discussion), everybody wants to pledge (the motivations for that are also a whole 'nother conversation), but if people are going to do this, they have to know when to say when... personally, i love Sigma Gamma Rho with all my heart, but i would have gladly forfeited every one of her letters if it jeopardized my life or put me at risk to be maimed or something crazy like that. making it into the org is great, and whatever means you feel are worthwhile to pursue membership are many times a personal decision, but it ain't worth your life or your dignity. it's serious, but it's not that serious.

just like there is something skewed about the mindset of the people who perpetuate this foolishness, we also need to question the vantage point of those who will risk their lives in the name of joining an org. it's really a sad state of affairs.

I'm not pushing anything. I simply wanted a better understanding of what you had posted. Nothing more, nothing less. ;)

I'll PM you my response...

Gotcha. :cool:

Are they members????
 

Question....did the boys ever cross that were online or are they just SOL right now? Are they members of Kappa Alpha Psi?

Re: Are they members????
 

From what I've been told they've all been black listed. Via my advisor who is a journalist.

thanks for the response. my cousin was one of the young men online and i havent heard from him. I wanted to know the details before i tried to call him. I feel so bad, he wanted this for so long and now this. Craziness!

To delta_heaven...
 

Please introduce yourself here...

http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showth...=&pagenumber=1

Carry on with the thread!:)

Follow up on the victim's condition (BV)
 

What I think is really, really jacked up is that FAMU took action against the Fraternity and the boys involved before any guilt had been adjudicated. I heard that the fraternity is off the yard for 7 years. That has GOTS to be illegal.

What if the allegations were bogus?

Not to hijack your thread or group but to give a heads up:
this thread is also over in Hazing section.

As at least one posting here has indicated, hazing is not in any one sigular group, it is within us all.

Sad to say.

Now what? Should they be back on the yard?
 

Mistrial Declared in FAMU Hazing Trial
TALLAHASSEE, FL (AP) -- A judge declared a mistrial Monday in the hazing trial of five Florida A&M University fraternity members
after the jury said it was perplexed by an undefined legal term and unable to reach a verdict.

The trial would have been the first to test a new state law that makes hazing a felony if it results in death or "serious bodily injury," but the law does not define the latter term.

Jurors deliberated for more than three hours, but the mistrial was declared about 20 minutes after they sent a note to Circuit Judge Kathleen Dekker asking for a more substantial definition of serious bodily injury. The jurors also asked how to distinguish between serious and moderate injury. She told the jury there was no further legal instruction.

"That is a very serious legal term and it has been defined in other statutes and yet for whatever reason it's not defined in this one," said defense lawyer Chuck Hobbs.

Dekker had instructed the six-member jury it means injury that is neither slight nor moderate.

Four Kappa Alpha Psi brothers were charged with using canes, boxing gloves and bare fists to beat aspiring fraternity member Marcus Jones, 20.

The Decatur, Ga.-native said he was beaten so severely over four nights of an initiation ritual that he suffered a broken ear drum and needed surgery on his buttocks.

The fifth defendant was accused of assisting in the alleged hazing by encouraging Jones and other would-be fraternity members to bear up under the beatings and revived them with water when they passed out from the pain.

The defendants accused of striking Jones are Michael Morton, 23, of Fort Lauderdale; Brian Bowman, 23, of Oakland, Calif.; Cory Gray, 22, of Montgomery, Ala., and Marcus Hughes, 21, of Fort Lauderdale. Jason Harris, 25, of Jacksonville, was accused of assisting them.

"This was no accident. This was no joke. This was not playtime at the frat house," Assistant State Attorney Frank Allman said in his closing argument. "This was intentional. This was dangerous."

Allman bypassed reporters by leaving the courtroom through a back door after the mistrial was declared. A telephone message left with the state attorney's office after hours was not immediately returned.

Florida's 2005 hazing law makes it a third degree felony, with penalties ranging from probation to five years in prison. The defendants were charged only with the felony so the jury could not convict them of a misdemeanor hazing charge.

The university has suspended the defendants pending the outcome of the criminal case. It also has suspended the fraternity until 2013 regardless of the outcome.

2 Members Sentenced to 2 Years in Prison
 

Jason Harris and Michael Morton, two members of the Alpha Xi chapter of Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity at Florida A&M University, were each sentenced to two years in prison this evening by Circuit Judge Kathleen Dekker.Jason Harris and Michael Morton, two members of the Alpha Xi chapter of Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity at Florida A&M University, were each sentenced to two years in prison this evening by Circuit Judge Kathleen Dekker.

It is the first sentencing under a new, stiffer Florida law on hazing that results in injuries.


"I hope it stops here," Dekker said. " I hope the message sent to your brothers is that this no hazing stuff is real."

Already suspended from FAMU, they faced up to a maximum of five years in prison.

"I hope somebody out there says these two guys got two years, it's just not worth it."
The hearing, which lasted four hours, was filled with emotional testimony from professors, family members, ministers and former university presidents, who pleaded for leniency. The crowd overflowed the courtroom.

Jurors in December found Harris and Morton guilty of hazing but deadlocked on three more Kappa Alpha Psi members also facing hazing charges. Those men, Brian K. Bowman, 23; Cory A. Gray, 23; and Marcus B. Hughes, 21, will be tried again in March.

The five were arrested April 10 after Marcus Jones, a former sophomore at Florida A&M University, said he was beaten during a series of Alpha Xi initiation sessions.


http://www.tdo.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art...NEWS/701290337


This is so incredibly sad.

Well.. a message has been sent..

yeah, but will it be received?

Per my young Kappa colleague (right out of college) , a few minutes ago, probably not.

:( :confused:

I doubt it

Hopefully, some good can come out of this situation, we need MORE education for ALL -old heads, graduates, undergraduates and prospective members.

i coudl really spill the beans on this whole issue,but its behind me now.

at FAMU a certain line pledged over a weekend, no joke. 1 weekend

weekend
 

how many ladies were on line? does that certain organization have a cap of 50 per line at famu?

Hello Everybody,
My neice is interested in one of the greek lines....should I be worried? Should I tell her to wait for grad??

She'll figure out what's best for her on her own.

I agree that hazing and greek culture at FAMU has def spiraled out of control. There def isn't much distinction from D9 and other BGLOs on the surface with jackets/calls/ hand signs etc.
In addition, I wanted to correct NUPE4life on the KY "sweethearts". The name is Kappa Psi Psi Healthcare Sorority, Inc now. Yes, they were essentially founded in 1977 as a "sweetheart" organization, but that is no longer the case.