Do you ever think that your kids might grow up with hard feelings against you for putting so much pressure on them? Getting into an Ivy isn't the be all end all of the world. And NO, you do not need all of those things to get into a top school.

Kids aren't allowed to be kids and have fun anymore... and so many of them are just pressured to do everything under the son to get into the "best" school (and best is always subjective), not the school that is right for them and that will do the most for them personally and professionally.

I agree. My HS had it and the kids who were in the program ALWAYS looked very worn out. I honestly don't think they fared any better than those of us who were in Double Honors (the track below IB) and took AP classes.

Some of the schools around here are grumbling about that loss of tuition money and may start charging for the credits anyway.

There was no AP when I was in highschool. We had CLEP tests that we could take to get credits but we did have to pay for the credits. I could have "CLEPed out" of several classes, but why not take the required university class, which was usually an easy A and beef up the GPA before getting into those tougher classes for your Major?

ETA: I just checked out the course offerings for my kids when they reach highschool. The 12th grade AP literature class has them reading all the books I read for 10th grade honors english. I guess that's why "they" considered my school district a good one.
Anyway, I am sad that my daughter will face the same issue that I did in highschool. There are so many really interesting classes, but you have to get your 4 core + language in, leaving no room for those awesome sounding electives (like philosophy, psychology and economics). And, she's currently in band, so that would be her 6th hour. I wish they would make the school day a little longer.

My HS did not have AP or IB -- and I STILL placed out of math and freshman writing classes in college (and a year in Germany as an exchange student AFTER graduation helped me place out of the language requirements even 5 years later!). We had honors classes, but not a formal program like AP or IB. Now keep in mind, not everyone took honors classes (there was a progression to them), however in my graduating class the top 50% of the class had above a 3.0.

The point being the school really does not have to be a part of the AP or IB programs to have something similar on a more local level - and still have kids get into Ivy League schools.

Sarah

P.S. Alum, what the heck is a Tier One school? What are your criteria for such an elitst snob list?

Pretty much.

Everyone knows what the tiers are for schools.

It's not elitist.

All schools are not made the same.

-Rudey
--You should accept that now

Some of us want to go to better schools, get better jobs, go to better grad schools, drive better cars, live in better houses, and have our kids do the same.

You chose to go to your school and can choose the same for your kids and others have the right to choose for themselves.

-Rudey

Aren't there actual tiers in law schools?

There are tiers for every kind of school:
http://www.google.com/search?q=schoo...en-US:official

-Rudey

Why do people always jump to hate on Alum? It's like one person hates them, so then the others will try and follow suit to hate her too.

Jealousy's a bitch

Because women attack in packs?

-Rudey
--Like wolves.

You know what else is a bitch? Debutanting a girl who had just been debutanted 15 minutes ago.

Whats the difference between that and a sweet sixteen?

Sure. I'm not going to be sexist and say only boys can debutant a girl. Girls can debutant a guy as well. Anyone can debutantize anyone.

I did IB.. my high school had a very limited selection of AP classes, so I went IB. AP was considered 2nd rate at my school, but we were told that we could take the AP exam after taking the IB equivalent.

A followup to my post from the other IB thread....

Many of my students who graduated from IB, and went to UF...actually FLUNKED OUT!

Victims of being "away from Mommy & Daddy."

Nonetheless, I still don't understand why a kid would want to zip through college faster than 4 years. The real world is for the rest of your life (as we all know)...!

Some guy I went to high school with finished his BA in three years, and he worked 30 hours a week. He was very ambitious, but I know for a fact he had no life and no fun during those three years.

An observation: I teach Spanish at a local college and have noticed this: kids who go to my children's high school who took 3-4 years of h.s. Spanish and take the placement test usually end up in the 3rd or 4th semester of our (demanding) Spanish classes. If they go through AP and take the test, all they end up in is second semester. The AP teacher actually advises their students not to take the AP test, to just take a placement test when they get to college.

AGDee, I'm with you on the electives. My children rarely have any room for electives, whether they take the CPA or CP track.

Two of my daughters took Accel, a Georgia program in which high school seniors can attend college classes. BlazerCheer was tired of high school and did all college classes and the other took all but science at college. Both entered college as sophomores with all the boring core classes out of the way (and with great GPAs). They've been able to take lots of courses at their universities that they really wanted to as a result...i.e., my daughter who's a horse science major was able to take horse courses from her first semester there instead of waiting for a year.

I did IB, but some of the AP courses as well. I'm glad I did IB, because not all of the AP classes I would have wanted to take were available in my high school. I don't think my workload was any heavier than my friends who just did Honors.

I COULD have taken a year's worth of credit, but I enjoyed college way too much to rush through. One of my sorority sister's took her year of credit, but got her Master's degree in one year--so she was still in Providence for four years.

I joined IB in the 10th grade (so I could be in the same school with my sister who is a year younger), and I received the diploma. I took about 5 of the AP tests, and all of the IB ones. I chose IB becaues it was the closest I could get to a European education (which, up until the tertiary level of schooling, is generally superior an American one). I had 42 credit hours by the time I started college. I graduated with a dual major and a minor a semester early. I would definitely say that IB prepares students very well for college, if for no other reason than you learn how to write essays very well (it's not all multiple choice based like AP tends to be).

If you want more information, feel free to PM me.

Yes and I met a real bitch from Wisconsin this weekend who did not think I went to a good enough law school to be worth talking to. I'll have that hussy know I got into several first tier schools.

Anyway, on the subject of APs, I took eight. At my high school they weren't weighted so an A in AP Calc was equal to an A in Geometry or whatever. I got an award from them too (I think the "with Distinction" one) and I really liked them because they were actually interesting, there were fewer stupid people in my classes, and it got me out of a lot of stupid pre-req/core classes in college.

Whats wrong with going to Cooley?

A lot, which is why I don't go there.

I totally agree. In all of my AP classes, our exams were in the same format as the AP exam, so that we would get practice in doing the multiple choice and essays. But you're right, you can't teach someone for the European History test, they have to develop those critical thinking skills.

My high school had AP and a rival school had IB. We always looked down on them because of it.

UK gives credit for AP and IB courses... are other schools not that way?

My brother was a member of the first class of students to go through the IB Program at our high school.

There are plusses and minuses to the program.

I'll start with the plusses.

First, and most importantly, you will absolutely get a first-class education with this program. There is no disputing the quality of education it will give you.

Secondly, it will make college workloads less of a shock, as IB is very very very rigorous and intense in the workload.

Also, there are the intangible benefits of being in the best program that the school has to offer.

Plus, it looks great on a college resume.

Now, the minuses.

First of all, this one may not apply to your school. At my school, when the principal went to say he wanted to bring the IB program to the school, other principals objected, because they did not want to lose their best students to us, knowing that they would leave to do the program.

This resulted in our school weighting AP and IB classes the same. However, IB is much harder. Thus, your grade may drop some in IB, and the GPA will drop, too, as it is weighted the same as AP classes.

And, as we all know, colleges are rated on how many students they bring in who are in the top 10 percent of their graduating class. This means that IB students may be out of that category due to the grade slip associated with such hard courses.

This is all a matter of politics. The local schools didn't want to lose their best students. The colleges care about ratings. Basically, even though you get the bes education in IB, you may not get into the best schools.

We have AP kids going to places like Georgetown, Boston, Northwestern, even a few going to Stanford or Harvard. The IB kids are going to Elizabethtown, Drexel, Maryland, Elon, JMU, and a few others.

Now, let's throw another wrench into the equation. The schools the IB kids get into are not big name ivy leaguers. However, they are great small schools, and the IB kids get into the best programs. My brother is one of only 18 people from this country in the International Business program at Elizabethtown.

So, IB will help you regardless of a grade weighting situation if you want to go to a great small school that cares more about great education, small class sizes, and good interaction between professors and students than they do about ratings. The ivy-league schools are huge, and the students are just numbers.

However, if your school weights IB higher than AP in the GPA system, it is all a non-issue.

If they're weighted the same, then you want to think about what you (or your kid) wants to study, and what kind of school they want before you make the final decision.

One other minus is that there is immense work. IB kids are known to come home, say hi to everybody, go to the desk, plop down, and spend all evening toiling away at their work, breaking only for dinner. There is an average at our school of 2-5 hours of homework per night. Sometimes, however, big projects coincide with each other, and students end up pulling all-nighters to keep up.

Basically, you need to think about where you want to go after high school, and how the IB program grades are weighted. That would be the basis of your decision of whether or not to participate in the IB Program. However, as I said, there is no denying the quality of education.

One last thing to consider: AP classes teach you facts. You hear the facts and learn the formulas, etc. The IB Program will truly teach you to think. You will learn to critically think and analyze, instead of just memorizing the details and writing them down on the test.