If a house doesn't make quota OR is not at campus total, NPC regulations allow for COB. The school can't prevent it, as far as I know. And I know a lot about NPC regs.

Look at it this way, too - do you see anything in this house that appeals to you? Do you feel that you could make a positive impact on the chapter and be a force for positive change? If so, it might be worth accepting a bid from them.

Yeah I know but I have already been cut from 2, and might get cut again tommorrow. So the only one I would have for pref is doug.

If I were you, I wouldn't worry too much about why everyone else is at a party or parties. Everyone else won't be making the decision that's right for you. At the very least, I say if you get the invitations, stick it out til Pref. Maybe Doug sees something right now that you don't. At any rate, I would say it's not something to worry about until you see the invitations, anyway.

Like I said, though, I would at least stay with it until after Pref. I was cut from ALL sororities on my campus during recruitment during the FIRST round of invites. I would've been happy at any of the chapters, so I don't understand people who get invitations and drop out, anyway, at least without giving all the chapters a fair shake. Luckily, I found my home, and with any luck, you will, too! :)

I totally understand where u are coming from. It is not what the other girls are saying that is influencing me. I felt like they wanted me because I am a minority and I didn't really like that. Plus I just didn't feel that good a connection with the girls. They seemed like they were intimidated by me, and some seemed totally disinterested. So I'm confused. I did plan on going to Pref night. I don't want to just drop out. But I have my heart set on PepperAnn, so if I don't get it I don't wont to settle for 3rd out of 4. Doesn't seem like a good idea, since it is a lifelong deal. If anything I would want to go thru again and hopefully get one I really love.

OK, they do conduct COB at SHSU. I just checked our chapter's website there and they had new members for Spring '05, which means COB does happen.

There is no rule that I know of that says you need to list all four houses. If you honestly feel that PepperAnn is still the best house for you, then put PepperAnn first on your Bid Card, then Lizzie, then Doug. At a small school (or with a small Greek system), you could still be on PepperAnn & Lizzie's Bid List, just not on the top - and their first choices might choose someone else.

It's a somewhat complicated system that is used to determine actual bids, but I've seen some VERY strange things happen at Bid Matching!! The one thing you do not want to do is to put a sorority on your Bid Card which you absolutely do not want any part of. You can also note on a Bid Card that you would be open to COB. There won't be a space for that, per se, but it will show your openness.

Keep your chin up! The chapter I used to advise gets roughly half of their sisters through COB (which amazes me, since my chapter was so perfectly awful at it!!); COB just might release some of the "rush tension", on both you and the chapters!

I second Honeychile. I participated in bid matching for my school for several years, and she is right, strange things CAN and do happen during that process! List all of your choices in order of preference, regardless of whether you attended the preference party or not. To reiterate Honeychile...if you know you do not want a bid from a particular group - DO NOT list them on your bid card!!

I am sorry you are so stressed about your rush experience so far.

I went to a prodominetly white school and when we had minorities rushing everyone got excited because we all wanted moire diversity within our chapters. To some it may have come off as liking someone for their race, but I can assure you no chapter will invite someone based on that!
I remember one girl that went through formal and she preffed my house and two others but she told us at pref that she could only see herself in our chapter or one of the others because we were so cool with her.. apparently some of the other chapters were so excited she felt like they only liked her because she was a minority. She pledged the other house but remained friends with many of our sisters. I still wish she had gone AGD- she was so fun and sweet. But never did it occur to us to be excited about her because of her race, we were excited she came back because she was freaking awesome! She deactivated from the other chapter within two years.

But if I was cut doesn't that mean I can't put that sorority on my bid card. Pref isn't until tommorrow.

You can put whoever you want on your pref card. That, however, doesn't guarantee that you'll get a bid from them.

I thought you could only rank those that hadn't cut u. I'm confused. So I could just not put doug down and rank the other 2. Then possible still get a bid even though they cut me? That seems odd. And then if I don't get a bid what happens? Can I go thru again?

You can definitely go through again if you don't get a bid. Also, not all sororities are at total or quota at the end of formal, so you might end up on their COB (informal recruitment) list! Best of luck though! :)

p.s. which Lizzie cartoon character are you referring to? Elizabeth (Liz/Lizzie) Patterson from For Better or For Worse?

As I said, it's a confusing system to someone who has never done it. You can list EVERY sorority, if you'd like. You can list only ONE sorority, if you'd like (but that's highly discouraged). You can list any number in between - but be sure to rank them in the order that you want to join them. Obviously, if you have ANY chemistry with Doug, I'd put them down, but maybe as third.

The sororities will be doing the same thing. Let's say that Lily, Rose, Violet, and Daisy are "THE" most popular PNMs. They may be at the very top of PepperAnn & Lizzie's bid list - so, whichever sorority they rank as their first choice, they'll get. BUT!! What if both PepperAnn & Lizzie do something so horrifying at Pref that Lily, Rose, Violet, and Daisy are grossed out by them? They may put Braveface or Doug as their first choice - which opens four slots in PepperAnn & Lizzie's bid lists! Now, let's say that, after the original Quota Bid List, you're the next one ranked by PepperAnn or Lizzie. Then, YOU would be the next person open to receive a bid from them - IF you have them ranked!

In a nutshell, what I'm saying is that there's no harm in trying. You may end up with Doug after all, or with Lizzie. But you'll never know unless you try. And again, with such a small system, I'd seriously jot that you're interested in COB on your Bid Card. I'd be shocked if all four sororities make Quota, and that one little statement will be a major step up for you. Sometimes, sororities are a little shy about contacting someone who didn't accept a bid, but saying that you'd consider COB will show that you're very approachable!

Edited to add: If I've given misinformation, for heaven's sake, somebody PLEASE explain it differently!! I do NOT want to mislead or misguide sILMIL20!!!

I would suggest discussing this with your recruitment counselor first. Some systems have rules about who PNMs can list on their pref card. I saw one girl put her first choice down, and then put another choice that was a party that she did not attend. I don't think she got her first choice or her second one either.

I think all of this depends on the school, and I would highly recommend asking first what the constraints are so that you adhere to the rules that have been established.

Having said all that - best wishes!!

I'm a little confused, sILMil20, have you been cut by PepperAnne yet or is all this worry just based on specualtion...wait until the dominos fall before you kill yourself over it (not literally, of course!!). No matter what, go to all of the pref parties you are invited to...THEN make the decision to sing a bid card or not sign one.

Goodluck!

Amen to that!! Our school ALWAYS tells PNM's to list all the sororities in order - they don't bother telling them the whole year obligation thing! We are really trying to work on that with panhell.

It is a hard process to figure out - but we have had people on our bid list that were both released by us in earlier rounds and people who regretted us in earlier rounds!

You should talk to your GREEK LIFE ADVISOR - I know recruitment counselors have training, but they are still collegiates, and they may not be fully aware of the process (hence why our school always has people listing all the sororities!! :eek: )

My recommendation would be if you are SURE that you do not want a bid from Doug, then do NOT include them on your pref card. If you DO receive a bid from them, and do not accept it, you will not be eligilble to be recruited for another year- meaning that if a chapter DOES do COB this fall, you will not be able to participate. You would have to wait for formal next fall.

So, it doesn't matter if you ACCEPT a bid so much as if you are OFFERED a bid. If you are not offerend one, then you are eligible for COB. Just something to keep in mind.

FYI- this is how it was a few years ago when I was really active with rush, so if it has changed, someone please correct me.:)

Well I was cut from PepperAnn. So that leaves Doug for the Pref party. I really don't feel like I can connect or feel comfortable around these girls so I am soooo confused. Yesterday they kept asking me if I was coming back, which was real uncomfortable. I told them that that depended on them. And then they were like well we really want u to come back, so u should. Which I didn't think was allowed. The thing is I was struggling to hold a conversation with them, and them me, so I don't understand why they would want me. Anywho I don't know what to do. I knew aboiut the one year deal, so that is why I don't want them to offer me a bid. I don't think I would be happy with that decision. So what options are left?

I would suggest going to their pref party, and then if you really don't want to be a part of the sorority, then don't pref them. I can tell that you have thought long and hard about this, and I would continue thinking about it. Talk to your recruitment counselors and get their advice about COB.

Bottom line.... You don't have to do anything you don't really want to do. If you honestly will not be happy there, then you don't have to join. Do what is in your heart. I will add that I was not the most excited about my option when I went through pref, or even bid day. But, I did grow to love it and I found my home and my sisters.

I am SO sorry that things have not worked out the way you were hoping. :( Trust me, there are alot of ladies on here who have been in your shoes, and I promise things will work out the right way. You do always have next year if that is what you want to do.

Looking on the SHSU website, it looks like at least one of the chapters does spring rush. Have you thought about that? It definately might be something worth considering.

Can you go to Preference to see what Doug has to say and if you still aren't sold, not fill out a bid card? If so, (and I would check with your Recruitment Counselor on this to be sure before hand) then you would not be committing and should be allowed to COB if you don't sign a card. At least that's how our NPC did it when I was in school not so long ago.

silmikek20: your story is identical to my daughter's, who went through rush last spring. (they have 2nd semester rush). She started with 7 sororities, after first round she was cut by 3. Of the 4 left, she liked 2 and was so-so about 2. After attending the 2nd round of parties, she felt really good about 2, pretty good about 1 and did not feel comfortable at all with 1. She was cut from 3 of the 4 and only left with the one she did not like.

After many, many tears, she decided not to attend the 1 pref party because she never felt like she connected with those girls and couldn't see herself in that sorority. (There are only 3 rounds at her school, the 3rd round being pref). She didn't sign a bid card but that sorority offered her a bid anyway, which she declined.

It was a really tough situation, very similar to yours (and many others experience as well, I guess). In the end, she made her own - agonized - decision. She didn't want to join a sorority for the sake of just joining anyone and she never felt the connection with that 1 that gave her a bid. She never regretted her decision but I will warn you that the rest of the semester was a little tough as all her close friends did the fun, crazy sorority thing as she watched from the outside. It took till the end of the semester for her to re-connect with her friends. And I will also say that she has a much clearer idea now of the "personality" of each sorority as she's done stuff with her friends and their groups. It validated her original gut reaction that the 1 sorority was the wrong one for her. She also plans on re-rushing (with probably a clearer head this time).

I have a question about my daughter's situation: she didn't go to a pref party, she didn't sign a bid card but a sorority offered her one anyway which she declined. Does this mean she can't COB this fall? I'm a little confused based on some of the posts. Can anyone tell me?

:(
 

I hate that it worked out this way for you. :( You do have some options - some are more final and binding, so you need to feel confident about your choice. Also keep in mind that I HAVE NO IDEA about the sororities on your campus beyond what you have posted. Therefore it is hard for me or anyone else to give you good solid advice on what you should do. Only you know yourself and these chapters. Regardless of what you choose, I think you should attend Doug's preference before making a final decision. Your options that I am aware of:

1 - Attend Doug's preference. Based on what they've told you, they like you and there's a good chance they will offer you a bid. Still no guarantee though. Perhaps after attending you will find the connection you've been missing. If so, rank them and see if you get the bid. If you do rank them, you are saying you will accept the bid and won't decline it.

2 - Attend Doug's preference. Then if you still aren't feeling it and are comfortable with not receiving a bid at all, you can do one of two things: A - on your ranking card, list only chapters you would accept a bid from, and don't list Doug. B - Withdraw, but tell your recruitment counselor or greek advisor that you are doing so. With option A, there is a VERY VERY SLIGHT chance that you receive a bid from one of these chapters, but it is miniscule. If you aren't on their preference list, you probably aren't on their bid list. But as others have mentioned, it is still possible. Most likely, you will wind up as a mis-match and could possibly be offered a snap bid from a chapter you didn't list if they don't match to quota. Snap bids are not binding as long as you don't list them on your Memebership Acceptance Agreement.

3 - Withdraw before preference. I wouldn't recommend this, as it can't hurt you to go. Just attending doesn't bind you to anyone, and as long as you don't go in saying you are dying to be a Doug then cut them, you aren't hurting anyone in the Doug chapter.

Basically, we can't tell you how to rank or how to feel or what you should be feeling right now. We can only hope that your recruitment counselors advise you properly on binding agreements. You might think, ok, I'll give Doug a try. And that is admirable. It just depends on how important being Greek is to you. If that is the ultimate goal, go for it. If the ultimate goal is to be a PepperAnn, you should consider other options. Just make sure you know FOR SURE that if you list a chapter on your MAA and get matched to it, you have a chance of receiving a bid and you are saying you will take it and will not COR for a year.

You can never count on COR. Some chapters do it, some don't. For the first time ever, all four chapters on my campus did it, just because we raised total high enough so that we could. But that might not happen on your campus, and you should NOT count on being able to do it. Even if all the chapters DO COR, you still have to go through a process and might not get the bid.

I wish you the best in your decision. You have to do what's right for YOU. That might be withdrawing, that might be trying out Doug - no one knows but you.

As long as she did NOT sign a bid card, she is eligible for COB by anyone!

'

I agree! It sounds to me like the chapter offered her a snap bid.

Also, VERY good comments on what silmilek20 could do. I do think that if you KNOW that you do not want to be a Doug, DO NOT put them on your pref card!!! Because from what you have said, it sounds like you can be pretty sure of getting a bid from them if you do.

I don't know. I am going to do a lot of soul searching. I did like some of the girls in that sorority. And that is the only bid my roommate got as well. When I think about it like that it wouldn't be so bad if we both got bids, because I do feel a connection with her, and she's real cool. I am just going to go to Pref to see all of the diff. types of girls who could get bids. But now I am going to go reflect. I am really in a sticky situation. I don't want to spend that much money if it's not right for me. ALso I am a sophmore, but this is my 3rd year. So next year I think would be too late. I tried to go talk to my rho gamma, but she's not in her room.

Okay - so chin up, girlie! You have already learned more in a few days than most people do for a whole term AFTER they joined a group. You have been very level headed about the rounds, and you seem to have a grasp about who you are & what you are looking for.

I will encourage you to GO to the pref - if you still don't "feel" it after, then DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT put them on your pref card. BUT - based on this post, you seem to already be connecting on some level to some girls. Just remember that no matter what group it is, not everyone is BFF with everyone else. There will always be the few that you really connect with, and these are your friends no matter what.

After you go to Pref, then ask your Greek Life Advisor (remember - a Rho Gamma may not fully understand the system) if you can list a sorority that released you. If so, and you still feel strongly for them, LIST THEM (you should be able to do this). It can't hurt - you never know where the chips will fall.

Good luck to you :)

I concur on the at least attend the pref ceremony...
One thing that stuck with me is how special pref is...

While sitting in that room do what many of us did-
Look around decide if you can see yourself being a part of that ceremony next year.
If you can really think about that... but if you can't you may want to withdraw from recruitment and try COB.

Best of luck to you.

SilMil20...I am also a 3rd year who is still considered a sophomore...don't let that be a hinderance.

Also, even though you dont want Doug (or you dont think you want Doug), go into it with an OPEN mind!

Your making your race a bigger issue than it is. They are not going to give you a bid only because your black, and they are not gonna deny you a bid because your black. Yes, it might make you more desirable, but the fact that Doug is inviting you back is because they FEEL a connection with you...not only because of your race.

Go to Pref, if you don't feel that Doug is the place you want to be, then don't do it. Don't pref just because your friend/roomate might. Remember this is a LIFELONG commitment, and if a year or 2 down the road, you don't feel this is your home, you can't go to another group.

Besides, who knows...you might go into pref thinking Doug is not the right one, and then after pref you think WOW, this IS the place i want to be. (its happened before).

Just keep an open mind...like everyone says, there is always COB if you dont find your home! Best of wishes to you!!

Oh sweetie. My heart goes out to you. I concur with what everyone one else is saying. Go to the Preference party and if you still don't feel they are the right ones for you then don't put anything on your bid card (b/c then you will be eligible for COR/COB).

One thing to remember is that many girls realize that this is the house they should be in at the Pref party. The pref ceremonies are the "clincher" in getting a girl to pick you (and obviously them picking her). The ADPi pref ceremony for me sealed the deal.

Another thing to remember is that rush is so formal, many rules that have to be followed, much stricter guidelines, but COR/COB is much more informal, much more laid back.

Question for all, since I'm not sure, could she be snap bidded? I'm not sure if the school does snap bidding, but even though she was dropped could she be. Not knowing the circumstances of being dropped they might not have really wanted to drop her but needed to drop a certain amount.

It really is a catch 22. If you can be snapped bid that is a possibility (but you might have to fill out the bid card) but if you fill out the bid card and Doug offers you a bid and you don't take it than you can't COR.

Good luck sweetie. I don't know you but I wish I could give you a hug. :)

Well after a lot of thinking and talking with an impartial person who is in no way related to the greek community I have a better grasp of the situation. Now that I think about it I can't remember that much about that house except some of the undesirable aspects. Today I will go and look around at everyone and how they act. I just really didn't connect with the girl I talked to yesterday, and I had to talk to her the whole time, so it felt kind of like a chore. It was like they were trying to throw the minority at me. But I guess if I look past that, then it's not so bad. I just hate stereotypes and it kind of offended me the way they came to me "whats up" and all. I simple how are u doing would have been better. I have class so I like being talked to like i have class. Nothing really big. But they were the only sorority were I actually felt like a minority, because they kind of focused on that. But yeah I have reflected alot and feel a lot better about recruitment as of now. Who knows, maybe I could be happy as a Doug.

Thats the spirit.

Remember, even if you realize that you do want to join Doug, you aren't going to like everyone or get along with everyone. Some people just don't mesh, but even if you don't mesh you will respect them because they are your sister. It doesn't mean you have to have them be your bridesmaid. :D

I can understand not feeling comfortable talking to one person the entire time. That seems like a bad tactic on their part (personal opinion there). They should have rotated for you to get to know some more girls and for them to get to know you. But I don't know their situation.

Have fun at Doug tonight!!!!!

This post really got me. It was good. You made me learn somethign from it, and I hope you can learn a little from what i am about to say.

My chapter has no minority girls. (Not a shock, theres a whole five of us.) Not because we dont want any or dont accept any, but because it is HARD trying to get them interested in us.

I'm an IT major. Last year, I met a group of 3 black girls, and I HONESTLY felt like I really connected with one who was also an IT major. I HOPED that she had felt the same way, and that possibly, if we could get her interested, she would invite her friends along with her. Did it happen? No. Why? To this day I dont know.

We honestly dont know how to appeal to the minority crowd. Sometimes when i'm having a selfish moment, I get defensive myself and think "Well the only reason they wont join us is because we dont already have minorities..."even though I know thats not necessarily true...but how do we step over that hurdle? how do we get the first one, so that future girls wont be so shy?

While what you have said has helped me not FOCUS on the fact that a person is a minority so much - you know, so we dont make the same mistakes that you described above - also try to look at it from their point of view. it's hard to read a person sometimes, and as bad as it sounds, sometimes people are just ignorant. They try to do what they think is right, without realizing that you're offended by it. I'll admit, I probably could have been one of those girls who made the mistakes. Keep an open mind with them - they arent intentionally trying to single you out cause youre a minority, they are just trying to do what they feel is the right thing.

Thanks for the insight.

Good for you for going and seeing how it goes! I am crossing my fingers that it is a good pref for you. Let us know how things turn out, we care.

To be perfectly honest, it becomes harder to "appeal" to a minority group or groups if there is a large population of said group/groups at your school. Generally, people tend to "stick to their own kind", especially if the groups' parents are immigrants or if they are immigrants themselves. This is from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. My family already thinks I'm "odd" because I like small town, North America/nostalgic-esque prints/paintings that have NOTHING to do with my background!

Definitely attend Doug's pref party and keep an open mind. I didn't really know that I wanted to join Alpha Chi until pref night. My campus has 3 Panhellenic chapters, and there have been many girls who didn't match at their first choice (or even second choice for that matter) who have ended up loving their experience at that chapter. My chapter advisor told me she isn't in her bid day pictures because she was in the other room crying because she didn't get her first choice. Now she wouldn't change her affiliation for the world. There are women who end up with their first choice and resign because they weren't honest with themselves and the fit wasn't right.

Things--good or bad-- happen for a reason. Continue to be open-minded tonight at your pref ceremony. Be honest with yourself. Are these the women you could sit up with at 3am because something bad happened? Are these the women you could pour your soul to? Are these the women you could hang out with, without the glitz and glamour of recruitment, while in your pajamas, eating popcorn, and watching tv? Do you feel like you can be yourself there? If you think the answer might be yes, then maybe you should consider giving Doug a shot. Being a sister isn't just during recruitment, or at meetings, or in ritual. You will be a sister to these women for the rest of your life. If you campus has houses, these are the women you will most likely live with. Attending recruitment parties won't make the women in these chapters your best friends. The new member period will be the time to really get to know the sisters. You could think of this as a sort of test-drive... There are always pluses and minuses. If it feels like a good fit, and you are willing to try, you may grow to love it.

Good luck tonight!

Good for you for going. Pref can totally change your mind about a sorority. You may have just had someone there yesterday you didn't connect with, but there could be so many others you connect with that you will see at pref. Just take in the whole pref ceremony and see if you could visualize yourself as a sister of this sorority. Sometimes you can surprise yourself and end up at home in the last place you thought you'd be :) Good luck.

i can't say anything that hasn't been said before, but i do want to wish you the best of luck with your decision!

I think I am late on this one, because I think it has already played out, but I want to point out that this is important. Take a look at the girls who would be your new pledge sisters, not just the women already in the house.

to echo all the others...go to pref if you get the chance. look at the whole picture and then see where you want to go. things sometimes look different in another context.

That is exactly what I did, and you are right. The could-be new members are all a cool bunch of girls that I could see myself being really cool with, and some I already am. So yeah feeling much better.

So yeah obviously I had a good time tonight. It was amazing. I felt great throughout the ceremony and actually really happy. I talked to one of the girls I really clicked with earlier on and we talked the whole night. We actually have some mutual friends that we work out with, so we are going to all work out together. I just really had a great time talking to her.

Yes I know what u mean by wanting a more diverse group. And true some people gravitate to people like them. I came from a predominantly white area, and most of my friends were white. So I gravitate to people who are like me, and don't look at race. So having 1 minority girl will not just bring more into your group. But stereotypes are out there. And my dad was an immigrant so that doesn't even change it. He came from Ghana in Africa when he was 19. So yes I have a direct connection to Africa and embrace it by joining the African organization, but that doesn't change where I feel comfortable. Sorry to rant, but I just hate when people assume things about me because I am a minority. No I'm not from the ghetto, I don't cuss, I don't like rap music, and I don't eat fried chicken all the time. I am just me, and true to myself for the most part.

Now back to the important situation. I did my pref card tonight. We actually do everything by computer so I have no idea whats going to happen. Then told us that we could put anyones from today and yesterday in the top two spots, and to put all 4 down.
I ranked them like
PepperAnn
Doug
Lizzie
Braceface.

I don't know if that was the best decision to put Doug second, bc now I think I like them best. Oh well. I will just see what happens tommorrow at 10. If anybody doesn't get a bid they find out earlier so I would know b4 10. Hopefully I do though. I know being in any NPC Sorority is an honor and I hope I can gain that. I really hope I get to run down that hill tommorrow.

Thanks soooooooooooooooooo much for all of your advice. I can't even imagine what would have happened without it. I might not have even rushed. I am soooooo happy I finally went through with it, and wish I would have earlier. But that is what happens. So yeah send good vibes my way. I am sooooo excited.