Listening to the talk-shows and the like up here... leads one to conclude that Bettman is a marked man - a lot of the anger from fans calling in was directed at him... and never mind the sports shows or sports sections in the paper.

So now Bettman has confirmed his position as the most hated man in sports here in Canada... and before the strike he used to get booed whenever he appeared at a game (or at least in Toronto, Ottawa, and Montreal)... I wonder what will happen now?

Personally I have firmly sided with the players... after all collectively the 700+ sacrificed 1.7 Billion dollars - along with the strong possibility that around 100 won't play in the NHL again... To me that says that they fought for something more than the pay... because if it was about the money there would have been at least some serious cracks in the NHLPA near the end.

While I may have agreed with you before this happened for Boston, I'm not so sure if I do right now. I think that if it started up again, people would watch and go to the games but most people that I've talked to haven't even missed it or thought about the Bruins. The only people that really seem to are the bar owners around the FleetCenter that have lost tons of business and my friends roomate who lost out on a job that he would have been offered had they been playing and the FleetCenter was making enough money to pay him and everyone else who's salary's they cut. After the seasons the Sox and the Patriots have been having, the other two teams kind of disappeared from a lot of peoples minds. But who knows, maybe I'm wrong and when they play again, the Bruins could have a ton of supporters still. I used to watch them more than I watched the Red Sox, and I barely think about them now, though. I haven't missed watching games at all.

I am not totally shocked by the news that a season cancellation will take place. It is good news for us here in Norfolk....Chicago can't raid our team for players....That is unless replacement players are used. Even then, a good part of our team have Chicago contracts and won't cross. I guess people are going to be happy with the AHL and other such leagues.

I know that I am enjoying the better skill and game that has appeared in the AHL.

I agree, I don't think hockey will cease to exist in Canada, but when/if it comes back, it's going to be hit hard just like baseball was.
Baseball is starting to come back again, but I think a lot of fans are pissed off and are going to show it by not supporting the teams when/if the return.

Do you think the NHL would survive when it comes back? The BabyLeafs are moving to Toronto next fall, and if the WHA ever gets started, it'll be around too. Do you think we can support up to three teams?

Toronto is a sports city. We have the money and the fan base to keep teams going. I think Toronto could support a NFL team. My thoughts are the Baby Leafs and even a WHA team will mostly be supported by the average fan. Whereas, I think a lot of the revenue for the big teams comes from the corporations.

Toronto is a hockey city... people are now even starting to buy seasons tickets for next year; and the turn-out for the NHL Alumni vs Leaf Alumni game was just shy of a sell-out crowd.

As for sports bars... some have taken to showing old play-off series when AHL or European games aren't on - except of course the '93 series vs LA.

As for teams in town; aside from the minor hockey leagues (house league and such) there are:
the 3 university mens teams (UofT, York, and Ryerson);
the 2 university womens teams (UofT & York) - both have Olympic players;
the 3 OHL teams - Brampton Battlaion, Missaugua Ice Dogs (coached by Don Cherry), St. Mike's Majors.
the 35 OHA jr. A team leauge with games all around the city;
there's even a Gay Hockey Leauge, and a Jewish Hockey Leauge...

So there is a large base of players and fans out there, with a lot of NHL supporters...

For those of you suffering from hockey withdrawls....AHL All-star game is tonight on ESPN-2. Several NHL players are playing for Planet USA and Team Canada. For more information: www.theahl.com

For Canadians, the game is on CTV SportsNet.

Oh, and it's 4-0 Canada at the end of the 1st. :D

Damn!
 

How the hell do you lose a 4-0 lead???!!!!

And to lose it in shoots outs? Hello where was the defence?????


And no, this writer is a crack pot. Nobody likes shoots outs...shootouts is the absolute worst way to settle a game. I don't know why they would have shootouts in AHL hockey anyway?

No Spezza, you only get shut down with a complete team lapse. Nobody loses a 4-0 lead just like that.

They got cocky.

oh well, what can you do? :(

P.S here's the article I took those quotes from
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/artic...14_225251_5288

Have only read the headline, but it appears the players have agreed to a salary cap. Maybe some movement?

Too late?

i thought the owners rejected their offer?

May be. As I said, I only read the headline, or I would have added more.

As far as I have heard, both sides are talking with little or no progress. I think it is time to accept the inevitable - there will be no 2004-2005 NHL hockey season. What they save isn't even worth it at this point, IMHO.


As for shootouts in the AHL...Normally there is a five minute sudden death overtime played before the shootout. While I hate the fact that I am chewing my nails during the shootout. It is also nice to have an actual winner at the end of the game.

They announced this morning that the players association has agreed on a salary cap but they are $12 million apart. Last I heard, they were still talking somewhere in Niagra Falls.

They don't have shootouts in the NHL. It will forever be the worst way to settle a game. I am firmly planted in that opinion. Nothing irritates me more in hockey than a shootout. You play as many overtimes as you need. Someone will eventually win.
The only time shootouts should be used is in houseleague when you have a time limit on the ice.

So now the Players' Association has counter offered the NHL with a 49 mil cap. Even if the season is cancelled tomorrow, I have a feeling that hockey'll be back next fall. It's all about the money now.

It's official, the season is canceled.

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/SPORT/02/16/nhl.season/

if people weren't money-grubbing bastards...

(this is aimed at all sides of the situation)

I'm so sad...if Mark Messier retires without playing another NHL game, I'm going to be seriously pissed. And they got us all hopeful that progress was there...ick.

I gotta deal with Mr.1228 and a 14 year old kid (both hockey fanatics...especially the kid).
Too bad they could not come to a happy medium!

It's a shame that both sides couldn't have learned how to play nicely together in the first place. Hurrah, everyone loses in the end. Let's hope they get this fixed NOW so we can see a viable NHL in the fall. At this point I'm not going to hold my breath, although I'll have my rear in a seat at Nationwide when and if we get hockey ever back again.

Oh well, guess we'll be seeing a nice fat hockey refund check at our house in the near future.

Let's hope they can solve everything by August so we'll have a full season. I still don't understand why they refuse contraction. Wouldn't shutting teams down save even more money?

Greedy buggers, the lot of them.

Time to enjoy grassroots hockey, eventhough I am going to miss the excitement of Vancouver during playoff season.

I shall reserve most of my extreme distast for the head weasel Bettman... I'm sorry yes the players were out to protect there asses and so was Bettman - but the NHLPA at least made offers or moved on positions... I didn't see that from Bettman or the owners.

So now marginal markets are threatened, and fan base support in these areas is severely weakened... I'm betting on 3 teams folding or moving.

Finally in the words of Tie Domi: "We were willing to take a 24% pay cut, were Bettman or the owners? I think that will tell you who is more dedicated to the game, and who is more dedicated to his bottom line"


On a side note anyone see the cover of the Toronto Star on the 16th? That'd be the barber's I patronize in my little neck of the woods:D

Oh boo hoo for the players. A 24% pay cut...that will really affect their lifestyle. As for the owners their not innocent either and I agree that they should have done more, but the players need to stop acting like they're victims. The real victims here are the business that rely on the NHL for their livelihood. The sports bars owners and staff, retailers and maufacturers. They are the only ones who have and will truely suffer.

I heard on the radio this morning that both Don Cherry and Wayne Gretzky are saying that this might last until next January. Both sides are unlikely to talk again until at least September :(......

Sure a 24% roll-back wouldn't hurt the big namers - but the last offer made was a 24% role back across the board... which meant that even the minor players would feel the pinch... through-out the whole medation process it seemed that the NHLPA was always being the ones making the concesions, while the owners stayed firm in their resolve to use the collapse of the last Bettman CBA as a means to break the player's union.

As for who the real victims are - I'd have to go with the players that may have played not get a chance to play because of this - either because of financial reasons, or because of the loss of the draft. What about the other staff involved in the lock-out that supported the NHLPA... like say the refs... guys who never made that much who now get nothing... again just like the players. The owners are still making money from things site usage and merchandising - whereas 95% of the players get zilch this year... nothing.

Look my issue with Bettman is that since his arrival the NHL has had one lock-out and now one lost season - something that has never happened before. But what really galls me is the little weasel tried to use the 11th hour negotations to introduce major rule changes to the NHL as well...

This is one issue that you and I will never completely agree on. I cannot in good conscience feel sorry for people who are making hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars a year to put a puck in the back of a net. These are some of the most privilaged people in the world and it irriates me to know end that many of them feel it is their God given right to make big money to play a sport. They only get the big money because people have decided that they can. Not because they actually deserve it. So in turn, it is really the fans that are paying these high salaries and I think it's time that we put a stop to it (but that's just my humble opinion). Hockey is the greatest sport on earth in my opininion, so great that people actually pay to play it! Some of the best hockey that you will see is played at the grassroots level, not in the NHL. Why? Because the grassroots players are playing for the love of the game.

Now I agree that Bettman is a problem. The owners are a problem. I do not believe that they are innocent parties at all. While I do feel sorry for some of the younger players that never got their chance at the big leagues, they are not the victims either.

Like I said before, the real victims here are those in the bar and restaurant industry. Retailers and manufactures. Public transportaion and taxis are losing money because of this.

I cannot and will not ever feel sorry for a professional athlete when it comes to money.

looks like both parties are realizing that zero income this season is worse than swallowing some pride.... talks seem to be resuming, according to the local news

Looks like the season will happen after all.

http://thn.com/en/headlines/detail.asp?id=27358

If this is true, do you think Bettman is going to resign? This would be very embarassing for him.

I hope so, but I doubt it.

Last update said that the talks didn't go well, and the season is "still cancelled". :(

I wish they would either cancel it or not cancel it, but just stop talking about what they are going to do........

Oh it's cancelled... I'm 99% sure that the talks now are about legal and finacial issues with the cancelled season... and about laying the ground-work down for negotations dealing with the 05-06 season...

He won't go unless forced out, and I don't expect that to happen either. A cancelled season is horrible, but it won't be enough for him to leave.

Plus, resigning would be admitting that he (and by association, the owners) are wrong.

NHL Lockout is over. They have reached a deal.

From the Toronto Star:
Click Here For More Info

Yea....i've known about this for a few months.

It was very weird last season not to have all the la kings guys in the office and seeing them leave the kings to go to other holdings by AEG, it will be nice to see some old faces again, I just love those guys.

It will be also nice to have a cold arena again ;)

but lets be honest, if the NHL didn't come to an agreement for this upcoming season, the NHL would be dead in the water, time will tell if the league can survive.

It will be nice to see Ziggy Palfrey on the ice again.

I'm tempted, but refuse to celebrate until everything is officially signed, sealed and delivered.

Until then, I'm saving my pennies for opening night tickets at Nationwide Arena :D