Excellent point GP!

I've never heard this, that's interesting. Is there anything about it on the national site? I'd love to read more about it.

I think the biggest problem is that we assume everyone in every greek system is as NPC-aware as we are. They aren't! I can't even TELL you how many times I was asked to rush when I transferred. Over and over and over, "So, are you rushing?" when I JUST FINISHED talking about my sorority at VCU.

It's good natured at heart, I think -- they see a girl who obviously was good sisterhood material before, why not now? They don't know you can't pledge two groups, as long as it's on two different campuses.

I knew you would be happy this was coming up again. ;)

FWIW, I have NO issue with people who've transferred socializing with another group - the problem is that our social functions and everything else have become so bogged down with risk management that casual parties and things like that are becoming nonexistent. Sometimes it seems all we do ARE meetings and ritual.

If there is a clause for "social affiliation" that's great, but I'm guessing that would be more like the sorority inviting you in. That's a lot different than going through formal rush as if you were a blank slate.

Unfortunately this is one of those issues where a few jerks have ruined it for everyone. I mean, GP, I know if you were allowed to rush at another school you would be aboveboard about the whole thing and have good reasons and really want to contribute to whatever group you joined - in other words, you would be respectful of both your "new" and "old" sisters. That isn't always the case. There are women out there who know damn well what they're doing and think it's a jolly old joke.

But, isn't that the theme of GC? ;)

You know, I can kind of understand the people who don't realize they can't affiliate with two different sororities on two different campuses. (Although I remember it being covered during our new member ed.)

On our campus though we had a slightly different situation. A girl transferred in and was a member of ABC at her original school. We had a chapter of ABC on our campus, but they were not a particularly popular sorority so this girl went through rush and joined XYZ instead. She was initiated and even moved into the house winter term. She was eventually found out though. Apparently she talked about ABC a little too much (including ritual) and one of XYZ's field consultants got suspicious. :rolleyes:

Co-sign... I was a transfer, I hadn't gone greek at my first school but after having gone through it if I had been a member of an org already it woud've been something I would want to continue with, and while it is bad to lie about it I agree they aren't trying to screw or trick the system... they are just misguided.

Regarding "social affiliation", Pi Beta Phi does not allow it-according to our GC national officer--and I would doubt that many nationals do. Non-members aren't covered by our insurance and to quote her, it would be a risk management nightmare.

I can understand how a transfer would miss sisterhood--however, a few would and do ruin it for everyone. A local girl rushed at a large out-of-state university and was initiated. She transferred at the end of that semester and pledged another sorority at a smaller school. She was found out before her initiation and this was the reason she gave everyone for pledging again: "At my first school, we were the ugly sorority. I couldn't stand being thought of as a loser.":eek:

for what it's worth, "social affiliation" basically just sounds like you hang out with the sorority a lot.

We had a girl at my school who transferred in her sophomore year. She joined Tri-Delta at her school and, since we didn't have a chapter here, thought she was done with Greek Life. She ended up making friends with a lot of the Phi Mus, though, and hung out with them a lot. She didn't go to chapter or do ritual or anything, and I'm not sure if she went to mixers, etc.

I know one thing our Greek Life Office did was let her be a Rho Chi. She just wanted to do SOMETHING with Greek Life, and she had a great time doing it. It always shocked the PNMs at the Rho Chi revealing ceremony when all the Rho Chis did a Delta Delta Delta cheer and she revealed her shirt.

Now *that* is a great idea! You're guaranteed to be a little less biased, since you can't even unconsciously point anyone to or away from "your" organization! :P

Wow, that's crazy, but in a good way!

I suppose if your HQ allows for "guests" at social functions, there is no reason one girl couldn't be a guest at every social function. To clarify my point above, I think it is a good idea, as long as you take the appropriate RM precautions.

my senior year i wasn't dating anyone seriously so i would always bring one of my best friends, who is a tri-delta, to my formal or social events. she was friends with a lot of my sisters and no one ever minded her being there. we had a great time together!

That's really cute.

We always had alumna show up as guests, which was nice.

JocelynC, did the houses share that information? Frankly, I think if you lie about being a Tri-Sigma legacy, that should get you cut from all houses, not just Tri-Sigma. I sure wouldn't want that liar in my house.

It's one thing to boast accomplishments on your application -- that is good.

It's another to lie -- that is bad. What is the point of lying? It's so exhausting to have to remember the stories you made up.

At UGA we always have girls lie about legacies and activities and such. Such a silly move... usually it's just padding, too, from already fabulous girls who don't think they're good enough for a competitive rush. It's a shame that they feel like they have to lie to be good enough for any GLO.

An interesting thought I just had- I went to two high schools (one in 9-10 grade in MA and one in 11-12 grade in GA), and there were some things I was involved in at my MA school that I was not in GA... for instance, I was on student council. When I went through rush, a girl at one house said she had been interested to meet me because she went to my high school in GA and was student council president, but had never met me. I had to explain that I had gone to two high schools (something that was not an option anywhere on the application). I wonder only after reading this thread if any houses cut me because I had an activity listed for 9th or 10th grade that girls from my GA high school had not seen me involved with. :D

Well, I do understand and I DO critize those that try it! I had to transfer after only 2 years in my organization because of my degree. Yes, it was hard to leave my sisters, and I loved my university. Give me a break----whether you hear it in your new member program or at the begining of recruitment----everyone knows you just can't go from group to group to join up at will!

That didn't keep me from making friends at the new place or getting involved in other organizations----it was just different.

I hadn't ever heard of "social affliliation" before either-----and I doubt many groups do it. You can still do things with members of other groups without having an official name. And I ,ALWAYS wanted everyone at my new school to know that I belonged to my sorority even though there wasn't a chapter on campus---I was proud to be a member.

My grandfather had been part of a fraternity at U Penn, where he went before going into the Army. After he got out, the army sent him to Bethany to finish his degree. At Bethany, a fraternity allowed him as a "social member". I don't know if my brother got legacy status when he joined...and I don't know if it really mattered, they persued my brother pretty heavily (he is awesome though!). But what I thought was cool was that the active chapter went back and initiated some of the older alumni who had never been initiate members because of various things...going off to war, lack of money after returning from war, etc. I thought that was really nice. They wanted to initiate my grandfather too, but the one small bump was that he was allready initiated at U Penn!

I'm not sure, but I think on our campus, some chapters consider being a legacy as only a *slight* preference. Like you may only be guaranteed a novelty party invite, NOT a bid.

With most sororities, legacies are automatically invited to the first invitational round (at Auburn, that's Philanthropy Day).

This girl last year told one of the sororities at my school that she had been valedictorian of her class. Turns out that she didn't even graduate high school and had just gotten her GED. I'm not even sure how she got accepted to the college.

LOL! That is a HOT mess! But, it's true that (many) colleges will accept someone with a GED provided they pass entrance exams.

she WAS valedictorian! it was just a class of 1

Wow, that's neat, I wish UCF would allow that. We don't have a chapter here, the nearest one is about 100 away in Tampa. Anyhow, I was so nervous to talk to the Greek Advisor Greg Mason here about being a Rho Gamma, that my Tri-Delt friend insisted on coming along so I wouldn't be freaking out or something. Oh and Greg's mom is an AGD & he said himself was the Squirrel Man for one of his college years too. Anyways we talked to Greg & he was all like, "Oh I've gotten asked by girls from Phi Mu, Sigma Kappa and yours AGD to become Rho Gammas recently" Then he goes on to describe the Expandsion process, I'm thinkin..."uhh this isn't what I asked" So I jump to the point, and Greg goes, "Well only girls from chapters of sororities presently on campus can become Rho Gams" I mean I personally think that girls who aren't represented by a chapter on campus would be great Rho Gammas coz they wouldn't be biased and stuff. But oh well, whatever ...Oh forgot to mention that I was kinda surprised that Greg didn't mention anything about Theta Phi Alpha, since I've seen two sisters of theirs' cars in the Visual Arts student parking lot all the time I park over there.

I am Grad assistant in Greek Affairs at my school. Yes, I get to check ALL of the GPA's for Recruitment. I feel like a private eye somtimes trying to figure out this stuff. We have an assumption in the office. If a girl says her GPA is 2.5 (our minimum sorority GPA-but you don't have to have it to go through Rush), she most likely has lower. We have girls who have 6.0 scales with a 4.0 but then I have to do the math to get her 2.whatever.

We had a girl who quit a chapter the week of initiation. She then put on her app. that she had never pledged a sorority. IT WAS THE SAME CAMPUS! How would anyone not know?

Also there was a girl who put she was a legacy but her grandmother was a member of the group that became Phi Mu-she had never actually been a member. Confusing, but we were relieved to release her. Reputation extreme!

This is something she honestly could have been confused about, because Phi Mu allows alumnae initiation for alumnae members of absorbed groups. I wouldn't consider her a legacy, but I also wouldn't release her for lying.

OMG that is so so sooooo mean.

This Greg dude sounds like totally uncool!! I think it would be AwEsOmE for you and the Theta Phis and the Phi Mus and Sigma Kappas to be Rho Gammas!!!!!!!!! like wow that would be sooooooooo neat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I knew of someone with a GED that had a 1400 plus SAT . . . bright person . . bad student.

.... or even just a person with a bad family situation. I used to work with a guy whose home life was so unstable he was working full time by age 16, to support his little sisters.



but, lying is lying. If she lied by saying she was valedictorian, make sure the door doesn't hit her on the way out.

I think at a lot of schools it's not made ABSOLUTELY CLEAR when you're filling out the rush form that groups can "check up" on most of the info you list on the form.

I was so scared of lying when I went through I left my GPA blank -- I'd transferred and wasn't sure if they meant core classes, my GPA at my old school, my GPA at the new school, the two combined, my HS GPA, what? And they check anyway.

past coming to the present
 

I am a little confused. if someone transfers to another school isnt their information private. does the rushee have to sign something to allow panhellenic access to their grades. And as far as transferring to a new school where your group isnt at, i was told that the rule was that you could not belong to the two group at the same school, so if you transfered then a girl could join a new group. And if a girl did transfer and did not say that she was in a sorority at her old school would the panhellenic at the 2nd school call the old school to check to see if she was a member of a group or would there be other ways of finding out if a women was/is a member of another organization.

I was invovled in a sorority at my school but we never dealt with this, okay i never dealt with or heard of many of these things happening with the exception of grade bolstering

I am just really curious, dont mean to be a bother

If you're at a big and/or selective school, you'll almost certainly have to sign a paper allowing panhel to check your grades. No, you can not join another NPC group if you initiate at the first and transfer. And again, if the second school is big and/or selective they will most likely check to see if you were Greek before and if you were found to have lied about that, both nationals will boot you.

Just to add: Being a member of only one NPC group is the rule across the board for all NPC groups. It doenst matter if you were in one group at one school and then transfer. The one you initiated into is your group for life. In fact, I believe that once you initiate an NPC group if at some point you decide to turn in your pin and terminate your membership from that group's HQ, I still think you are bound to that group and are not allowed to pledge another NPC group period. Reason being I think is that each group has it's own unique and special ritual. It cheapens the meaning of these rituals if you join more than one, or know the "Secrets" if you will of more than one. I'm not sure if that came out very clearly, but it's not fair to the members to belong to more than one.

Am I correct here in saying this?

I just want to point out that this is not necessarily true. In fact, often, the larger the school is, the LESS likely it is that they'll check. Who wants to go through and check up on whether 800 different rushees were Greek before?

Not that I'm encouraging anyone to do this, by any means, but there are plenty of schools where there IS no checking up (on whether you were Greek, on legacy status -- probably more common not to check outside of the south -- on GPA, etc.). You definitely don't know which you're going to get, though.

For those of you who go to schools where you DO check if the girls were Greek before, how do you do it? Do you send a list of social security numbers to the HQs of all national sororities and ask them to match them up or something? That just seems like TONS of work on both ends, especially when you take into account that it's happening all over the country.

Please. Not everybody's Greek experience was identical to your own. I know that I was never told at any point during my recruitment or new member period that I couldn't have been Greek before. If it wasn't for GC, I probably wouldn't know that this is the case.

You guys have to realize that while most of us on this website are extremely educated on Greek issues, that is NOT true across the board, and I would hazard a guess that it's the exception rather than the rule.

It's definitely true at big Southern schools. Not many transfers go through and there are people on Panhellenic recruitment committees whose jobs include checking the transcripts of all PNMs and whether transfers were Greek.

Not only that, but individual sororities check up on transfers too. They want to make sure they're not pledging, say, psychos or whatever and I personally know of some shocking things that some sororities uncovered about transfers (well, and on freshmen too). One sorority uncovered a pretty extensive police record on one girl who rushed 3 years ago--and that was at a smaller Southern school.

When I was rushing as a transfer, I remember one sorority member going on and on happily about a lot of minor activities I'd been in at my first school.:eek: I had not even mentioned those activities on my application!

I just thought I'd throw this in: just because there's no one from ABC University or XYZ sorority in your area doesn't mean that people aren't checking up on you! This year alone, I've received calls or emails from members of these sororities asking me to check up on certain local girls: Alpha Gam, AOII, Chi O, Tri Delt, Kappa, and Phi Mu. I feel good that members of other groups are trusting me to help them with membership...I like to think they realize that if I know the girl (or can find someone who does), I'll be truthful and not catty because hey, we're all looking for good new members to represent the Greek system.

I suspect that you're using "selective" to refer to just the Greek system, and not the quality of academics.

The most academically selective schools don't HAVE to check for GPA. I would imagine that at an Ivy, MIT, Stanford, Georgetown, Chicago or even the good state schools...most, if not all, of the PNMs have at least a 3.0.

You would be surprised...I went to Wash U--which is becoming harder and harder to get into...and VERY academically rigorous once you're there. I did very well in high school (over a 4.0), all honors and AP classes...and I had a 2.85 1st semester of my freshman year because I took 17 credits and read no less than 1,500 pages a night for all of my classes (on top of being social like most freshman try to be). Just because people are at a good school does not mean that once they are there they still always get good grades. I managed to dig myself out of a hole and never had a semester lower than 3.62 after that...but still. I think you're making a very huge and wrong generalization. Even the 'smart' schools check GPA--ESPECIALLY if they have deferred rush. The minimum GPA to rush when I did in Jan. '99 was a 2.0 and the chapter with the highest requirement had a 2.7--and there were girls who couldn't make that!

Ummm...you're wrong. I was Panhel President at an Ivy with deferred rush, and we didn't check GPA. I've spoken with other Panhel presidents at other Ivies...and they didn't check either. So, who's making the "very huge and wrong generalization," when I'm speaking of my own experience as the person who basically ran recruitment for a "selective" school?

Besides, I was speaking of the GPAs listed on rush applications--which are predominately first-year and transfer students. I don't know anyone who's gotten into the schools I listed with anything less than a 3.0. Once you're in, it's a different story.

Do I need to make things even more clear? :confused: