I think this way: certain rituals/traditions such as the line names in spanish shouldn't be changed. But PROGRAMMING, I feel that is a different issue. I believe that programming is a function of the chapter, thus based entirely on what the chapter is or composed of. It is a fine line, but I think as long as we stay true to our purpose, which I believe is creating quality men who live by the principles we teach, I don't think it is going to be a real issuse for the founders.

quick hijack

FYI wrussell -

I'm only pretending to be nice to you...because, after all, I AM a Georgia Bulldog. SIC EM!

:p

GREEK UNITY!!

/hijack

OH GOLLY...those ugly dogs...when was the last time you beat us? LOL LOL I am just kidding, beause I don't like our football team either. I always root for UGA at Florida/Georgia.

Ohhh - you were raised RIGHT sweetie!!

Of course...LOL.

So then at that point, do you change from a Latino org to a multicultural org? I think that is where the whole multicultural org confusion begins, because for most GDIs, programming is what they see as the representation of the organization and what they stand for. If the org is full of African-Americans, Asians, Caucasians, and Latinos, representated at the time, then when do you draw the line and say, we need to focus on the Latino culture our organization was founded to represent vs. we need to represent the membership? I think all orgs are dedicated to having quality membership that lives to their purpose but the question then becomes what is the main purpose the organization was founded on. Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most orgs based on one specific culture or another have the purpose of advancing their specific culture or helping that specific community or addressing problems that arise in that specific community or at least to strengthen the bond between people who feel invested in that culture?

That's actually what I'm trying to get at. If at some point SLB DOES decide to switch from Latino based, multicultural to simply dropping the 1st part and becoming solely multicultural, would it still be SLB? Or would it be something entirely new?

I agree completely. We are Latino-based, thus our focus is going to be Latino culture and the unpbringing and proliferation of that culture. But at the same time, we do say: Thus our focus maybe one thing, but our mission states that we are based in CULTURE, but refuses to deny us the ability to focus on other just as we focus on latin culture. I don't hold SLB up against TNX or your org, because we were not founded on that multicultural stance. We grew into those values, but still do not compare to your total commitment.

For Private I - If we drop that, we drop our letters. We can't lose the first part. We would be a new organization. At least that is my view.

Here is where my concern lies. I would leave my organization if, one day, the membership somehow became relatively uniform (culturally) and all the programs were geared toward that one culture...AND THEN the National Organization decided to change its focus to that one culture. I don't know if that makes sense...

Example: In 75 years, the membership of Theta Nu Xi is 85% Latina, so at that time, it is decided that Theta Nu Xi Multicultural Sorority, Inc. will now be Theta Nu Xi Latin Sorority, Inc. - but still maintaining the dedication to multicultural membership.

This is unlikely, but it seems that some older organizations are coming to a point now that they are, in effect, cloaking their original foundations in an effort to embrace the newer multicultural movement - the reverse of what I was describing.

I don't see the bad in a member proudly claiming that his/her organization is Latin/Asian/Black/etc. with a firm commitment to multicultural membership (especially since multiculturalism DOES exist within each of the broader cultures - Latin/Asian/Black/ etc.)

What I observe, with sororities in particular, is members of culturally-specific organizations being OFFENDED when a non-member refers to the org as Latin/Asian/Black/etc. and correcting to say "We are a multicultural organization."

To me, it's like saying, "I'm ashamed that I joined a culturally-specific organization and I want to change the org's entire image to reflect the push for diversity and multiculturalism."

I know that most orgs these days are thrilled to have multicultural membership and many are highly diverse (from what you describe, SLB is one such organization that is quickly becoming very diverse.)

But I would be embarassed to try to say that a multicultural org is any more desirable than a culturally-specific org. And, that is what I'm seeing from too many members of culturally-specific orgs.

Last thing - on the other hand, we have NPHC orgs that are very clear that while they openly welcome diverse membership, they will not be changing their focus, mission, programming or anything to suit the non-Black members. If you join, you know that you will be almost exclusively serving one broad culture.

I completely agree. I am proud of our diverse membership and we will always (because we are mostly latino) in the Hispanic world, but I am also proud that we diversify to other programming and try to be come involved in other programming.

I completely agree with you. I've seen members from a latina sorority in one region (that doesn't have a high latina population) not even admit that they were founded on the advancement of latinas. But then members from the SAME sorority in another region (that has a high latina poplulation) not even mention the word multicultural. It really makes me question why a non-latina can be interested in that sorority. I truly believe in uplifting all cultures but I would NEVER join an organization that will advance another culture before I would advance my own.

I mentioned this in another thread but I am also confused by why there are so many multicultural sororities popping up every day. It seems like multicultural organizations can't be as strong as they can be because people are forming an organization that has the SAME principles as another but they just change around the colors. It almost seems like people don't want to work anymore to join a solid organization. The NPHC wouldn't be as strong as they are now if there were as many black organizations as there are multicultural organizations.

Private I under stand Your feelings.

The thing is, if you get into an Ogranizatoin who puts the BEST FOOT forward and turn in to something not expected, get out!

Being a Member of a Greek Organization is supposed to be a Special Thing.

So, Now, We have MCGLOs and LGLOs so what?

It is because Members who are looking are not happy with what they were looking for!


They as an Individual who looked somewhere else for a reason!

Young Men/Women should Look to who they feel comforatable with!:cool:

I agree with this post. I have had conversations with members of a specific latina sorority where they have said oh, we're a multicultural sorority too. And like brownsugar said, other members from other chapters would say, no, we're Latina, not multicultural. I almost think that it's a situation about what makes you appealing on that campus. I've seen girls be interest for a Latina org, then drop line when they become pledges or before because they realize that it isn't multicultural. I don't understand it myself, because I joined my organization because I BELIEVED in the purpose and what the ladies stood for. I can't imagine joining an organization that I believed was multicultural only to find it perpetrating itself. Just another reason why research is crucial before you pledge.

I think that's something that many people wonder (including myself). Maybe if there are any founders of these newer orgs on this board, they can explain.

To me, it comes across as people wanting the prestigue of being a founder of an organization. There is no reason to me at this point to start the 30th multicultural sorority. I wonder if people research ALL of the existing orgs before they decide to start their own, because out of all of the organizations out there, I can't imagine that at this point, there isn't something for everyone.


From looking at websites and talking to ladies I've met that have started their own sorority, it seems like some people have a bad experience pledging another org, so they decide to start their own. Whether that be they dropped line, were dropped off line, or had expections that were different (not better or worse in all cases) than what the org was.

Since ALL of the national and I'm sure some of the regional and local orgs are expanding, I wonder if one day it will be like some of the NPC/IFC orgs, where some of the smaller local orgs will attempt to join one of the larger sororities.

I think the "so what" is that with the concept of an organization that is multicultural by definition and by purpose being so new, it is hard for us to establish what we mean and what we stand for. When you have organizations that don't fall into the category of multicultural that present themselves as such or claim to be, then it makes it even harder for us to establish ourselves.

Also, as preciousjeni said, NPHC is not ashamed to say they are culturally based. You never heard of a Delta or AKA saying yeah we're a multicultural sorority have you? No. And you never will, even though they have a multicultural membership, they will never sway from their roots. Their programming reflects their roots, not the fact they happen to have a member or two that are not African-American. I think what me, preciousjeni, and Private I are trying to get across (and please please correct me if this is off base) is that is seems that some Latina/o chapters and/or orgs seem to be okay with swaying from their culturally founded roots to claim to be multicultural when they are not. It makes no sense if you are proud of what you pledged to claim to be something you're not, especially when NOBODY was claiming to be multicultural until recently. I think myself, I just am trying to understand why.

Sigma Lambda Beta is a Latino-based Multicultural Fraternity. What this means is that we were founded by mostly latinos, but our principles state we are based on cultural understanding. Also our membership grows more multicultural by the day, but I do not feel that we are perpetrating because we have begun to do more different programming nor to appear more attractive on our campus.

I, too, cannot understand the "flip-flopping." My organization, Lambda Theta Nu Sorority, Inc. is a LATINA sorority. That is never going to change, even if the demographics of the membership do. We will always serve the Latina/o community. Our purpose for existing will never change. We do welcome qualified ladies of all backgrounds, but if they pursue the organization, they do so with full understanding that our efforts will primarily go towards the betterment of the Latina/o community. (I say "primarily" because we do also participate in campus events, academic programs, women's empowerment activities, etc. that are not necessarily directed toward a Latina/o audience.)

That being said, I would also like to say that I strongly support the sororities out there that are multi-cultural in founding, in principle, and in membership. I think you are a vital part of campus life, and you are a support system for so many women, from so many different backgrounds. It is very nice to see the increased recognition that the true multicultural sororities are now receiving. There is strength in organizations of one predominate background, and there is strength in organizations with members of many backgrounds.

There are many BGLOs, but you don't hear as much about them because their membership and impact aren't as apparent as that of the NPHC BGLOs that have stood the test of time and settled well into the niche that they have carved.

I believe this is the case with a number of orgs. There are those that will rise to the top. Look, also, at the number of NPC/IFC orgs. But, as many as there are, the number of similar orgs in the U.S. far outnumbers them. It is just that they rose to the top in their niche.

The same goes for all orgs including MCGLOs.

You're correct in summarizing my concern but I want to add one thing. Latin organizations are not alone in this. I've seen it in a number of culturally-based orgs.

I don't want to take this thread into a completely other direction, but I want to point out that this is the argument of the NPC/IFC posters on GC. Although the orgs were founded by majority white, the current orgs are becoming quite diverse; thus bringing confusion to the definition of a "multicultural org."

(Somebody else post! I'm turning into a thread troll!)

What a wonderful compliment and astute observation!!

Actually brownsugar, there are a lot of people that join culture specific orgs. that are not members of those specific cultures and I do not think there's anything wrong with that. I do think that it's a personal choice whether a Latina is a member of a BGLO or someone white joined an Asian-interest sorority. But once you do join one of them, you have to understand that the programming etc WILL be geared towards that specific group and that exceptions don't really have to be made, because the members aren't swaying from the original purpose of their org.'s founding.

To Tom: I agree that if people aren't satisfied with what their campus offers, they should look into other things. I think it is the 'founderitis' movement that we were discussing though.

Agree with both parts. I would never join a Asian sorority and expect there to all of a sudden be a few programs geared towards African-Americans just because I'm around. If I joined an Asian sorority, it would be because I wanted to be involved in the Asian interest programming, not to get more African-American's involved in the organization.

And yes..there is a big rash of founderitis now a days. And it seems to be catching...

Thanks for that :) I think that all types of organizations work to make the greek system what it is and it's the option we have to join different organizations that makes our decision and dedication to the one we decide to join even more.

Sigma Lambda Gamma National Sorority Inc. is, as I have said before, a Historically Latina Sorority with Multicultural Membership. I have explained this in my own words, but I would like to quote here what the National Organization as a whole has to say about this:
SLG
Our Guiding Mission & Vision Statement

Mission Statement

Sigma Lambda Gamma strives to be the premier organization committed to providing a mechanism of empowerment to all women.

Through a network of close to 3,000 multicultural sisters from collegiate chapters and alumnae associations located across the United States, we promote academic excellence and higher education for all women via a dedication and incorporation of the sorority principles – Academics, Community Service, Cultural Awareness, Morals & Ethics, and Social Interaction – in our lives.

Vision Statement

Recognizing our responsibility to the progression of a positive global community, we stress the importance of morals, ethics, and education in our daily lives so that we serve the needs of our neighbors through a mutual respect and understanding of our varying cultures.


These statements are intended to make clear the path that our growth and programming is to take into the future. The programming offered by Sigma Lambda Gamma should be multicultural in aspect if only to fulfill our vision statement, if not, and this should be the real purpose, to fulfill each member's personal values and desires for the growth and education of every woman, something we all should hold dear to us.

I have, in the past, been questioned about the focus of my sorority, and why we bother with multicultural programming when we are clearly a Latina organization (something abundantly evident on my campus), and what I said then is just as true today: Regardless of the race, ethnicity, creed, culture, nationality, or any other difference in women, Sigma Lambda Gamma is here to serve for the advancement and education of every woman, everywhere.

It makes sense to me! This is probably stupid, but Doctors Without Borders popped into my head. The group is made pretty much completely of doctors, but there is diversity even among them. Their goal is to help everyone in need.

"MSF was founded in 1971 by a small group of French doctors who believed that all people have the right to medical care regardless of race,religion, creed or political affiliation, and that the needs of these people supersede respect for national borders. It was the first non-governmental organization to both provide emergency medical assistance and publicly bear witness to the plight of the populations they served." -- From their website

"We are by nature an organization that is unable to tolerate indifference. We hope that by arousing awareness and a desire to understand, we will also stir up indignation and stimulate action." -- Rony Brauman, MD, Former President, MSF

hmm...the thing about Doctors without Borders is that they pick and choose whom to help-I remember in Kosovo they would help Albanians but refused to assist Serbs...I found that ironic...

That's unfortunate and just goes to show that nothing is pure. :(

I pm'ed you.

Here is another primarily Latina GLO (accepts others from what I can tell)....

Lambda Sigma Gamma Sorority Inc. Alpha chapter was founded at Cal State Univ, Sacramento (CSUS) Oct 24, 1986. The national link is currently inactive.

The Chico State Univ (Gamma) link is http://www.csuchico.edu/lsg/lsg.html

Lambda Sigma Gamma was founded as a multicultural sorority. However, I believe this is one of the organizations that, while founded as specifically multicultural, is actually not reflecting the original mission in its membership.

Hey audaz! I was meaning to post this but forgot. From the Demographics section of your national website:

This backs up what I was saying before about the fact that broad cultures have enormous diversity within them. Would you still say that

or should non-Latinas be expected to fulfill the organization's dedication to "explore the richness in the traditions of Latina culture."

(Or am I completely misreading your previous statements??)

There is one aspect about Latino/a Greeks and whether they are multicultural that seems to be forgotten. I think non-latino/a people often lump anyone from Mexico, Central and South America as all one cultural. Truly they are all very different from country to country. Or at least here in Los Angeles differences are made about where people are from.

From the women I know at work, in my sorority and some of the Latina Greeks (CSUDH has KDChis, SIAs, and Sigma Lambda Gamma) the women don't only celebrate the fact that they are Latina but their distinct cultural heritage. Let me tell you I've heard some interesting discussions between Mexican, El Savadoran, Guatemalan, Chilean, Puerto Rican, and Belizian women and the differences in their cultures. I have also learned a lot from these women about the differences as well.

So in essence although they are celebrating Latino/a culture they are truly multicultural in every sense of the word.

jeni~

i don't think i understand your last question to me, so i can't really reply... can you try to rephrase it? thanks

Certainly. My question is regarding whether or not you believe (A) that all members, including non-Latinas, of Sigma Lambda Gamma should be fulfilling the organization's commitment to "the richness in the traditions of Latina culture"

or

(B) that non-Latina members can expect that the organization will incorporate elements of their own cultures and move in a direction other than Latina culture?

[I broke up the sentence because it was way too long!]

The way I see these two options, (A) is what NPHCs currently do. Regardless of your background, if you join, you know you will be committed to the original purpose of serving the black community.

And, (B) is kinda what NPCs attempt to do, but we have to remember that these orgs are social not service or political. While they historically would have been more involved in issues related to Caucasians, as the chapters become more diverse, the events and programs are diversifying as well.

It may just be me, but I see the answer to that question in the quote that you used from our national webpage.

"Sigma Lambda Gamma believes that Culture is Pride, Pride is Success. We explore the richness in the traditions of Latina culture. This encompasses the cultural heritages of Native Americans (North, Central and South), Europeans, Africans, Asians and their multiple and interesting mixtures. We celebrate the diversity of the backgrounds of all the members of our sorority. Through these efforts in cultural awareness, we expect that each woman will explore their roots and traditions and share those with other individuals so that cultural understanding and respect are promoted. We hope to create new traditions for future generations of women to celebrate their identity and heritage with pride and joy throughout the college years."

The bolded sections of the above quote show that while we do emphasize the Latina cultures as a rule, each woman must contribute her own cultural background and knowledge to truly fulfill the mission of Sigma Lambda Gamma. The focus of each chapter of our organization is shaped by the membership of that chapter. There are no limits on what cultures Sigma Lambda Gamma will learn and teach about.

Is that what you were asking?

This is a quote from the SLG website:

Sigma Lambda Gamma is the largest national Latina-based sorority with a diverse multicultural membership in the United States.

So based upon that, I would say that SLG is a Latina sorority. Now as someone said earlier in this forum, there are women I know who swear to the death that SLG is a multicultural sorority. I also know women whow swear to the death that SLG is a Latina sorority. The website says it's a Latina sorority.

Audaz, my question for you, is SLG becoming and/or working towards becoming a multicultural sorority? Obviously if you are incorporating the programming of your multicultural membership that is one step in that direction. What would happen if someone decided to name a line in a language other than Spanish? Is that acceptable? I guess my question is how far can you go before you cross that line that takes you from a Latina based organization to a multicultural organization. The other question is does SLG mind crossing that line based upon the demographics page of your website?

this is kind of off-topic, but to phisigduchess I don´t think Belize is considered Latin American

I hear what you're saying which is why I don't understand why a predom. Latina sorority must be one(Latina) or the other(multi-cultural), but not both. Only here in the US is everyone lumped into the category of "Hispanic" with no regard to anything else (Dominicana, Puerto Rican, etc.). The Latino culture is so diverse within itself that to me, it would only seem natural that their programing would be (culturaly speaking in terms of the entire Latino community).

Oh yeah, the largest group of people in Belize is Hispanic, but the its really a mix of a lot of stuff (Creoles, etc.)

Yes - this makes sense. I think rocketgirl may have said what I'm trying to say better than I did. How far will SLG go away from her Latina roots before either the sorority is no longer Latina or there is a huge overhaul to bring it back to a Latina focus?

I don't think that's something one person can answer. It will be interesting to see what happens in the future.

At Honeykiss --

I couldn't agree more about lumping people together. But, I think we're confusing "race" and "culture" here. Within Latino culture, there are many, many races. But, there is some sort of tie that binds. And, there are specific concerns that a Latino person would be addressing that those outside the culture would not.

Belize is in Central America and as such people from Belize are usually considered to be Latino. Belize is like a few other countries in Central and South America were there are large populations of people of African descent so much of their population is very much mixed. A couple of my old coworkers were Belizian so i learned a lot from them about their country and culture. Also, I studied Latin American history and politics as part of my undergrad Political Science degree.

With my current coworkers and fellow students quite a few would disagree with you about all the races within the Latino culture being one "Latino culture". As I said earlier there's been some pretty interesting discussions between my current coworkers who are Panamanian, Mexican, Salvadoran, and Guatemalan. They all make sure that we understand they are different cultures. Many of them have different Indian cultures mixed in with the Spanish influence that have major influences on their cultures as a whole.

Same thing within my chapter, a couple years ago when we discussed the differences between cultures and they made a point that the Chilean, Puerto Rican, Mexican, Salvadoran, Guatemalan, etc cultures are all very different. they may speak a similar language but they stress that their cultures are very different. One of the sisters said to think of it as between being American, Canadian, British, Scottish, Welsh, Irish, Australian, etc. Very much caucaisan based countries with English as a similiar language but the cultures are all different and even the languages have slight differences



Regarding Sigma Lambda Gamma, at CSUDH in Los Angeles they are very proud that they are a Latina sorority and it is mentioned in their advertisements. But they are also proud that they are open to women regardless of race and prove it by their membership. i wonder if on some of the campus in areas without a large Latina population, where infact the Latina population is very small (CSUDH is over 26% Latino/a so we are have a large population) they emphasize more of the multicultural aspect in order to be able to continue to succed on these campuses at the same time they are teaching women more about Latinas as a whole (does that make sense?)

It is very interesting to read how different people view themselves in regardes to race, culture, etc. One of my majors is Latin American and Caribbean Studies and Belize is always taught as a Caribbean country rather than a Latin American one-probably because the language spoken is English, unlike most of the other countries of Central and South America. It is lumped in the similar category as Guyana, Surinam, etc. (being countries that do not fit the usual Latin American stereotype as Spanish-speaking).

Haiti and Brazil were also focused upon separately (especially Brazil).

If anyone on GC is from Belize I'd love to hear your perspective.