Quote:

Originally posted by sunnydays96: My friends don't go to the store and buy products because "I've got my own little shop" as they say.

That's JUST what we were talking about. Remember what we said about Black people not supporting their own?

Quote:

I just took offense to those who just assumed that because someone uses "what works" that they don't support black businesses which was the main point of the question.

Since I am the person that started this thread, I can safely say that THAT WAS NOT THE PURPOSE OF THIS THREAD. If you think that was the main point then you missed something.

The main point of the FIRST post was as follows:

1. To make black people aware of which products in the beauty industry are black owned.

2. To suggest that black people purchase black owned products whenever possible.


You took it way to personally. I'm guessing because you felt you had been lumped in the "what works" category.

I too tend to use what works. Because I cut my hair verrrrry short last year, I'm looking for products that will stimulate my scalp. Unfortunately, the BB supergrow products only weigh my hair down and pink oil does nothing for me. I did recieve alot of results when I used the new organic line (scalp fertilizer, carrot oil, and olive oil). My hair's never looked so healthy.

So, now the famed question - is there a black owned product that is similar to the organic products (yes, I've tried the optimum hairdresses as well and they don't work for me)?

Poplife, I don't know how to use the stupid "quoting" mechanism, but what I was referring to was the post where you said that (and I'm paraphrasing here, so bear with me) nobody even asked you which black hair products worked best.

And no, I don't think you would tell me to use NAIR as hair grease (LOL), I think concern would come from my belief that you would be judging me somewhere deep inside.


Miss. Mocha

May I ask where in NYC is Carol's Daughter located ... as for the rest of the conversation I will pass - thanx!!

Miss Mocha to use a quote:
say you want to quote my message on the top right side is a paper with an arrow, click on it, it will open the page just as if you were going to post regularly you can deleted pieces of the quote of leave all of it in, try this..hope it works for you!! Now two quotes in one post as I have noticed for the first time on this thread I don't know how to do ...sorry

I'll have to try it.Thanks Poplife.

I STILL say that it's mighty funky/counterproductive to act all judgemental of people while you're telling them to rally around the black unity cause. It's extremely CATTY and uniformed to suggest that saying "buying what works" necessarily means buying non-black (now who's got black unity issues?). And no, I'm not going to run down my "I'm down with being black" resume just to feel valid in this discussion either.

And again, I STILL feel that, though I always give brothers and sisters first dibs on my money for a number of things, I WILL NOT tolerate bullsh#t on any level: service, price, product and generally accepted business practices. I don't tolerate BS from any biz owner, be they a multinational corporation, a non-black- or black-owned small or medium-sized business. Period. And yes, I GO OUT OF MY WAY to patronize the few black businesses here in Chicago that are "standin' on somethin'" in terms of my aforementioned criteria. However, there are far too few black businesses who give half a damn about appealing atmosphere, competitive price (yeah, I'll buy it from you for more, but there IS a limit), prompt service and progressive marketing (let's do something other than a wack-@ss, fuzzy ad in the local black newspaper, shall we?)-and that's real. Any time I find a black biz doing otherwise, I'm falling over myself trying to support them. Alas, I don't fall over myself often.

That said, Poplife et al, what are you doing to spread this message of unity, besides jumping out of your skin to be caustic on this board?

There is one in Brooklyn across the street from Brooklyn Tech High School. Spike's Joint used to be there. I moved to NJ but it was there a few months ago when I moved.

I spread A message black of unity. Just because I post about ONE TYPE of unity doesn't mean that that's only kind I know or the only kind I lobby for. If you really want to know, for the most part I spread my message in real life, not on a message board.

How do I do it? Anyway I can! I read at black poetry slams, attend/speak at Town Hall meetings, submit articles to the school newspaper, attend black political/social group meetings...the list is endless. I'm always looking for new ways to share my thought and hear other people's (even if I don't like it).

You think I am "jumping out of my skin to be caustic". That's hardly the case. I'm not trying to attack anyone, I'm simply challenging what folks are saying to get a better insight. I could be a little nicer I guess, but hey, when it comes to things like this I'm not nice. I'm hard-nosed and somewhat deaf to kindness. I'm not trying to change anyone here, but I am not going to hold my tongue or sweeten up for anyone either. My posts are worded exactly how I'd say them in real life. Call me militant, judgmental, radical, or whatever. I am what I am...and sometimes I think if we JUDGED our ideals, position in society, thoughts, actions, and beliefs we get a better view of ourselves as a people.

I'm not saying what I am saying in hopes that people will agree with me because I KNOW most people don't. If I wanted people to "Amen" everything I'm saying I'd go somewhere where people think and act exactly like me.

Poplife: You are missing my point. You seem to think you're the only one up in here who lives a concious life. You aren't, and I think the many of us who are very in tune with what's happening/needs to happen on the black cultural, politcal and economic stage resent the fact that you carry yourself as if you are the only pro-black person on this forum.

What exactly did I say that caused you to come to this conclusion?

this is a very interesting topic and i see that i have been using a combination of products. like many of you that posted i use what works for my hair. i am however a little distressed by the back and forth comments that are making a consciousness-raising thread into unnecessary arguments. the message may have come off in a not so positive manner for some, but the bottom line is that we need to be aware of who we are supporting and make conscious choices after receiving the information. its threads like this that make a sista not want to come and visit http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif.

You're feeling me huh darling1? http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/confused.gifI was thinking that I'd better not even get in on this one. There were to many consequences and reprocussions (sp) http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif This is a forum where we all should agree to disagree even if we feel Soooooo STRONGLY about the topics. This seems to have turned into a personal battle so to speak. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif

it's kinda like sugar coated ribbing (pretending to play nice but throwing in pot shots at one another.)

I still have love for yall so can we stop this before it turns into world war 3? http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif




[This message has been edited by exquizit (edited January 19, 2001).]

YES! I love this forum but this is thread is getting a little HEATED. I wanted to ask peeps where can I get carrot oil in New Jersey but I got scared. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

Girl, they carry carrot oil in the small african american section in Wal-Mart! I've seen it everywhere these days.......Have you tried Wal-Mart in your area?

ex,

you always have my back girl!!!!!! you need to call me chica!!! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/tongue.gif.

POSITIVELY AKA and WOMAN OF VIRTUE: your points are well stated and thought out but they are INVALID. The points you make are like two announcers coming into the second half of a game and then start giving analysis as to why one team is winning and the other is losing. Blacks are different than any other minority in this country. They can not be compared on any level. We never grew up in our own country, never educated in our own language, never gained a sense of self-worth in this country, never allowed to be educated, never allowed to develop the entrepreneurial skills to take us past owning juke joints and chicken shacks. To constantly compare us to Chinese, Korean, Cuban and East indian immigrants (the so-called successful ones) is wrong. These people come here with business skills having been educated or owning businesses in their own countries. Only the strong families and cream of the crop are coming. The drunks, drug addicts, non-family oriented ones are back in the slums and villages of their home countries. The majority of the successful Cubans in Miami were the ruling or merchant class in Cuba before they came to Miami. Immigration is set up so that only the economically viable families and communities come here as a whole. They stick together because they are all of the same family and community when they get here. They stick together because of the language barrier. They stick together because they pooled their money together to get here so they are already inter-dependent when they arrive. None of that is similar to our experience here. African -Americans have always had to play catch-up. Immigrants arrive here with the necessary tools for success. All they need is an opportunity. Thats why they are here. I just wish that we would stop bashing ourselves by always comparing ourselves to other people negatively. I know way more successful Black folk than failures. Lets celebrate that for a change. Black America has a top ten GNP. Why are we arguing about the success of some Korean weave place? Just the fact that POPLIFE can rattle off 20 plus Black owned products must mean that there are some successful Black entrepreneurs. I celebrate our success. Damn the negativity!!!

I haven't commented on this topic, but I had to comment on what DoggyStyle said. Brotha, you made a lot of sense! I liked everything you said. Preach on!

tickledpink: I feel you. Sometimes I think Optimum and Luster's are playing we me! My hair laughs at me if I come at it with some Pink Oil. *lol*

My favorite nowadays is Carol's Daughter. (www.carolsdaughter.com)

Their skin/hair products are all organic. They are so popular sometimes it can take a while for them to fill your order because they get overwhelmed. I'm a big fan of their growth promoting shampoo and their hair milk. When I go to NYC I'm going to visit her store and stock up. I too use olive oil once a week to keep my hair happy and you don't have to use o.o. made especially for hair. I used generic o.o. from Safeway and my hair just eats it up. Many things I used to by in the store I found I can make at home and it saves me a lot of money.


Miss. Mocha, I'm glad you don't think I'm some natural psycho trying to "cure" the permed heads of the world. *lol* I just love talking about hair/beauty, and even though I no longer perm, I still like to share old beauty secrets I used when I was chillin' with Dudley's. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif If people don't constantly remind me that I have natural hair then I don't show my militant/judgmental side. Some people just love to point it out like I didn't know. That drives me crazy!

It's good that you can celebrate our success, but I dont because I feel it can be alot more.

Some people are not happy until they have reached their full potential. Others settle for what they've got.



[This message has been edited by Poplife (edited January 20, 2001).]

We are just chatting, I got called on the most and I don't think it is that bad, not to want to come back!! Just because we don't agree does not mean we are not hearing all points made. I don't think POPLIFE was being militant or what have you I just don't like what she has to say, in other words maybe she is saying it wrong (at least wrong to me) ...but I could care less about how HARSH or not she or anyone else is being.

ADDED: she or anyone else

[This message has been edited by LadyAKA (edited January 20, 2001).]

What is hair mayonaise? where do I get olive and carrot oil?

Do any black-owned companies sell these?

As an excuse for what? That we have to play catch-up? That like abused women and children, we have developed self-destructive issues as a race that are hard to overcome?. Why must we continue this self examination that always leaves us feeling less than everyone else? There is less Black unemployment, more home ownership, more Black-owned businesses than ever before. Less teenage pregnancy. An expanding Black middle -class. I feel great about being Black. I never compare myself to the least of us. The least part of these "model minorites" are not here for us to reflect upon. Yes we can be more as a race, but then again, we can always be more as individuals. Do you realize that all of this gnashing of teeth about how we compare to others is really the self-hatred that you claim to oppose? It is not just the crabs at the bottom of the barrel that are holding us back. It is also the ones that have made it out who look back in and tell the rest that they are not trying hard enough rather than encouraging them. My last post on this subject, don't want to monopolize your forum.

Original you are silly ... I am over hear LOL, yes I think Black people make those products too!!! It has gotten heated in here, but just as I am THICK headed, I know others are also so I had to let it go, I can't fight an uphill battle at least not over the internet ... everyone is listening, and wants a word edgewise but no one is really understanding the underlying theory. POPLIFE (and others that had her back) I am sorry that I am not Korean or of any other background and I don't support JUST BECAUSE ... Gotta do what works, and I really don't think that is selfish but I have learned a couple of things!! Thanx

There's merit in what you've said. Many black-owned businesses have the same cut-throat capitalistic attitude as those white businesses that daily exploit us. Some of the stuff I've seen FUBU sell(however nice) had a markup rate much higher than that of their white counterparts. They KNOW they would be a profitable business EVEN IF they sold their wares at K-Mart prices; and yet they go straight for our vains when they price their stuff. Many of the black-owned companies do the same thing. I think whenever we shop for anything, we shouldn't do it at a place that don't have our interests at heart; and I would't suggest supporting them. I do, however, think we should try our best to support thoses businesses that do what they can to help the community that keeps them in business. I don't think we should get bent out of shape over such details as what store you bought the products from though. Most black-owned companies are not as resourceful as their white counterparts; and therefore can't provide a long, wide product line. They don't have stores in every community of every state like their publicly-held competition does either. So I think whenever and however we can, we should support our own. I think that was the point Poplife was making, and I agree.

DoggyStyle82 I wanted to write you personally but no email listed so I just wanted to say thank you for saying the words that I could not compose in these three pages.

I never lean on excuses for my failures, and I don't think DoggyStyle82's post intended to come across that way, if so I don't see that as the totality of the message. And why must it be thought of as settling? Oh my I better leave 4 real this time!!

Thanx I'll check it out. I guess Original Ape will too! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

thanks!

I will!!!

I don't necessarily think that comparing our success to the success of others is self hatred. I also don't think that today's generation has that same fire that our parents and grandparents had. They were boycotting buses and stores, facing police dogs, fire hoses, jail time and other indignities. They didn't allow slavery and racism to hold them back. The things that didn't kill them made them stronger. Present generations aren't taking advantage of all the opportunities past generations made for us. Racism is part of the problem, but it's not the whole problem.



[This message has been edited by MIDWESTDIVA (edited January 20, 2001).]

To Discogoddess, hey your point is being missed, mine is, and others are. Hey I think she's missing her own. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

I agree with Doggystyle82 wholeheartedly. But I would like to know when will we stop using slavery as an excuse for not succeeding. There are more African American college graduates than ever before. Why aren't we realizing our full potential? Is it because we still have the crabs in a barrel syndrome?



------------------
"In three words I can sum up everything I've learned about life: It goes on." ~Robert Frost

Doggy Style: everything that you said was TRUE & very well put.

We should Celebrate Our Successes and stop discounting ourselves.

To DoggyStyle82:
I tried to do the message quote thing, but my computer was taking way too long, so I may mess up some of your quotes, but I'll try not to http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif.
When I lived in the Dominican Republic, I took some grad classes on life in the caribbean. During one section, we dealt w/ quality of life for Blacks throughout the diaspora. According to the World Health Organization (I believe these stats' come from 1995-1996, but not 100% sure. I do know they are definitely post 1994.) an international organization that among many other things, places rankings on the quality of life. Now I don't know the methodology used for these rankings, but I do know that this group is internationally recognized and validated for the work that they do. Anyway, according to the article we were reading, the quality of life for whites in amerika was ranked number 6. The quality of life for blacks in america was number 37. the quality of life for Blacks in america was rated as far worse than life for many so-called third world countries. We were ranked 7 above Haiti (not meant to slander Haiti, but understanding that Haiti is a country in economic and political distress). Black women (roughly 6%of the total american population) make up the LARGEST group of new AIDS cases. 52% of Black men in the district of columbia are in some way involved in the criminal justice system (jail time, parole system, etc.). That is slightly more than half of the men in chocolate city.

And we all know that the stat's are growing worse everyday. So in this way, it is unfair to compare us to other groups that come here. However, it is BECAUSE we have all of these things oppressing us that we must TAKE RESPONSIBILTY FOR OUR ACTIONS. Now if doing the little things, like challenging us to examine where we buy our hair care products will cause people to get their toes stepped on(?!?!?!?) then, what hope do we have of taking control of our destiny? Now, you may rejoice over the high GNP that Black people may hold. And, truly, I think that is great. But let us understand that those numbers are in NO WAY REFLECTIVE of the majority of Black people in this country. Just because a few of us happened to do well for ourselves, is in no way indicative of the collective prosperity. As I, a supposed member of the so called "Talented Tenth" look around at the horrific state of affairs that the remaining 90% of our people are in, I cannot rejoice that a small middle class has made it. So if I inadvertantly (sp?) step on some toes in an effort to liberate my people, then so be it. Liberation is not a comfortable issue. No one likes to do it, but that is life. Someone earlier, I can't remember who, said that the point of this thread, no matter what position one takes, is to challenge our behavior w/ regards to supporting Black businesses. Now,many people felt that they were being personally attacked, and I am sorry that they felt that way (if this does not apply to you, than disregard it). But if asking us to examine something that small, is going to cause hurt feelings and bitterness, then we have a long way to go. No matter how high our GNP, try driving a car that is reflective of your high income status (not you personally) like a Lexus or Caddy through I95 (MD, DC, PA, NJ) and see how quickly you will be pulled over. What does a high GNP matter if police can instantly view you as a common black crook? There is a danger in rejoicing so much over the small successes that we miss the bigger picture.

And by the way, Olive oil worked really well for me when I had a perm and even better now that I'm natural. Plus, here's a recipie for those looking for a natural conditioner: (if your hair falls out, I claim no responsibilty http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif, but I've used this on everyone who comes to me to do their hair and have received only thanks for it)

In 1 gallon of distilled water steep the following herbs:
1.5 TSBP sage
1.5 TSBP rosemary
1.5 TSBP burdock
1.5 TSBP nettle
(you can get the herbs at healthfood stores, they should be purchased in the dried form).
w/o straining the herbs from the water, pour a small amount into a spray bottle for everyday use. Place the rest back into the 1 gallon container and freeze until needed. You can spray this daily or just after washing, whatever works. Be sure to keep the mixture in the fridge, to maintain freshness. This works well on permed heads (great detangler) and on natural heads (picking out an afro w/ the spray is much easier). God Bless.

call a sista out why don't you http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gif Doggystlye82 you are absolutely right and i did not mean to insinuate that the black experience in america is "exactly/identical" to other minorities, it is not, your points are well taken and understood. i was merely saying that with the resources we do have it might not be a bad idea to focus more on economic unity within our own communities which "minorities and whites" have done so well at, in that mind set i see nothing invalid http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif we have made great strides individually and as a people and i recognize that, however there is still much that is lacking and i would like to hear even more suggestions on how we can help promote unity and economic prosperity within our own communities. make no mistake as we have seen on this board we will not always agree on the method which is fine, however many whites do not always agree but they do agree that they do not want blacks to hold economic power over them and with that in common they have worked together to make sure that we do not achieve pure equality with them. i think we can all agree that we want the best for our children that alone should bond us and motivate us to take some action even if it means following a method slightly different from your own, unless of course it goes against your belief in God. take care

Much respect for being for capturing everything I have been trying to say so eloquently.

Truly understanding what we as a people have to do to get "out of the bucket" is not a tea and cookies issue. If discussions on hair products can get you upset, what do you do with big issues???

When I was small I used to take riding lesson. When we were in the fields learning how to jump our horses over obstacles (logs, fences, large rocks, etc) my teacher always said the same thing over and over.

"Concentrate on what you see coming towards you. As soon as the horse leaves the ground don't get excited and stop thinking about the next 6 fences you still have to hurtle. If you do that you're sure to loose your balance and fall of the path. You must keep the focus on your tasks until you have done them all. Then celebrate..."

That's the same approach I have towards my people. I can smile for a moment each time I see some of us taking flight, but I can't ignore the fact that we still have many fences to jump. It's easy to get distracted by the positive things...

Recently I brought some college friends home with. When they got to my neighborhood they couldn't believe that such a pretty area was so nice and so BLACK. *lol* When they got to my house they all just stood in the middle of the hallway. When I asked them what was up, one of my friends said that they were afraid to move in fear they'd mess something up.

That's not the first time I have heard such things from black friends of mine. As Woman of Virtue said, how can we truly be excited that a few have made it when so many are still near or below the poverty line?


[This message has been edited by Poplife (edited January 22, 2001).]

I have read several post about the line of products called Carol's Daughter. Can someone please e-mail me or post more info about these products. Are they really good for the hair. My hair is very thick and long. Which products would work the best on my hair type. What would be suggested for more body, health, and managability. I would also like to know which skin products you guys suggest!

Thanks!

I have read several post about the line of products called Carol's Daughter. Can someone please e-mail me or post more info about these products. Are they really good for the hair. My hair is very thick and long. Which products would work the best on my hair type. What would be suggested for more body, health, and managability. I would also like to know which skin products you guys suggest!

Thanks!

I have read several post about the line of products called Carol's Daughter. Can someone please e-mail me or post more info about these products. Are they really good for the hair. My hair is very thick and long. Which products would work the best on my hair type. What would be suggested for more body, health, and managability. I would also like to know which skin products you guys suggest!

Thanks!

For those interested parties:

I have one correction to make to Poplife's post. Soft Sheen and Mizani are no longer African American owned products. Soft Sheen was bought out by L'Oreal USA in 1998.

TTT - This rusty, dusty thread...
 

For those that pressing (either with a hot comb or curling iron) their hair:

-what products are you using? :D