very curious..
 

I've been reading through all these posts and looking through the news articles. Which houses are old row at the University of Alabama? Someone posted that just because a house is old row doesn't make it part of the Machine, but through some other posts I'm lead to believe that old row and the Machine are directly connected. So if you can't tell who the Machine houses are most often associated with, who are the old row houses? Any answers would be helpful, cause I am absolutely fascinated. :rolleyes:

Old Row, New Row
 

The old row, new row distinctions don't really apply any more. Alabama built a new row in the 1960s, and some of those houses are Machine affiliated. Some came from the "old row" to the new one. The term has to do with the way certain houses were described fifty years ago. "Old-Line" vs "New Arrivals" might be a more accurate description. If you visit Alabama and ask around, you can find out pretty easily who the "old line" fraternities are. Start with DKE, then SAE. Certainly the Pikes, KAs and Sigma Nus. There are others as well. Note: this is not to say those are necessarily the top-ranked houses today, but the fraternities that were prominent/dominant at Capstone throughout most of the last century are the guiding lights of The Machine.
I hate to say this because it sounds so cliche, but if you haven't visited the University of Alabama, I don't think you can really understand this the specific culture that gives rise to the legend of The Machine.

i think me and deltasig stan and josho8 should start one at sdsu it would awesome

Re: Old Row, New Row
 

I hate to say this because it sounds so cliche, but if you haven't visited the University of Alabama, I don't think you can really understand this the specific culture that gives rise to the legend of The Machine. [/B][/QUOTE]

This is so true! I am not sure if my sorority was part of The Machine when I attended Bama in the 60's but suspect they were. Even all of the sisters/brothers of a member group are not sure who their delegate is. From what I have heard, The Machine is alive and well at Bama - although maybe not as powerful as they once were.

Greeks on any campus can accomplish the same thing by "block voting" if they will only organize themselves. It doesn't have to be secret - just say we will vote for one of ourselves and trade votes. It happens at all levels - in business and government. Greeks just need two groups to start it.

ROOOOOLLLLLLLLL TIDE!

Re: Re: Old Row, New Row
 

I have not "been" to Bama but have friends who have graduated from there and others who are still there....one of these days really soon, I plan to start making regular visits so I can see things for myself......

I have no problem with Greeks block voting etc -- even though not all Greeks are alike (although I suppose that is the raison d'etre for the Machine -- they ARE all alike)

But it seems to me like the Machine can be just as dastardly (which is why all the secrecy about certain things it has a hand in) as it can be admirable (which is why they don't seem to mind having publicity)...I guess what I don't like is that they really do not seem - from my admittedly limited perspective - to have the good of all Greekdom at heart...they just seem to have the good of the Machine in mind.....and that is sad....IMHO

:rolleyes:

I think that you would have had to be there to understand. Greeks do pretty much control the campus and, having worked with several campuses, that is not all bad. With so many administrations being anti-Greek, you have to take up for yourself. The Machine has been at Bama for so long that its secrecy is not really questioned by the Greeks - The Machine just is! Again, you would just have to have been there.

NHFULMER, I understand what you are saying and what I have read and heard from others about the machine -- I am sure that 'being there' will crystallize my perception even further.

Being Greek, I have no real problem with the notion of Greeks being in charge esp when, as you point out, there are too many anti-Greek administrators in positions of power and authority on various campuses around the country.

What I do have a problem with is the way the Machine seems to marginalize/ostracize those groups -- NPC Greek groups included
-- that they perceive as not being worthy...that is not "Greeks being in control"...rather it is "selected, worthy" Greeks being in control...

Amen.

I had never heard of the Machine. But I was reading an article on the Crimson White Online and someone posted this in reply to a Machine question:Whether this is true, or someone just stirring the pot, I don't know. But interested reading.

I was actually reading the article about the black rushee. (There was a cute picture of our house displayed). I finished reading the reader comments at the bottom of the page. And I am in shock that the Machine has, or people think a Machine has, the power to decide integration issues. :eek:
Check out these replies:
These replies are great insight into how some of the students perceive their system. Almost unbelievable to me...

wow this all sounds like a movie plot! :eek:

random question: Since some sororities/fraternities are involved with the machine, and others are not, why are the others not involved? do they not want to be involved?

and for the sororities/fraternities that *are* involved with the Machine -- do the entire chapters have to be members of Theta Nu Epsilon for them to participate? What if a chapter member does not wish to take part in it?

I read a book about Berkely fraternities in the 60-'s and they had secret societies also. The entire chapter does not participate. It's usually just the most outstanding members from the selected chapters. Can you imagine trying to have a meeting with all those people??!!!?

My best friend transferred from a Machine sorority at Bama to Texas, and she spoke about it so off-handed, I didn't realize that the existence of the Machine wasn't just common knowledge.

We don't have "secret societies" at UTexas, but we do have the sorority-within-sororities (of sorts) the Texas Cowgirls, made up of the creme de la creme girls from each of the houses. The boys have Silver Spurs and Texas Cowboys, that also cull the best of the best from all the fraternities, although not every single member is Greek (just the vast majority) and not every fraternity is represented.

"The Machine"
 

The machine has elected all but seven of the sga presidents at alabama since 1920. They have been investigated by the FBI for death threats and violent assaults and they have even place ppl into the city government to try and control the city as well. Also nearly all the Governers of alabama were sga president at U of A. Since the Machine controls who gets elected they basically control who is governer.

I am currently running for SGA Senate so I would be very interested in any other info I could get about the machine.

Good luck with your campaign but if you don't have inside information on The Machine, you aren't likely to learn anything other than rumor. Are you Greek and if so, go to your President.

Re: "The Machine"
 

I think this is a bit much.

Offer up some proof of the FBI issues?

Trying to control the city AND state? Me thinks that a group is getting blown WAY out of proportion here.

If that is out of proportion, it isn't by much. Believe me - I was there and am still involved with the University.

the machine
 

Nhfulmer....you're right. The 'rumors' aren't too far-fetched. The machine still exists although it's not nearly as secretive as it used to be. It never really recovered after the SGA was disbanded. It wasn't front page news, but once the SGA was reinstated in the late 90s you could pretty much tell who was a member and who wasn't.