Re: release figures?
 

It is my understanding that grade cuts should be done after round one for exactly the reasons you gave. It's one thing to do massive cuts first or even second night if a PNM isn't going to be bid, I can understand that. Every sorority and every individual chapter knows what it wants for her members, and not every PNM is going to fit into every chapter. But cutting for third night? Who expects massive cuts for third night?

As for getting to the third round and then getting cut, well, my heart still aches for those young women as well as all the chapters. So many people must have been hurt and it sounds like SO MUCH of this could have possibly been prevented. Congratuations to those chapters who did achieve quota (and I'm happy to see AOII there, of course!) Hopefully the other chapters will be able to quickly get there. If anyone knows numbers, is it possible for the remaining chapters to get to quota quickly? Wouldn't that be wonderful for the UGA chapters to achieve, especially after everything that happened during formal week.

This really does give a new meaning to the concept of southern/SEC recruitment. Hopefully the manditory release figures and quota-setting will be handled better there in the future.

Christin

Reading in disbelief...
 

At my school, I believe grade cuts are done before the first round of parties. Anyone who didn't make grades their freshman year is not allowed to even begin rushing. I can't imagine getting all psyched up and going to the first day of recruitment, only to find out that you were cut because of grades. I guess that is one advantage to deferring recruitment until sophomore year.

I can't believe that quota was 59! :eek: Our quota usually hovers between 20 and 25. Reading about all of these crazy southern recruitments makes me soooo glad that I went to school in the north with laid-back (well maybe not laid-back, but nowhere near as competitive), no-frills formal recruitment! :)

Red and buff roses to my Alpha Gam sisters at UGA and our 42 new members! :D That's bigger than my entire chapter!

Re: release figures?
 

33girl,

You're right... if you aren't interested in a girl, then you should drop her ASAP. However, there are some houses on campus that will, for lack of a better term, "string a girl along" for as long as possible just so that they can have a better chance with their bid list after Prefs. The heavy cutting before 3rd round this year was designed to prevent those houses from keeping a bunch of girls that they had no intention of bidding anyway. Unfortunately, it didn't work out quite the way that Panhellenic thought it would, and both the chapters and the rushees were hurt because of it. :(

This is the first year that UGA has done this type of cutting, however, so I honestly didn't really expect things to go smoothly. It will take a while to get all the kinks worked out of the system.

Rush at UGA has always been competitive, but I have to say that, overall, it has always been handled professionally by Panhellenic. These changes will take some time for everyone to get use to, but I think things will even out and, once they have, Rush should run much better for all involved. In the meantime, the houses that didn't make quota have the option of COB and, from what I understand, they are quite successful with it. :)

Some of the chapters at UT string girls along to inflate quota. Sometimes, I just wanted to take rushees aside and say, "Look, this chapter has more legacies going through than it will have room for. You're not a legacy, you're a sophomore, and you don't have a rec there. Start looking around." Sigh.

Some of the chapters at my school used to do the same thing. Then one year it went way overboard. Quota was 15 when there were only 29 PNMs attending Pref and 3 chapters amongst which to divide them. Kappa didn't get any bids that year, because all the PNMs got their first choices. So to fix that, they switched the way quota is figured. It used to be the number attending 2nd set divided by 3; now it's the number attending Pref.

This has only served to make the dirty rushing even more creative. One chapter in particular casually suggests that girls suicide, because if they don't get bidded out via the preference system, they'll be picked up in COB the following week. Of course the girls who are dirty rushed will never say that, because they buy into it and would never tell on that chapter. We took steps to reduce total so that this chapter could not do that, but we were defeated in the measure. So now Panhel's imposing a one-week waiting period between FR and COB. I'm not sure what that will do, whether it will help. Should be interesting.

KappaKittyCat,

You just described a couple of UGA chapters to a "T"! That's why Panhellenic made changes to this year's Rush. I don't think it stopped the dirty rushing though because there were several rush infractions that were meted out over the weekend to a variety of chapters. It's sad that some folks just can't seem to play by the rules... dirty rushing hurts the entire Greek system, and it tears down good PR between the NPC organizations on campus as well.

If you have to cheat, how great is that? :rolleyes:

If panhelenic KNOWS about it and nothing has dissuaded the guilty parties, then it's obvious the threat of discovery doesn't carry enough weight.

You can't blame a PNM-it isn't their place to police the system.

The fault lies with those who over the years have turned a blind eye to the practice or perhaps don't want to name their own.

Look what happens to college teams when they participate in illegal recruitment and get caught, pretty damaging consequences.

Yeah, I suppose it doesn't help that there are really no consequences. There are no sanctions. The last chapter that got caught dirty rushing had to write a letter of apology. Hell, the PNMs wouldn't know dirty rushing if it happened to them (ha ha). It's not like they say, "I was dirty rushed and I don't care." They don't even know they were. I seriously think that we should implement some PNM education. "You know you're being dirty rushed if..." :rolleyes: And if it happens, tell your recruitment counselors! It's not going to make the chapter hate you! They won't even know it was you! Chances are, if they're dirty rushing you, they're dirty rushing twenty other PNMs that same night. Besides, they have no right to do that to you. That is interfering with your right to choose free from interference (not to mention our right to rush you free from interference).

I'd really like my school to implement the rule that if you suicide, you don't get matched. No suiciding! That'd be a good way to encourage PNMs to keep an open mind during Recruitment (and kick a certain chapter in the you-know-what! Ha, serves them right!). There's no reason to think that just because a chapter's smaller, it's lame, or conversely, that just because a chapter's bigger, it's going to be more fun. I mean, really now! Do the math! If you join a small chapter, it won't be small anymore!

*ahem* Excuse me. Can you tell this is a touchy subject? It's what got my chapter down to four members this fall. I'm a little inclined to rant. I'll step down from this soapbox upon which I find myself. Gee, how did I get up here?

KappaKitty--

My school had a horrible time with women suiciding and then COB'ing at the same chapter the next week, because the chapters would tell them to. This way they make quota, plus they have women in reserve for COB. To stop this, any woman who goes through formal recruitment, suicides, and does not get a bid cannot receive a snap bid or COB with that chapter in the same semester. It has worked some...

At UF lots of chapters will keep you till late in the week before releasing you. I know it used to be worse, like in 98 when I went through. I wonder if they'll start forcing heartier releases after round 1 and 2 at UF in the future, if they've targeted UGA. Should be interesting. I agree it is a bad practice, but if that's the way the game is played... I certainly hope in the future we are able to have a more balanced system, but it's very hard when there's so many Rushees and chapters to choose from, etc. Anyway, what happened at UGA is just awful. Bad bad bad. Ok, that's enough from me.

Tara
I have a Phi Mu castle...

grr
 

It's stuff like this that makes me hate formal rush. Rush is supposed to be such a great time and so many end up getting hurt. Our dirty rushing problems happened after bids were handed out. We got a group of excellent women, and with a small school like I go to, the chapters end up fighting over the same 15-20 favorites (rush numbers were REALLY low last year). So our chapter and two others each ended up with a mix of other great girls as well as some of the "favorites." Well, one of these two other chapters would call our new members that they wanted, invite them out to their events and flat out ask them why they joined us. They'd tell them how they should've joined their group, and if they depledged, they'd be guaranteed a bid. This same chapter did this to another chapter as well, even though they made quota and were well above ceiling. They even put their NMs on our NMs, so their roommates and new friends were pressuring them to depledge.

So these poor NMs who are 17/18 and have been on campus for about two weeks are being rushed by another sorority that isn't bothering to tell them that they have to wait a year after depledging. We couldn't tell them, since none of the girls in question ever directly told us that this is what happened out of loyalty to their "new group." There were three girls, I think (which is a good number when quota's 8 or 9, from what I remember), who ended up depledging and rushing this other sorority at the end of the year.

Guess what? Only one got a bid, and our chapter and another threw a FIT because they hadn't waited a year. They almost lost her, but in the end we let them take her because it's not this girl's fault. The other two girls didn't get bids, and one ended up transferring because of it. And the chapter that did this, which has apparently been doing this for YEARS, had to put on a 10 minute presentation about "rush rules" as their sanction. However, the greek life office playing favorites is another rant. :mad:

Consequences. . .
 

This is why I think that the punishment for crap like this is no pledge class for one year and no formal rush for 1 year. That will clear this crap right up, especially when you NEED those 15 girls.

I hate to be harsh, but it seems like noone takes responsibility for their actions which break the rules because they aren't CONSEQUENTED for it. (I'm speaking from experience, I work in the psych field and I've seen it).

Like it's been said on other threads, many groups budget for rush infractions and do them anyway because a fine is "no big deal". I guarantee you, one year of everyone talking about why XYZ can't take a pledge class this year (and the rumors carrying over after that year) will make some people think twice about this.

Forgive me for offending. :: off soapbox ::

Agree....
 

I agree with you PsychTau -- shouldn't NPC be doing something MORE about this problem since it seems so prevalent?:confused:
AXOLiz, I am curious about the chapter you refer to in your email...I tell you, if it is a chapter of my sorority, I'd have no problems talking the the appropriate authorities in our chain of command...PM me if you'd rather not post it here...

I PMed you. I'm hoping to help with rush for my chapter this year (I just graduated), so any advice anyone would have as to what to do in the future would be greatly appreciated.

I'm pretty sure that NPC does not allow penalties of not allowing sororities to take new members as punishment for recruitment infractions. Barb, can you answer this? I thought I remembered this from the fine Green Book :) Or purple (I think) for the Canadian contingency!

That is correct.

DBB is right, it cannot be enforced by the school or NPC. The national HQ of the sorority, however, can enforce a penalty like this. (why they would want to shoot themselves in the foot though, I don't know...)

Ok, then on Pref night, why doesn't EVERYONE say-
" Oh Sally, there are so many things I want to tell you about how we feel, but I can't tell you because we aren't supposed to. But if I could say what is in our hearts, you would know how we feel." Ok, perfectly within the LETTER of the LAW I assume. Yet, isn't this by virtue of the implication WRONG? All I can say is sororities that use "dirty" tactics have NO ETHICAL BOUNDARIES.
If they were up to the standards of West Point for example, they would be forced to flee in humiliation.

I have seen the effects of dirty rush and it is ugly!:mad:

::Back ON Soapbox::
 

That is correct, they don't. And I'm aware of that, and right now I'm so mad I don't care!!!:mad: It seems like the consequences mean NOTHING, and for some of these women their creed, or the Panhellenic creed, doesn't either.

What consequences will make these chapters sit up and pay attention?

AAAAARRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!:mad:

OK, forgive me for freaking out up there. I just need to vent. Seems like lately I've been surrounded by people who just don't seem to care who they step on. It's just getting to me lately. (And now they are recalling my car. . Ford Focus. . .which I had to buy because my Saturn got totalled and that is what I could afford. I'm having BAD CAR KARMA!!! CRAP!!!)

I think this is the most opinionated post I've had on this board. (Inhale. . .Exhale. . .)

Does anyone know anything about a girl from Illinois? My bosses daughter was rushing, and she assured me she did not need a letter of introduction :eek:

what is her name; I might be able to find out....was she a legacy?

Pi Phi pledged 57 new angels at UGa... bringing chapter total to 168. I know quota was 59, but I am still proud of the Georgia Alpha ladies!!!!

It sounds to me that there are some serious problems with Panhel and the G.A. at UGA. I had the pleasure of sitting in on bid matching as an advisor, which was highly instructive. Everything went quite smoothly, the lists were kicked out of the system with quota set at 24. 4 out of the 7 chapters hit quota, but then there were somewhere between 12-15 girls who got kicked out of the system as non-matches. (This number may sound small but we started with only 350-400 girls signed up, of which only 250-300 actually came to rush, and then about a third more dropped out after getting cut/etc. There were serious losses after 3rd.) So anyway, at this point a lot of schools would have said "Ok, we have our lists, let's call it a night" and those girls would have just not received bids. Fortunately we have a very pro-active GA who asked us to consider trying to place these girls, reminding us that NPC allows for quota additions. So we all agreed and we were able to place all but one girl........and she was a suicide so she knew it was a possibility (and she can still COB.) There were actually 3 suicides, 2 of which were placed. A couple of the girls who did not get picked up by any of the chapters they preffed were instantly offered snap bids by the 3 smaller chapters. It worked out great. And I am thrilled to say that Chi Omega has a pledge class of 29 fantastic, top-quality women!!!!!!!

BTW, is there a Chi O chapter at UGA? Just curious.........

Yup, a very strong chapter!

I think you should double-check the GreenBook, if this was the case.

Hi Ainsley

I cant believe KKG didn't make quota at UGA. I know its a huge sorority for atlanta girls especially ones from the private schools. Anyone know how DG did this year? Just curious...

Does anyone know how Sigma Kappa did?

I believe someone reported on here that DG got 42, not including COB.

Sorry, but had to jump on the band wagon... but does anyone know how TriDelt do? And how is the chapter there? Thanks!

Go Theta Chihttp://www.plaudersmilies.de/person/mrt2.gif

*bump*

An unhappy discussion of UGa

Has anyone seen UGA's recruitment web site for this year? All I can find are old rush links and the Greek Life homepage has been "undergoing major reconstruction and will be up again shortly" since May 2002. :rolleyes:

I found the 2000 recruitment info on their site :eek:

Christin

Something that they implemented at the University of Maryland a few years ago I think is fair for both the houses and the PNMs.

I'll use a real example since it's somewhat easier to explain.

Theta gets just about 100% return after each round of rush. That is, if they invite 500 girls back to the next round, just about 500 girls will come back to Theta for the next round.

And, XYZ sorority may invite also 500 people to the next round but only 80% of the girls will come back.

So, what Panhel implemented was for each round, based on the percentage of retained girls, the sorority had a MANDATORY amount of girls they had to release.

I think that works on so many levels. One, it doesn't give the PNM's false hope, and it helps give the "lower" tier houses a fighting chance to be competitive. You never know, a second look at XYZ may change a PNM's opinion.

And, Theta still makes quota every year and while the lower tier houses still struggle, I think it does make a difference.

I was just shocked to see how cut throat UGA is! I had no idea that many girls went through! I can only imagine being a pnm. Can anyone explain their process to me?

i'm also interested in UGA recruitment. my younger sister has a couple of friends going there in the fall who may rush. Also, which houses are the ones with high return rates and that have to let the most girls go? are there one or two of these houses or a bunch? i have no idea what it's like to have more than 50 girls rush.

Recruitment release figures (i.e., how many PNMs a chapter must release in each round) are confidential. The numbers are *usually* based on three year averages of returns to the individual chapter.

Well....
 

...I was chatting about the upcoming rush with some of our UGA Gamma Phis and they are expecting 1400 for rush in August:eek:

Only 8 houses made quota after bid day last year!

I cannot confirm, but heard that Phi Mu and ADPi -- perhaps because there are so many of their legacies who attend UGA? -- had to do major cuts last year...

UGA rush is not for the faint of heart!!!

Rush
 

Interesting posts from UGA's rush last year. My friend's sister went through rush there 3 years ago, and she was a triple legacy at a particular house. They cut her, so she dropped out of rush and her mother and two sisters were furious. She had her grades, finances, apperance, personality, etc. I know here at Ole Miss it is the same way. By the way, Ole Miss has the largest Panhellenic based on number students in the USA! It is up to 33% of women are members of a sorority! That is awesome! We don't have nearly as many going through rush, just like 700 is around the average. However, because we only have 9 sororities, our quote is higher, around 85 or 90. This is great because it keeps our houses large and all of the houses average about 180 members. So that is cool. Well, I hope everyone has a great recruitment this FALL 2003!
PS When I went through rush at Ole Miss in 1996, they told us that "rush is not a guaranteed process." What craziness is that!