Re: Snappled, that's right!
 

Seriously, why don't you take your own advice and keep on calling and emailing Snapple and quit antagonizing FHwku simply because he does not hold the same opinion as you on this subject. Maybe he doesn't want to be part of the "we" or the "cause," in either case, it is his right and opinion to choose and say so on either stance.

Frankly, I do feel that it was a good try for him because he isn't backing down to you, and he shouldn't. Because he doesn't want to do something that you are so strongly trying to get everyone to do? Maybe he would rather focus on other things that are more important to him, like risk awareness and hazing seminars, workshops, informative meetings? Maybe he would rather spend his time talking to his chapter about hazing and the dangers it can/will pose instead of trying to get an ad shut down. Maybe he just stated an opinon in the beginning by saying he thought the ad was funny, and maybe that was all he wanted to say and that is as far as he wanted to get involved.

In yet another post you tell him to quit bitching and get up and call Snapple, maybe you should take your own advice there and quit bitching to him. If you truly want to get this ad removed and to have Snapple apologize publicly, maybe you should focus more on the resources you have for that venture instead of arguing back and fourth with a guy on a messageboard because he is opinionized in a manner that you do not agree with.

Maybe he just doesn't agree with you and that matter ends there, or maybe you don't agree with him because he thought the ad was funny.

Well you know what, I thought the ad was damn funny too. We are talking are talking about Snapple juice bottles.
I know I would personally try to focus on things that would actually make a difference in the hazing matter. Those would be some of the things I included in the above paragraph; seminars, workshops, meetings, awareness weeks, etc. To be honest, I look at the shutting down of this ad to be more of a "saving face" kind of thing for greeklife as opposed to actually winning a battle in the all evil hazing war. It is clear that with as many hazing incidents that we hear about today, not all greeks are aware, and not all greeks care to that extent, and not all greeks are trying to better the name of greeklife, and not all greeks are trying to abolish hazing. I'm not saying I'm an avid supporter of hazing, I'm saying that you should take a step back on this, and focus on your goal, rather than bash someone because they don't feel the same way you do.

I caught her drift. Yes, hazing is a serious issue. But, the issue I have with hazing in contrast to other violence is that it is usually voluntary. There are other types of violence that I think are MUCH more serious than hazing, such as domestic violence and rape. Hazees usually put themselves in those situations and many times they can take themselves out. But, the same isn't true for victims of other types of violent crimes. I also agree that this input and dedication should be used on something more alarming.

Please feel free to share with the rest of us these facts, this data and the statistics that represent this claim. It should have been done long ago to sway some people, but until thus is showed, it is merely a claim or an opinion and nothing more.

ok now...
 

You may think what you like, I know the facts about my life
and my organization. Before throwing around accusations or assuming, please do research. I can feel however I want about the ad and I can post it here or anywhere else on greekchat.

Second, I have not been disrecpectful, you have. You ASSumed and made a general statement about my organization, an organization that has worked hard to combat hazing and is doing a great job. We take great steps to prevent it, but seeing as how you know NOTHING about Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority, Incorporated, you wouldn't know that.

http://aka1908.com/akatoday-pol.htm

My statements about the commercial have no connection to my experience in Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority, Inc.
Looking at it from another perspective, seeing the paddling brings back no nasty memories or stories in my mind, therefore I don't have horrible images of it in my mind. The only paddling I know of is from films. No I have no friends who participate in this act and I don't because I don't stoop to that level, and my organization does not abuse women. Those who know anything about NPHC organizations know our stand on this. As for abusing bottles of iced tea, we have never looked into this issue.

Now if everyone here was so for this brotherhood/sisterhood thing, why not simply explain to us who do not uderstand all of this yin-yang about an ad (in a brotherly/sisterly fashion) why they think they need our help. I won't bring this back to my sorority without being convinced, I have not been convinced.
Maybe another sister will be, then you have helped your cause thus further. Instead, I am being further convinced that this is looney.

As I said before, best wishes with your camapign.
I am curious as to the outcome.

Corrections for you....Snappled, that's right.
 

Because...I started this thread and hold this extremely dear to my heart. Same reason that he or you don't stop antagonizing me. I'm pretty sure we're all here for the same reasons, some people just don't know how to express themselves. I have called and emailed Snapple and so have thousands of Greeks and Greek advisors and parents and yes...we're doing something to stop this. If you're not interested in this topic, why post here???? I'm not forcing you or him to do this, I'm asking....read the original thread, I'm asking you to do this...if you don't want to, then move on.

In regards to this quote: "If you truly want to get this ad removed and to have Snapple apologize publicly, maybe you should focus more on the resources you have for that venture instead of arguing back and fourth with a guy on a messageboard because he is opinionized in a manner that you do not agree with."

Instead of assuming....just ask. As I have POLITELY asked, not BASHED Anyone here....please read the hundreds of posts that I have posted and reword your own thoughts. And what am I doing about this besides sitting here bitching????? I'll list for you:

Did my masters thesis on hazing and submitted to my university.
I travel around the nation talking to college students about the harms of hazing and educating them on what hazing is.
I am a Greek advisor and work to educate students on a daily basis.
I read books on a regular basis about hazing and educate myself regularly.
I volunteer with my own sorority to educate students on the effects of hazing on students.
I subscribe to a hazing listserv to educate myself even more.
I attend conferences and workshops on a regular basis to educate myself on hazing.

So....this is my life and my profession, so I have a deep passion for it.


And in response to this comment, "There are other types of violence that I think are MUCH more serious than hazing, such as domestic violence and rape. Hazees usually put themselves in those situations and many times they can take themselves out. But, the same isn't true for victims of other types of violent crimes."

I'm pretty sure that students that joined fraternities or sororities did not ASK to be hazed. I'm sure that these types of hazing are as serious as anything you could have imagined and are very criminal behavior: burying someone alive, playing Russian Roulette with a gun, forcing someone to drink Windex or motor oil, blindfolding someone and dropping them off in the middle of a road to get hit by a car, sleep deprivation to the point of exhaustion, freezing someone, I could go on....these are serious things. More serious than anyone could imagine. Hazing is not just scavenger hunts, non-detrimental paddling, or pledge signature books. It's all of the things I've listed above and more.

I'm trying to educate, which is why I started this thread. No one should bitch at me about a thread that I started...if you don't want to participate, then simply don't. I fully understand that some people are not as educated and don't understand. It's not a matter of agreeing (meaning this is not an example of whether you believe in God or not, or agree with homosexuality or not), it's a matter of legality. Hazing is illegal in 43 states. Check your state laws. Paddling is hazing, hazing is illegal.

So in closing, we should be working toward the same goals, not against them.

If you'd like more statistics on hazing, I suggest you study up on it. Go to http://www.stophazing.org, or read any book by Hank Newer.

Keep calling and emailing Snapple everyone!!!! Great job, I'll keep everyone updated on the progress when it's reported.

p.s. I do know quite a bit about AKA, and their efforts to stop hazing. Thanks for the thoughts ShowStopper, I actually appreciate them and can understand. I took a class that studies the history of NPHC in graduate school.

I sent them a good message, alright!!! :mad:

You all would be sooooo proud! I let them know that I was upset, but I carried myself like a lady. :)

Re: Corrections for you....Snappled, that's right.
 

First, I'm not antagonizing you. You started bitching at FHwku and I came in to basically show you that you went overboard, you even state something to the fact of your thtread to him being a bit harsh or something like that.

Second, I'm still not antagonizing you, I pointed out your flawed argument, don't jump to the defensive. Realize that you may not be right, move on.

Third, I'm asking for paddling related hazing deaths, statistics data, not just hazing data overall, after all you did say or ask rather, "do you know how many men and women have died from paddling?"

If you think that I antagonized you, you have one crazy point of view, I pointed out how you went a bit overboard on a member of the greekchat community, and you tried turning it around on me....no good, won't do...next please....

Thanks SATX for your reply. I'd love to see what you wrote! Way to go!!!

Just a thought...
 

I'm not sure that attacking a Snapple ad is the way to go about it, logically, or morally...although this is just me of course, I don't want to dictate to everyone else, just make my opinion known about it. The thing is, that comedy in it's essence, is based upon that which is offensive. If you see a movie or ad of some one walking through a parking lot, helping an elderly woman with groceries, it won't hold your interest for long. Now add the element of the old lady being chased by an angry rottwieler, and instead of feeling rage for this poor old woman being portrayed in a dangerous or undignified way, it becomes humorous. Watch any funny movie or tv show, and I'm sure you could point out endless situations that would be offensive in real life, but which in the context of fantasy are hilarious. This is what comedy is---permission to laugh at the things that usually trouble us. Has anyone seen the producers? Here is the best example of something negative becoming comedy. In case you don't know the movie(or the recent show version), it deals with a spoof on musical comedies wherein two producers attempt to put on a show that everyone will hate, and decide on the title "Springtime for Hitler", only to find that everyone loves it(??!!). The film abounds with Nazi jokes, and from the point of view this thread takes, one would expect that every jewish person alive would dedicate their lives to obliterating the film from existence. Well, I can tell you that never happened(it's popularity has been enough to facilitate the demand for the current live version on broadway), and furthermore, the script was written by the jewish Mel Brooks, who said, "the best way to attack your greatest enemy is to laugh at it." My point with all of this? Once in awhile, maybe that is best, to allow that release through humor. Honestly, the odds of someone being influenced to revile greek life, or to take up hazing due to one snapple ad are the same that I or you or anyone would be influenced to drop pianos on rabbits after watching a bugs bunny cartoon. That said, you are as always free to continue your crusade if you don't agree. Personally, I have faith that the general public knows the difference between real and fake, and between snapple bottles and people. And if not, well, then I wouldn't really want them involved in my organization anyway. :)

Cloud9- Exactly my opinion but worded better than I could have! :)
People have negative stereotypes. It sucks but it's a reality. I think it's great that you all are so vigilant in trying to change the public's perception on greeks. But, unfortunately, these are opinions that have been around for years and will not change overnight. Especially by going after one company. And especially by going after members of this forum who's opinions are different than your own.

I think that perceptions have been changed.
The proof? The thousands of Greeks that have contacted Snapple and the people at Snapple that have heard the complaints.

nevermind, my comment wasn't worth joining in on this tiring debate, but tri-sigma... don't let anyone get you down... your message is definitely worth the effort to educate those that need it :)

So has anyone gotten a reply back?

Thanks ADPi!!! I appreciate your support.

DZ...well, as of this weekend Snapple has been closed and most of the education and has occurred on Thursday and Friday. I did hear from a few Greek Advisors that Snapple has been very responsive.

If I hear anything on Monday I'll make sure to report it.

Yes, if you had seen a previous post, this individual told me he was a Greek Member and I was an old behind the times Alum!

BS, I am more updated on some of the things that go on than this supposed Greek does!

I do not care about showing Greek Colors on a good ad, but showing a broken paddle, Da!

What else can I say!?

I will not carry that crap in my store and will not promopte it in any way!

While I may only reach 100+ a day, I am open for 6 days a week and I meet one heck oc a lot of PEOPLE!

I will be doing my best!

EX. we ahd a coke machine in our house! They were scerwing us! Told the H Tre. Kick their asses out and go to Pepsi the local vendor! Keep the product in and get more money for teh house!

Da Economics!

If is that companies add, screww them!:)

That is where it hurts!:mad:

TriSigmaTX:

I PM'd you. ;)

Damn, i laughed at that add :D

For the first time, I just saw the ad on tv. It was a still frame, not one of those mini-clips.

I don't know about you, but I found the ad hilarious, never noticed the "NU" pin on the pledge, haha. Well, looks like I have to do some cleaning now:

"I apologize to anyone who has been paddled or knew someone paddled, hazed, harmed, insulted, abused, neglected, or just right out annoyed with anything related to or surrounding the topic of hazing. I do not condone, promote, instigate, or take pleasure in violence against individuals. This is a serious message to anyone who was getting ready to bang at the keyboard and write me a nasty message."

Although, it should be noted that many of you who claim to be combatting these sorts of insensitive jokes about the greek system should really think about the way you handle it. It is ok to laugh at a joke if it's funny.

I know some people will get offended by this, and I'm sorry, but it has to be said.

It's just an ad.

I understand how someone might take this in the wrong light, like many people have. But personally, I thought the ad was funny. And I thought it was funny because I didn't get offended, because I know that my sorority does nothing of this sort.

If you get this easily angered over an ad... Then how are you going to deal with things later in life, that are a lot more significant?

This was not directed at any one individual, but more to everyone; look at the whole picture, not just what's in front of you.

Sincerely~Beth

Bump,

what ever happened to this? did anyone ever hear from the company?

Did anyone see the Subway commercial with the fraternity who was always ordering pizzas?

it's snapple
 

I thought it was pretty funny....messed up? yeah...but pretty funny.I don't drink snapple much anyway, it's too espensive.

I remember the 1993 "Snapple is part of the Klan" conspiracy (people saw the K in the circle and didn't realize it meant Kosher). It was too good for me to boycott then and it's too good for me to boycott now!

I thought it was damned funny. It's JUST AN AD! It doesn't even show real people! It's not as if the bottles were painted in blackface and dressed like Michael Jackson...they were ICED TEA BOTTLES! Chill pills, anyone?

This made me laugh:
"Now, out-for-the-bucks Snapple and their not-so-creative agency Deutsch have a print and billboard poster called "FRAT" depicting two bottles with hair and Delta Omega Delta ball caps looking smug over a prostate pledge. A broken paddle sits nearby and other paddles, all with Greek letters, fill out the picture."

HOW DOES A SNAPPLE BOTTLE LOOK "SMUG"? :confused:

hate to say this but..
 

It's just an ad people! I thought it was kind of funny as well.

:p

Products everywhere and people everywhere will stereotype... are you just going to boycott all those products and people? They don't know any better, and their ignorance shows...

But anyway, I just see it as an advertisement... ::shrugs:: :confused:

So, just wondering, but what ended up happening with Snapple? Did they pull the ad or what?

I did! And I think we should start a letter-writing campaign to boycott Subway! Don't they know that our house cooks make us nutritional meals?? I mean, to insinuate that we are poorly fed and are in need of Jared and his propaganda... it's, well, an outrage!

Okay, so I'm joking. Cool off, people. It's great to have principles... free speech and all that... but lighten up! If you wrote a letter to Snapple: I'm very happy that you expressed your dislike for the ad. I, too, am happy to voice my opinions when offended.

But stop beating people over the head, TriSigmaTX. Your constant need to reiterate how many PMs you've received in support and mentioning of your masters thesis is getting on my nerves! I too have been a national volunteer, spoken to chapters about the dangers of hazing, etc., so don't even begin to quiz me on my convictions. Any by the way, ANSWER THE QUESTION: how many paddling deaths *have* there been??

So go ahead -- start jumping on me now.

SOrry y'all, I ddn't mean to open up new debate, I was just wondering what the final outcome was. If y'all want to debate it though go ahead.

I think the hair-bottle campaign as a whole is over - at least I haven't seen any of the ads in a whille.

Interesting comment, "beating people over the head", boy you don't know me do you?

Anyway....the letter writing campaign apparently did work, the ads have disappeared (whether we did that as Greeks or not, who cares....but it worked).

How many? Too many...the actual total is impossible to count since the US has only started tracking these deaths since 1999. But for your information since 1999 there have been approximately 90 deaths.

90! Can you imagine.....I'm sure some people on Greek Tracker know these people.

That's enough, I stayed off of here for almost a year because of people being bitter and not having intelligent debates. So, there's the number you've been wanting. Why do you want/need a number? And if you need me to back anything up, look up Hank Nuwer. He's amazing.

A strong comment TriSigma, but bravo on caring enough to start something and carrying through. :)