Aw, thanks.

I really wish I understood the whole Dale thing. Is there a thread I can read?

About A&F, the story seems like a joke, and yet there have always been rules for fraternity clothing at UGA. Clinton never would have answered "briefs" had he been a fraternity guy at UGA.*

(*And no, I didn't learn this from close personal experience; I heard my guy friends talking about it.)

Why on earth do southerns connect everything to historic events...Zeta Psi has not had a chapter in Georgia since Sherman blah blah blah.

Who carees? And isn't this style of intake similar to some other men's groups i.e. Delta Tau Delta or someone i.e no pledging?

Understood. Zete only has about 50 chapters, but was founded in 1847. It was the first fraternity to expand to the West Coast and the first to expand to Canada. And I think it is the only fraternity to have had chapters at all the Ivy League schools at the same time.

Not counting the Georgia colony, I think there are only 4 Zete chapters in the South. The chapter at UVa is 139 years old; the one at UNC is 149 years old. Both have always had very good reputations, so far as I know. I think the only other active chapters they have in the South are the one at Va Tech and Tulane, both chartered in the 1970s.

I've never heard of the fraternity, so i'm not passing judgment on the organization. I'm making my comments based on the reasoning for starting the chapter that the students proposed.

Understood, and I would tend to agree, based on the article. I was just providing a little background as to why I said these guys didn't sound like any Zetes I've ever known.

Wasn't Zete the gimps owner in Pulp Fiction.

No lemon pie, that was Zed. Zed's dead.

That was one of the details that made it seem like a satire to me.

If it is a real story on a real colony, they deserved a better article. I'm fine with counter-culture groups, but they shouldn't make them seem like all they care about is Abercrombie and Snoop.

Abercrombie, attempts at Snoop Dog concerts, lame reasons for certain individuals choosing to join, and emphasizing no pledge period doesn't exactly represent the fraternity in the best possible light. Neither did the comment that they encourage everyone to belong to one outside group for the sake of attracting new members. It made them look a little needy, I thought.

Exactly- but more than a little needy.

Georgia has a thriving Greek community with big chapters in all social ranks.

So you would have to be a real douche to not find somewhere that would pledge you.

A&F was not really around in a big way when I was in college, but we most definitely banned certain clothes and other things for our pledges.

It is part of making them understand high school is over and that it is time to grow up and be a man.

And frankly it is usually more of a joke. Any pledge who would seriously be offended or inconvenienced by having to give up the kind of stuff we banned is not the kind of person we would have considered bidding in the first place.

Sadly, some come to college beyond salvation.

As older brothers and sisters are home on breaks, my current student will learn about college life.

Recently, one of my students learned that if you might want to join a fraternity at Georgia, you should avoid wearing cargo shorts. It was funny to me, and yet, the kind of thing that is likely to be very true and likely to surprise the suburban, not-necessarily-native-southern kids I teach.

I've got no problem with cargo shorts myself, and back when I was in school wearing cut-off army pants, which pretty much were the only cargo shorts, probably wouldn't have been criminally un-fratty for some groups although it would have been more common for the alternative, grunge-looking folks. Tighty-whities would have only been for members of the chess club, however.