Good for you roqueemae and Greek Affairs! And good for the regional officer!

Quick follow up. Do you have a sense as to *why* men join this group? Do they truly *understand* that they - the new "members" - are not recognized by HQ? Or do they know and just not care. :confused:

At my school we have two underground chapters, one is recognized by nationals and not by the school, and the other isn't recognized by either. Every year, at the beginning of both semesters, the school puts up flyers in dorms telling guys not to rush them. A couple of my friends are in the fraternity that's not recognized by nationals, and their new members always know that they are basically like a local fraternity. I don't know how much of ritual they've retained, but I was talking to one of their brothers the other night, and he was telling me about their symbols and such, so they do continue to teach the national program, or at least a part of it. The reason that their charter got taken away originally was because of nonpayment of dues, and they've been an underground chapter for about 6 or 7 years now. I think that nationals told them they could get recognition again if they do certain brotherhood programs and pay dues again, it's a question of if they want to do that or not, because regardless of national recognition or not, they still have pretty high numbers.

It may be the college administration isn't aware of this or just doesn't care. I am uncertain what actions an org might take. No idea of what legal action they would take (and against who). I do know that with my org, an underground chapter on campus means we will not allow a legitimate re-charter effort to begin for several years. So undergrounds actually hurt any efforts to have a legit chapter.

Yes, exactly so.

Our National Office has been contacted by people who were 'inducted' into underground chapters wanting to become Life Members. We check our records and since we have no record of them, and since they joined 'underground' chapter, so sorry, but they are not brothers.

(And realize that since these underground chapters were once legit, they probably have ritual books and such, and running these people thru the standard rituals. But since one of the big reasons that chapters get shutdown (in almost any org) is hazing, they are probably engaging in that behavior as well.)

A similiar issue is caused by chapters who fail to send in their paperwork and fees for those they initiate. When you get initiated, you receive (via the chapter, who receives these from National) your membership card and certificate. I've met some actives who seemed to be in this situation. If something were to happen to their chapter (it goes under, whatever), and this situation isn't correct, they too, would not be considered Brothers. We've had articles in our national magazine regarding this, because it, too, is a problem.

If your nationals were to shut down a chapter, wouldn't they take the ritual books along with their charter?

I have no idea what they would take. I've never been involved with such an action. I would think they'd take the charter and ritual books, but as chapters can always order additional sets, they could have extra sets or older editions (we revise them every couple of years), and we might not get them all. No idea if they'd take the chapter scrapbooks/history books, banner(s), etc.

Thank you TSteven for keeping the school and situation relatively anonymous/hypothetical.

It seems like this is more prevalent among fraternities than sororities. I'm sure it happens with sororities, don't get me wrong, but it seems we here about it more with fraternities. Why does everyone think that is?

I know that when a KD house is shut dow (I haven't been part of the process but I know and have spoken to many people that have been), everything is taken by HQ and the House Corp. Usually put in storage, in hopes that the chapter will open again. But i'm sure that all the ritual stuff would be taken... though if a chapter is in a situation to get shut down, it may have a few members that would think nothing of xeroxing the ritual materials

If not xeroxing, writing down from memory what they know. I can think of one National org which has had a hard time reclaiming their possessions from a group. Especially when the group knew that HQ was on its way to collect the items and they hid them. I'm sure there's a point where some ritual may be similar, but has strayed from what it once was. When a chapter closes, it seems like HQ needs the alumnae to be supportive and help reclaim items that rightfully belong to the sorority.

I think they do it for the ladies. Seriously along with the underground org, there is the underground little sister org that should never exist to begin with.

Everytime I see someone on campus wearing certain symbols of this org (colors, etc) I get suspicious. They do not wear outright symbols-letters- on campus. We did walk in on them doing trying to do philanthropy work in the org's name at the campus daycare. That completely threw me for a loop. The dean's son goes there! Why would they do this on campus?

Oh and another thing. I don't think they care about national recognition. They have enough attention locally to satisfy them.

Frankly, I had never heard of an underground inter/national sorority until GC, yet a few scenarios with respect to fraternities.

Fraternities

As I previously noted, my experience with 'underground' fraternity chapters basically meant the men continuing their brotherhood (friendship, wear letters etc.) during the chapter's suspension. They never presented themselves as an active chapter of their organization. And the campus was aware that they were not an official chapter. Now it was speculated that they had "meetings" and frankly, my feeling is they did. (Freedom to associate etc.) And because it was known that they would return the following year, (back in their house etc.) they were able to meet men that they "recruited" (for lack of a better word) by befriending them and who were willing to wait to pledge once the chapter was reinstated.

And in general, a fraternity chapter may have an easier time coming back on campus than a sorority - often due to rumors and perceived reputation etc. As such, if the current members and alumni are intelligent, they will wait and not do anything that would put retuning to campus in jeopardy.

Again, this above scenario is what I always envisioned as an 'underground' chapter. Not some illegitimate group claiming to be an active chapter much less "initiating" "new members".

Now if the scenario is that the chapter may not come back for some time, I can understand why a group might try to take it underground to continue the "brotherhood". What I am dismayed with are those groups (sororities too) that dupe "new members" into thinking they are legit. Along with procedural things that only an active chapter should have the right to do.

Sororities

Now why doesn't this happen with sororities as often? Well as I noted above, I am not familiar with any underground inter/national sorority. And since I am not that familiar with NALFO, NMGC, or NPHC sororities I'll keep my speculation to NPC chapters.

My general speculation is that since NPC chapters have "guidelines" regarding their rush - formal rush at same time, set campus total, set quota, cost of rush etc. - it is a more "open" process. Thus the women going through NPC rush, *know* there are only X number of NPC chapters and their names etc. For example, during formal rush, the PNM visits each NPC house - yada, yada, yada. Thus the PNM may make her choice from that X number of NPC chapters or any other recognized (NALFO, NMGC, NPHC or local) sororities. The point is that if there was an 'underground' sorority (ABC) it would not be part of this process. It should be *known* to any PNMs that if they were to join ABC, it would not be an active chapter of an NPC organization. And as such, I would speculate that the likelihood of being duped - i.e. thinking they are truly joining a recognized NPC inter/national chapter - is low.

Of course that doesn't mean that 'underground' sororities don't exist. I just feel it would be harder to present the group as an active legitimate member of their parent organization. And that the women who join, *know* this and don't care.

And on the flip side regarding returning to campus, when a sorority chapter closes, it seems like it is harder for the chapter to come back anytime soon. Again, often due to true or unfounded rumors and perceived reputation etc. So I could understand *why* a group might want to go 'underground'. Because they most likely won't be back anytime soon etc.

TSteven, I never thought of it that way but you probably have a point as far as sorority formal rush is concerned.

However, I think for males and females the amount of people who "just didn't know" is greatly exaggerated - especially nowadays with the internet and its search capabilities available.

TSteven,

I think that most "undergrounders" (for a lack of a better term) do not think that they will get caught for malicious activity...

I think you've hit the nail on the head for both fraternities and sororities about "initiating new members" that are illegal. It happens in all organizations when there are "cooked books"...

But what happens is that these "new folks" start asking questions about their legitimacy and why they cannot be and how they can become legit and get very frustrated by the one's who misguided them in the first place.

Then, there are worse things that can happen when an "underground chapter" operates--like folks dying during a "hazing offense"...

There is only one widely accepted definition of an underground chapter.

Its is a fully chartered chapter that is not recognized by its host institution.

Its that simple.

Then it isn't an underground chapter. Its an underground local, which is a school's worst nightmare.