Don' t you get it? you will never get a straight an honest answer from a greek in a PUBLIC forum. To whoever said that the priority of Jill should be to focus on his grade, well it never occured to you that it is BECAUSE he is worried about his grades, that he wants to know to the extend of what pledging will destroy his GPA? And that is a reality. That's why you have greeks that change major, defer grade and never graduate, all because of hazing.

what do you want from us??!!

do you want us to come out and say that any fraternity you pledge will beat your ass? that they'll all haze you, make you eat dog shit, dress you up like ugly women and parade you around on campus like prize fucking dolls??!! you won't know until you find out!!! we've TOLD you the truth, we've TOLD you what we know and that's IT! DEAL WITH IT!! we're not out to secretly destroy you *although by now a few of us have probably thought about it* and we're not out to lie to you. look at every other freakin' post on rush, pledging and hazing....there's a pattern there: they all say the SAME THING!!! get over it, stop your bitching and if you want to pledge, pledge. if you can't make it through, drop. if so, great. but don't bother us with this shit.

*disclaimer to any GREEKS out there...sorry for my rant but this was reeeeally bothering me.

------------------
"red is the color of music and has been since the very earliest of times. the caps of faeries and musicians are well-nigh always red."~*~w.b.yeats

"I think that happiness is when you can let yourself feel every emotion you want at any time instead of being a lying little fuck." - Tori Amos

EtienneSAI,
Im sorry you got to the point of frustration that you did. But in a word, sisterfriend...
DITTO!
LOL
Seriously, to all GDI's who claim they know they will get beat down, this is not true. You'd be surprised as to just how many chapters of various orgs have MIP processes.
And secondly, to say that you only want to pledge for the respect is absolutely USELESS. You should go into ANY process knowing that it will be for a reason... correction-- a VALID REASON. It should be a learning process, not 3 months of hell just so that your brothers or sisters will look at you and say "Oh, he/she is cool, they pledged!" PLEASE!!! Don't believe the HYPE!!! Yeah, it's well known that members who don't pledge, don't get much respect. But in the end, it won't reflect negatively on you, but rather on the person throwing shade. Think about it. As 2 human beings, how DARE YOU tell me Im LESS of a person/soror/brother just because I don't live up to your expectations. How dare they disrespect you and all that you do for your org (hopefully, if you're joining the org to do WORK, that is). As a Christian woman, I could never do this to a person just because I knew that they weren't made "the right way".
In a nutshell, yeah, HAZING does happen. But EVERY FRAT or SORORITY will tell you, "YOU ARE A MAN/WOMAN FIRST". Remember that! And realize what it means.
To Icytre: Just a word of caution: Just because someone says "there is a process", That doesnt mean anything. You can go through a "process" of months and months and still be considered PAPER. The question isnt "Is there a process?" but rather, "what kind of process is it?"
And to the unregistered users who asked for the "real deal", and No BS answers, this is as real as it gets. No more, No less.

PEACE: Proper Education Always Corrects Error
SoloRHO

PS: Alpha Phi Alpha Fraternity, Inc.
Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority, Inc.
Kappa Alpha Psi, Fraternity, Inc.
Omega Psi Phi Fraternity, Inc.
Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, Inc.
Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity, Inc.
Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Inc.
& SIGMA GAMMA RHO SORORITY, INC.
are all NON-PLEDGING, NON-HAZING ORGANIZATIONS

No Black Fraternal Organization sanctions hazing...

As a member of ALPHA PHI ALPHA, I would suggest that you not even think of that as an option for yourself...!

We don't sanction that...Although, you will go through a process of some sort...each organization can give you ideas about that...

Good luck in your journey to join a fraternal body...

06 -- to all my Bruhz
Phi-Skee -- to my Sisters

Holla if you hear me,

Ice Cold Kreator
"I love my APHI...I love my APHI...I love my APHIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!"

Alright, here is the deal,

First off, if he doesn't take care of his grades then he will never even make it on line, so when I told him to focus on his grades, I believe that I was telling him correctly.

Secondly to the person who said that "you will never get a straight answer from the greeks on this board" you are correct. There is only so much that can be divuldged, and like I said, processes differ from chapter to chapter. Each chapter has thier own traditions that they uphold.

If I were him, I would not even worry about being beat down, when the time(IF)it comes, then he can deal with that. The most important thing to do is to try to be the type of person that someone would want in thier frat. I don't care how much you want to be in a frat, if they don't want you, then you ain't gon make it in. PERIOD. Focus on your grades, getting to know the brothers of that chapter, and community service.

As far as who pledged harder, who is more a brother. This stuff is not new. All fraternities have been dealing with this issue for many decades now. Brothers from the 80s figure they plegded harder than the 90 brothers, brothers from the 70s think that they pledged harder than the 80s brothers, and so on and so forth. Basically it comes down to a (excuse me for this one ladies) "A dick messuring contest" to see who has the biggest.

"I pledged for 20 weeks," "I pledged for a year" "I went to the hospital", this becomes silly and tiresome.

Look, I came into my fraternity via an Alumni Chapter. Now there is a certain stigma attached to coming in via Alumni. I know my long and rocky journey to Kappa. Do you think for one minute that I would alow someone to question my right to wear these beloved letters. Hell naw, if we gotta argue, trade wood, or fight, so be it.

First off, you must know your shit, secondly you must work you butt of and earn the respect of your brothers. It takes way more than an ass whipping. Any fool can take an ass whipping. But are you willing to work, and get your hands dirty for the frat? That's what brothers look at.

You can do your 4 - 6 week process, and then do nothing for the frat, and brothers will call you a sorry ass frat brother after all the ass whipping that you took.

Ok, I get long winded, basically man, just focus on you, everyone here is going to give you different advice. Work on your grades, knowing the brothers, and community service. Be a good person, it is the best way to ensure that you will be a good frat brother.

Peace and Luv to all

MN

I didn't want to post,cause we've done this hazing topic one to many times. But after reading the orginal post,it left me with a couple of thoughts

If you're truely doing you're research, the first thing you do is check out the offical website of the organization that you're interested in. All of the official websites for the Divine 9 say that they DO NOT HAZE!

So,Jilla82, that should answer one of your questions right there. If the OFFICIAL website says it's a NON-HAZING organization, then it's a NON-HAZING organization plain and simple.

From what I've learned and seen the intake process differs from chapter to chapter, school to school, region to region. The point is you don't know EXACTLY what's going to happen UNTIL you are EXTENDED an invitation to go on that journey.

My final thought is why are you so concerned about hazing in the first place. [Let me make my point first before everybody starts jumping down my back.]
Yes, hazing is a serious issue,but the more important issue is you and your self-worth. Do you think getting beat down is what BGLO's are all about? Is that why you want to "pledge"? Cause you think it will make you a "real man"? I'm not going to go into a long speech about the positive aspects of the Greek System,but let me just say that if you think that getting beat down is all there is to joining a greek organization then maybe this isn't something you should persue at this time

Disclaimer: The views here are strickly my own. I am a non-greek and know nothing about the intake process

Ezactly were are these greeks who never graduate and who have these desperately low GPA's, because the one's I know care more about there grades than most independants I know.

ok,I am so sick of the greeks in here giving these bullshit answers. so, to all of you that are asking the questions of whether or not they still haze and pledge, the answer is YES. Of course they will not dare admit it openly! theyr'e not stupid ok? theyre gonna stick to the script that theyre suppose to recite whenever confronted with this question. I know for a fact that they do. the truth? ha!you'll never get that here some of these people wouldn't know the truth if it came up and slapped them in the face. it makes me sick. they may lie to you, some of you may really believe them but remember they can't lie to themselves. I know what u did on line!

First off I am a Neo so I'm gonna keep it real with you. Everyone is going to tell you that they do not haze, for the record Alpha Phi Alpha Fraternity Incorperated is a non-hazing fraternity. (You will learn how to say that in your sleep) but anyway the real deal is that no frat or sorrority is going to let you skate in. Does that mean that you are going to get sent to the hospital.. no it does not, it just means that members want to see how bad you want it.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble and say, the answer is a resounding NO! There are a few chapters of EVERY fraternity that haze. That is a given. Many probably even don't consider it hazing, but more of a tradition. I know for a fact that if it gets out that an LCA chapter is hazing, they WILL lose thier charter. We had one chapter that lasted only 7.5 years because they hazed, did not follow other rules and barely communicated with HQ. When I say we DO NOT haze, It is the God's honest truth. This forum would be the best place for someone to come in and say what really goes on. It's basically anonymous. So get off it. If you haven't been part of the greek system, you DO NOT KNOW!

------------------
Steve Corbin
Lambda Chi Alpha
Theta Kappa Chapter
Rose-Hulman Inst. of Tech.

My sorority, also, is not only nationally non-hazing, my chapter was also. And that is the truth. If it wasn't, I wouldn't bother posting. I would just not say anything. I think you have every right to be concerned about hazing, as it is a violation of your human dignity.

This does not mean I don't know people who have had to do utterly ridiculous and degrading things to join an organization. Many feel this increases your commitment to the organization. There was a poster (a person who posts, not the big pieces of paper with pictures on them) who said she had to wear depends diapers for 24 hours and not go to the bathroom. I am sorry if I offend, but that is just downright ridiculous. When it comes to true hazing (and I don't mean harmless scavenger hunts and interviews), I would hope you could walk away from an organization that makes such a tasteless joke out of their pledge (new member) period.

LOL, Ice that was very funny. You do learn how to say that in your sleep. It roles off my tongue so naturally.

Corbin Dallas

I think what FinerWoman was trying 2 state was that the term "depledge/depledging" is not a term used by the NPHC orgz, but is borrowed from non-NPHC orgz.

I have heard of a few members (or should I say "former members") of NPHC orgz denouncing their orgz and returning their membership certificates (for WHATEVER excuse), but, 2 my knowledge there is no established process or procedure for this.

DeucePrez
AØA
2-MP-86
Currently-OLA chapter

Mandigo Nupe, Can I get an amen!
Thank you for posting that message.

Respect comes from more than being hazed and taking wood. It is not what you do BEFORE you get into the sorority or fraternity it is what you do AFTER.

[This message has been edited by Moni93 (edited September 05, 2000).]