I think you are kind of contradicting yourself with these 2 statements, but oh well...

It is primarily the schools with large numbers of rushees where so much emphasis is placed on freshman status. It's definitely not like that everywhere. Where I was in school EVERY sorority had junior pledges, and sometimes seniors, every semester. (In this day and age when it can take a while to get out of school, junior doesn't always mean 2 years to go anymore.) It's all about supply and demand. The more people rushing the pickier you can be. I don't agree with it either, but I've never had to fill a 70 person house either, so until I'm in those shoes I'm not going to judge.

I don't see anything wrong with non-trad students pledging. This covers a large range of people - everyone outside the 18-21 fulltime student. One of our sisters was 25 when she pledged and no one thought about it twice. She was just as involved as the actives who were 5-6 years younger than her - she just happened to get to that stage at a different time in life. I seriously doubt that a rash of 40 year old soccer moms is going to storm rush! It's about saying "this is not just for 18 year olds" since that is what some women think.

Wow I totally resent this post. One of my pledge sisters was married and like 23 when we were pledging. She is now our 2nd Vice President and working her way up, and she graduates in a few semesters. Age, marital status, none of that matters. As for traditional greek or whatever u said, thats a bunch of bull cuz there are so many fraternity guys at my college that are older than 24! They are also the most active brothers in their fraternity.

You make excellent points. When I think of sorority formal rush, I do think of the large schools and I'm wrong to think only in those terms. Do they have the same rules for rush in smaller systems? Would a school with, say, just four sororities have the same complex rush rules?
As for non-traditional students, what I meant was that traditional GLOs can absorb non-traditional students in small numbers, but there's a danger in taking too many. My chapter was in danger of turning into a 'veterans' fraternity' after the Korean War. They took some older guys, veterans, and after awhile that was all they had and all they could get. I do believe, very strongly, that everyone who wants the GLO experience should be afforded that opportunity. That's why we have fraternities and sororities chapters that specialize in various ethnic and religious emphasis. I understand there's even a gay fraternity. Fine with me. The more people in the Greek system, the stronger we'll be. But within the systems, the various chapters tend to specialize because people generally want to be around small groups with whom they feel comfortable.

I'm not sure why most women go through Rush, but I know why I did. I wanted to make friends outside of my Freshman hall and the Crew Team. I wanted more female friends. Social acceptance wasn't that important, but maybe it would have been more important if my Rush had not been in February. I didn't Rush with any of my college friends, so it wasn't peer pressure. Also, I really wanted some commonalities with friends from home, who had all rushed their first semesters, and had these amazing bonds. It's just something that's EXPECTED of women where I live.

Seminole,

Who's the Delta Phi Epsilon rep you speak of? I'm a D Phi E, so I wonder who it was you spoke with. You can email it to me if you're more comfortable doing that http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Thanks!

It is you, of course. Your initial message at the top of the thread compelled me to write. Women are looking for the same things today that they looked for 100 years ago. Human Nature has not changed, neither has the attraction of sororities. Friendship, intimacy with people like yourself,a mutual network to nurture and support. Please believe me when I tell you that the surest and fastest course to disaster is to listen to those who tell you that you much "change" your product. Diversity is a word that, like the moon, has a dark side and a bright side. A sorority that embraces a diversity of strengths will succeed. Any fraternal group that embraces a diversity that disregards weakness, that seeks variety simply for the sake of variety without regard for quality simply to make an offering to the diversity god, will fail. if the number of women going through rush is declining even though more women are in school,it is because sororities do not place an emphasis on open rush. Indeed, in most systems, open rush is the mark of a sorority that couldn't make quota. Doesn't have to be that way. Any sorority that is aggressive, and confident, and is allowed to rush and pledge any time will be successful and frighten the competition. Maybe that's the problem: soroities don't think in terms of competition. They create rush rules layered upon rush rules...and then when the process drives away modern women, they ask if they are offering the right product! YES, you are offering the right product. They are not offering it often enough, long enough, and freely enough. I admire your willingness to volunteer for an organization you love. They will benefit from your loyalty and passion. Thanks

Seminole--

So sweet of you with your comments on volunteering. But I truly believed the oath I took about lifelong sisterhood, and not just the four years of college. We aren't trying to necessarily "change" what we're offering, because you're right, those things you mentioned are all important. But 100 years ago, leadership wasn't as important, career networking wasn't as important, and I was wondering how groups go about marketing that along with the lifelong friendships and fun and loyalty and blah blah blah.

Thanks for your response http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Shadokat - My experience has been that rushees (men and women) desire to join "the best group they can find where they feel they have the most friends". That phrase has two emphasis: first, they want the best group they can get into. Second, they want to feel comfortable. Since rush is geared toward making every rushee feel comfortable and befriended, the decision factor is: how good is your sorority? Fifty years ago, maybe that measure, to women, was who had girls on the Homeocming Court, who had the most Little Sisters from the best fraternities, who was the sweetheart of this & that. Today, the standard may be whose alumnae serve as Mayor, who's in law School, who's the President of the Student Body (?). HOWEVER, it is always a mistake to forget that these are 18-19-year-old kids, and they are very interested in each other. Whether it should be or not, fraternities that are successful in giving the impression that they are a conduit to good looking girls will be successful in rush. Sororities have the same dynamic vis-a-vis boys. My experience has been that many, many 18-19-year-olds pledge for the wrong reasons, but once inside they become attuned to the real values of our organizations, and they end up embracing the right virtues. My experience is that the self-confidence of the individual members is the largest determining factor in being able to recruit who the organmization wants, and in sufficient numbers. Fraternities and sororities that find a way to pack their undergrads with confidence and pride in their organizations will be successful, I believe.

PM_Mama00--I have to disagree with your comment that age and marital status do not matter when joining a sorority. There is a big difference in interests, goals, and mindsets of 18-year-old pledges and 25-year-old pledges. Not to mention, someone who is married is in an entirely different frame of mind than a single person. Sorry, age and marital status matter a lot!

This kind of hurts. My house is the only house on campus who has to look for members outside of formal rush, and I absolutely hate that we're branded as a bunch of "losers" because of this simple fact. So what if we're small? I think the only thing that matters is that we're a group of very accepting girls. We really are a family. These were qualities that I was looking for when deciding to rush.

I know you weren't attacking smaller sororities who don't meet quota. I just wish there was a way to show the true side to our sisterhood.



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If the angels up above
Could hear us sing our song to you
They'd see that in our hearts
We're Pi Phi's from the start

You're right, and I apologize. Sometimes I get wound up in the passion of the subject and I am not careful in choosing my words. I do believe that rush restrictions make it very, very difficult for a sorority to grow if they want to. Formal rush is a steep climb. I assume from your signature lines that you are a Pi Phi. It's a wonderful sorority, and they have always been good everywhere I've been.

Thank you for apologizing! I'm sorry as well since I probably was upset over something you didn't mean to be painful. It's something that I'm sensitive to because it's true and the truth hurts! On our campus we have this horrible reputation of being a bunch of "misfits" or that you go to us if you can't get into a sorority. I hate it with a passion, and it's just because we're small. Yes, we're trying to grow, but part of me wonders why. I like being in a small house, and I think things would really change if we grew. Again, thank you for apologizing! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

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If the angels up above
Could hear us sing our song to you
They'd see that in our hearts
We're Pi Phi's from the start

I think Seminole Pike made some great points; especially regarding the FACT that the complicated rush systems in place at most schools are misunderstood/confusin and therefore intimidating. ANY barriers to entry will adversely impact recruitment abilities of the various chapters. However; and this is an ongoing disucssion I've had with my ZTA wife for the last 10 years, we have DEFINATELY seen a move in what college women are looking for in their undergraduate experience - and in some/many cases; sorority chapters have NOT changed their "product." or marketing strategies. While I agree with Sem Pike that chapters need to continue to "market" their social scene with the fraternities (because most women are still interested in that - thank God!) most of the chapters at the numerous schools I visit each year HAVE NOT added the career track emphasis that most of today's femal college students are interested in. Let's face it though, many fraternity chapters haven't either! But for some reason, it has traditionally been viewed (at least in the south) that men join to have fun, and to network/build the resume. And (please don't bite my head off) 15 years ago most women joined to have fun and husband hunt. Well, I think that TODAY men and women join for pretty much the same reasons - fun and network/resume building. There are some chapters (even in the south) that have begun to conduct job skills/interview skills/ job fair type activities along with the "FUN, FRIENDS and FRATERNITY" message. Those that I have direct experience with which have followed that path have enjoyed INCREDIBLE success in Rush - WHEN they advertise it!

My advice - if your chapter wants to improve it's recuitment: try something different, cuz shadokat is right - currently our market share is decreasing. Of course, if the rules aren't changed.......

Brad